Magic in stories

[Agalayth]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
For some reason, I seem to remember Amhrobis being a god?

He's not a god, he's just the oldest Dark Elf that still lives.

[Kalile]

Originally posted by Willow Oran
What are your views/advice on using magic in a fantasy novel?

I used to have half the characters in my stories using it but then I decided I didn't like it and re-constructed things so that magic use was much more limited. How do you all deal with magic in your writings?

Magic in the stories I write and love is limited, though many can use it. It takes the Gift, but you use it like you would a talent for blacksmithing.

How you use "magic" is, you literally pull the energy from yourself and use it. That, of course leaves you exhausted afterwards, and there's only so much you can do with this power. So, people can use it to do whatever, but a warrior mage isn't going to heal real well. He can probe them to find out what's wrong, but isn't able to help much.

[Lief Erikson]

That also is a very clever way of limiting magic . Does it give out room for one person having more power than another, then, or is it centering upon skill? Skill that simply come with practice?

[Willow Oran]

The magic used in my world is limited to specific families. The rulers in my world, the 'gods and goddesses' for lack of a better term are all magical by nature. Many of them have mortal, or partially mortal decendents or creations that can also use those 'magical' abilities associated with the Spirit they are decended from. The strength of their abilities depends on how closely related they are to that Spirit.
For example, one character is a direct biological decendent from two Spirits. Another is a cretional decendent from two Spirits and a biological decendent from another two. The first character has the more powerful magic.
There are quite a few things about this system that still need revising or reconsideration depending on how the story turns out. But that's the nature of these things.

[Kalile]

Originally posted by Lief Erikson
That also is a very clever way of limiting magic . Does it give out room for one person having more power than another, then, or is it centering upon skill? Skill that simply come with practice?

Both. Just as you can increase your wind by running, you increase your ability by using magic, and excercising it like a muscle. Some people just have a lot, and can use it well, as a talent. Also, in a good book, there was a powerful mage sort of like the kind I cobbled together. He could move sections of earth, cast perfect illusions, improve on spells, whatever. But he had to blow out candles, because if he used his magic, the candles would explode.
It all depends on your gift. Like musicians. Some people are good at bass, others at violin.

Kinda complicated, I know.

[Churl]

I would suggest that any system of magic — regardless of its other properties — should be internally consistent. In other words, the use of magic should never feel arbitrary, and it should never introduce plot holes.

Accepting the fantastic is easier when it is rooted in some fixed set of laws that make sense in the context of the story, even if those laws are impossible in reality.

[Lief Erikson]

Yes, that is completely true. The only trouble comes when you don't realize you're going to be writing an extremely long and involved novel, so you don't plan that out before time. In short books, it's not always necessary to explain magic. I wrote one that was completely coherent, 105 pages long, and didn't have much of a system for magic. There were some wizards and enchantresses and a seat of power for these wizards and enchantresses.

I started writing a prequel to that book though, and that's the one I'm writing now. I've decided that that 105 page book didn't happen, because it limits my current work (Which is much better), but now I'm really having to struggle with the source of the magic and its nature. I've got some ideas, but I just need time to sit down, think about them, and work them out. My system isn't yet fleshed out, but there are a few points I have decided upon which are good.

[Churl]

I guess when I say "consistent" and "non-arbitrary," I don't mean to suggest an exhaustively mapped-out system, complete with complex pseudo-physics or (God forbid) George Lucas's ill-advised "midichlorians."

I guess what I mean is an avoidance of situations like this: the characters are confronted with a chasm that can't be physically jumped or bridged, so the wizard teleports them across. Then later, trapped in a prison cell, teleportation isn't even mentioned as an option — why?

In a case like this, I'll buy nearly any reasonable explanation: limited range for the spell's destination, the need for a clear line of sight … anything.

Another alternative, and perhaps more appropriate for some kinds of stories, is an enigmatic kind of magic. The mechanics of this kind of system are left a mystery, and even its wielders might not fully understand it. Again, this might work for some stories but not for others.

Of course, who knows? I'm sure that great stories could be told in which magic was treated as an actual science by the fictional world, or in which characters discover and/or exploit the overlaps between real-world science and magic.

All of these things could work; the goal, as with any other plot device, is not to strain the reader's suspension of disbelief.

(…All merely my humble opinion. I love reading about how all of you approach the writing process, and I never want to imply that my ideas are the only way to do things.)

[Anglorfin]

There are different categories of magic for any story. I will outline what I think to be the main types of magic.

Sorcery - The innate magic. Practicioners are born with certain abilities to manipulate planes of reality, universe, nature, life/death, time, or almost anything else. They spend time in the field honing and sharpening their skills. Once learned, it is never forgotten. Many times sorcery is coupled with summoning, especially in the case of creating the "classic" and all-powerful evil bad guy.

Heroic Magic - I will call it this for lack of a better term right now. Like sorcery, heroic magic is the type that is most usually innate. It is usually unique to one individual in the story. Narration in the story may often deliberately mask the nature of the magic and how it is performed either for the sake of plot developement, to avoid story complexity, or just to make one character stand out above the rest.

Conjuring/Healing/Alchemy - The study magics, these are ones most commonly associated with scrolls or books. Practicioners would spend many hours not only in the field practicing but reading up on old manuscripts and incantations. Usually some skill and practice would be involved in this field.

Spiritual - This is magic I like to think of as being associated with a deity or spirit. By calling their name or carrying an artifact people would be able to invoke an interaction with the deity. Magic here is not controlled by the person, but rather relies totally on the grace of higher beings.

Natural/Driudistic - People in this field may not need to be innately created with any special internal ability, rather their power is drawn from their command and link with Nature, usually by leading a solitary life in the wild. This can also flow easily into the spiritual category, say if there is a god of Nature or some higher spirits that ultimately control nature's blessings.

Summoning - Another magic that ties in with spiritual. Practicioners need not be born with a particular skill (altough they may be). Summoning would be considered a more ritualized or ceremonial form of spiritual magic, usually directly requesting a deity's precense instead of just the benefit of it's graces.



Ultimately I think any magic system created would fall more or less into one of these categories. It is just up to the imagination how to create the specific type of magic you want for the scenarios it will be used in. Like will there be a "college of magic"? I imagine the type of magic you gave an example of to be part sorcery and part spiritual. Where people have the innate ability to call upon the gods. I like what you have

[Gwaimir Windgem]

The kind of magic who gave?

[Anglorfin]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
The kind of magic who gave?

What are you referring to? I'm lost . . .

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I refer to this:

Originally posted by Anglorfin
I imagine the type of magic you gave an example of to be part sorcery and part spiritual. Where people have the innate ability to call upon the gods. I like what you have

By the way, I noticed that sorcery is innate magic. Does someone play DND/DND-based computer games, perhaps?

[Anglorfin]

Yep, a little bit.

btw, explain to me about Shadowbane.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I'm still wondering about who's magic you meant...

Ah, Shadowbane. It rocks. Do you know MMORPGs?

[Anglorfin]

Ohh sorry. I was referring to Willow Oran's system because she is the one that created the thread.

Gwaimir, can you PM me with some details about Shadowbane or a good website or something?