George Orwell

Garina · 05-24-2002, 03:24 AM

I've just finished reading 1984, and I was wondering what other people thought about it. It was very good, but I found the ending quite disturbing.
Anyway, what do you think?

***azalea*** · 05-24-2002, 01:15 PM

I just read it recently and thought it was a very good, albeit disturbing book as well. I actually found Orwell's Animal Farm to be more chilling, though. Have you read it?

sun-star · 05-24-2002, 01:36 PM

I found Animal Farm more disturbing, too, because in a way it was closer to home - 1984 will (hopefully) never happen, while many of the events in Animal Farm have already happened. 1984 is very scary though, and an amazing acheivement.

Blackheart · 05-24-2002, 01:38 PM

4 legs good! 2 legs bad!

Orwell was very good at making people uncomfortable with totilitarian societies. Which is why I find him such a charming author.

1984 could hardly have ended any other way. They couldn't terminate him until he was a loyal member of the party again. To do otherwise only creates martyrs.

No escape of fancy, like Brazil, which I reccomend you watch if 1984 has gotten you down. It should cheer you up a bit. (only a little bit though)

Garina · 05-24-2002, 02:37 PM

Yes, I have read Animal Farm. I wasn't actually as disturbed by that as 1984 though.
Has he written any other books about totalitarianism?

Blackheart · 05-24-2002, 04:06 PM

Orwell died relatively young, he might have written more had he been given a chance.

Here's a pretty good info site http://www.levity.com/corduroy/orwell.htm

***azalea*** · 05-24-2002, 06:21 PM

I think the reason Animal Farm disturbed me more was that the situation there was more treasonous, if you will. The other animals were betrayed by their fellow animals, whereas in 1984 it was a hidden government that just controlled everything...well it's hard to explain, but it was just sadder to me and I can't even talk about the part I really hated, it is so disturbing.
Don't get me wrong, though, 1984 was certainly an awful situation. It was a very well written book, and it's scary to think of having to live like that. I know there's a movie, but I've heard it wasn't very good. Has anyone seen it? The part where they are "caught" and the telescreen is revealed when the picture crashes to the ground would make an excellent movie scene, IMO.
The really sad thing to me is that through the whole book I held out hope that the Revolution was real, and it is such a letdown when that possibility seems dashed.

BeardofPants · 05-24-2002, 06:22 PM

Nah. I was more disturbed by Animal Farm, than by 1984. Big Brother is already here.

That final scene where the pigs are walking around in the house. *shudder*

Azalea, I've seen the movie. I liked it. But then, it had John Hurt in it.

Blackheart · 05-25-2002, 01:10 AM

Bah. Pigs are ok, it's when the Sheep start talking I worry

BeardofPants · 05-25-2002, 01:40 AM

"Four legs good! Two legs bad!" - Guess that makes me better than you.

Better start worrying then, cos this sheep has got lots to say!

Has anyone read his earlier works? I've got a big omnibus of them that are on my "to read" list...

Blackheart · 05-25-2002, 04:45 AM

Coming Up for Air is pretty good, not as good as 1984 and animal farm though. in my opinion.

Carafin · 05-25-2002, 09:58 PM

I just read Animal Farm, it was such a revelation about totalitarianism It was such a realistic portrayal, it just gave me the shivers when I first read it.

***IronParrot*** · 05-27-2002, 12:50 AM

Nineteen Eighty-Four was and remains the bible of modern political science.

FrodoFriend · 05-28-2002, 01:33 AM

1984 is my second favorite book. I liked the movie too, from what I remember of it (it's been a while). The ending was perfect for the book; a bit depressing of course, but right all the same.

***IronParrot*** · 06-03-2002, 12:54 AM

If you liked this book, the movie to watch is Brazil.

cassiopeia · 06-05-2002, 09:05 PM

How about watching Big Brother?

I did read half of 1984, but I then got distracted and stopped. I will read it again when I get the chance.

XRogue · 06-10-2002, 12:10 AM

1984 and Animal Farm are excellent, excellent books. They have been on my "regular re-read" list for years.

Another interesting book is Fatherland, which was written by Robert Harris. (author of Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal) Fatherland speculates on what might have happened if Germany had won WWII. Not, alas, as good as Orwell, but nobody is these days.

Fatherland was also made into a movie, starring Rutger Hauer.

Draken · 06-14-2002, 08:59 AM

Orwell was deeply disappointed by politics of all hues, having renounced a comfortable middle-class colonialist lifestyle, gone to fight in Spain against the Fascists but finding his deadliest enemies there were the dogmatic doublethinking communist and anarchist factions who were supposed to have been on his side. "Homage to Catalonia" tells about it, and if you read that you'll see a lot of what pops up later as fiction in 1984.

He was also a pessimistic sod and was originally going to call it 1948, so near did he think it was. Also I think it was written as a warning, and so COULDN'T have a happy ending really.

Agree that "Brazil" covers the same theme, very differently though and with a wonderful dark humour. Not that it is less depressing, ultimately.

On the plus side, I really think that the more extreme and totalitarian a government is, the more seeds for its own downfall it sows. It might take years or even decades, but they all fall in the end.

FrodoFriend · 06-16-2002, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by XRogue
1984 and Animal Farm are excellent, excellent books. They have been on my "regular re-read" list for years.

Another interesting book is Fatherland, which was written by Robert Harris. (author of Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal) Fatherland speculates on what might have happened if Germany had won WWII. Not, alas, as good as Orwell, but nobody is these days.

Fatherland was also made into a movie, starring Rutger Hauer.

The author of Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal is Thomas Harris. Is he still the same guy who wrote Fatherland?

Jadera · 06-20-2002, 12:55 AM

I just finished reading Animal Farm two days ago. It was on the disturbing side, I found. I have to friends who read it, one of them thought it was funny, and the other thought it was scary. I tend to agree with the scary theory.
Like someone else said, I held hope throughout the enitre story that they would overthrow the pigs and start again.
The most impact part to me was when Napoleaon ordered the 'vet' for poor Boxer...
And yes, the end scene when they couldn't tell the pigs from men was quite alarming.
It was a very well written book, with the subliminal and not-so-subliminal political messages.

Interesting fact though, that while Orwell criticized Communism, he himself was a Socialist.

05-24-2002, 03:24 AM	#1
Garina Elf Lord Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tring, Herts, England Posts: 582	George Orwell I've just finished reading 1984, and I was wondering what other people thought about it. It was very good, but I found the ending quite disturbing. Anyway, what do you think? __________________ Entmoot Resident Bard #2 Wielder of the shiny fire extinguisher Worshipper of the divine cheesecake Hamsters and Rangers everywhere, rejoice!!! Minsc, Baldur's Gate 2 Children, don't take drugs. Become a pop star, then people give them to you for free!!! - Billy Mack, Love Actually. While I'm sure the nice people from the local archery club meant well, a moment's consideration would have made them realise that giving my friend and I lethal weapons was probably not a good idea! Dammit, eyeliner and dreadlocks should not be that sexy!

05-24-2002, 01:36 PM	#3
sun-star Lady of Letters Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Either Oxford or Kent, England Posts: 2,476	I found Animal Farm more disturbing, too, because in a way it was closer to home - 1984 will (hopefully) never happen, while many of the events in Animal Farm have already happened. 1984 is very scary though, and an amazing acheivement. __________________ And all the time the waves, the waves, the waves Chase, intersect and flatten on the sand As they have done for centuries, as they will For centuries to come, when not a soul Is left to picnic on the blazing rocks, When England is not England, when mankind Has blown himself to pieces. Still the sea, Consolingly disastrous, will return While the strange starfish, hugely magnified, Waits in the jewelled basin of a pool.

05-24-2002, 01:38 PM	#4
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	4 legs good! 2 legs bad! Orwell was very good at making people uncomfortable with totilitarian societies. Which is why I find him such a charming author. 1984 could hardly have ended any other way. They couldn't terminate him until he was a loyal member of the party again. To do otherwise only creates martyrs. No escape of fancy, like Brazil, which I reccomend you watch if 1984 has gotten you down. It should cheer you up a bit. (only a little bit though) __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

05-24-2002, 02:37 PM	#5
Garina Elf Lord Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tring, Herts, England Posts: 582	Yes, I have read Animal Farm. I wasn't actually as disturbed by that as 1984 though. Has he written any other books about totalitarianism? __________________ Entmoot Resident Bard #2 Wielder of the shiny fire extinguisher Worshipper of the divine cheesecake Hamsters and Rangers everywhere, rejoice!!! Minsc, Baldur's Gate 2 Children, don't take drugs. Become a pop star, then people give them to you for free!!! - Billy Mack, Love Actually. While I'm sure the nice people from the local archery club meant well, a moment's consideration would have made them realise that giving my friend and I lethal weapons was probably not a good idea! Dammit, eyeliner and dreadlocks should not be that sexy!

05-24-2002, 04:06 PM	#6
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	Orwell died relatively young, he might have written more had he been given a chance. Here's a pretty good info site http://www.levity.com/corduroy/orwell.htm __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

05-24-2002, 01:15 PM	#2
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	I just read it recently and thought it was a very good, albeit disturbing book as well. I actually found Orwell's Animal Farm to be more chilling, though. Have you read it?

05-24-2002, 06:21 PM	#7
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	I think the reason Animal Farm disturbed me more was that the situation there was more treasonous, if you will. The other animals were betrayed by their fellow animals, whereas in 1984 it was a hidden government that just controlled everything...well it's hard to explain, but it was just sadder to me and I can't even talk about the part I really hated, it is so disturbing. Don't get me wrong, though, 1984 was certainly an awful situation. It was a very well written book, and it's scary to think of having to live like that. I know there's a movie, but I've heard it wasn't very good. Has anyone seen it? The part where they are "caught" and the telescreen is revealed when the picture crashes to the ground would make an excellent movie scene, IMO. The really sad thing to me is that through the whole book I held out hope that the Revolution was real, and it is such a letdown when that possibility seems dashed.

05-24-2002, 06:22 PM	#8
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Nah. I was more disturbed by Animal Farm, than by 1984. Big Brother is already here. That final scene where the pigs are walking around in the house. shudder Azalea, I've seen the movie. I liked it. But then, it had John Hurt in it. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords Last edited by BeardofPants : 05-24-2002 at 06:24 PM.

05-25-2002, 01:10 AM	#9
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	Bah. Pigs are ok, it's when the Sheep start talking I worry __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

05-25-2002, 01:40 AM	#10
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	"Four legs good! Two legs bad!" - Guess that makes me better than you. Better start worrying then, cos this sheep has got lots to say! Has anyone read his earlier works? I've got a big omnibus of them that are on my "to read" list... __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords Last edited by BeardofPants : 05-25-2002 at 01:41 AM.

05-25-2002, 04:45 AM	#11
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	Coming Up for Air is pretty good, not as good as 1984 and animal farm though. in my opinion. __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

05-25-2002, 09:58 PM	#12
Carafin Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2002 Location: The warm (or West) coast of Canada Posts: 150	I just read Animal Farm, it was such a revelation about totalitarianism It was such a realistic portrayal, it just gave me the shivers when I first read it. __________________ Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo; a star shines on the hour of our meeting, - LotR (FotR) four be the things I'd be better off without, love, curiousity, freckles, and doubt Queen Guinevere? ... Though all to ruin fell the world, And were dissolved and backward hurled, Unmade into the old abyss, Yet were its making good for this, The dusk, the dawn, the earth, the sea, That Luthien for a time shoud be ~ ~Beren: The Song of Parting

05-27-2002, 12:50 AM	#13
*IronParrot* Fowl Administrator Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Calgary or Edmonton, Canada Posts: 53,420	Nineteen Eighty-Four was and remains the bible of modern political science. __________________ All of IronParrot's posts are guaranteed to be 100% intelligent and/or sarcastic, comprising no genetically modified content and tested on no cute furry little animals unless the SPCA is looking elsewhere. If you observe a failure to uphold this warranty, please contact a forum administrator immediately to receive a full refund on your Entmoot registration. Blog: Nick's Café Canadien

05-28-2002, 01:33 AM	#14
FrodoFriend Halfwitted Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Eryn Vorn Posts: 1,659	1984 is my second favorite book. I liked the movie too, from what I remember of it (it's been a while). The ending was perfect for the book; a bit depressing of course, but right all the same. __________________ Fingolfin lives! ... in my finger! The Crossroads of Arda - Warning. Halfwit content. Not appropriate for people with IQ of over 18. The Fellowship of the Message Board Nyáréonié - The Tale of Tears

06-03-2002, 12:54 AM	#15
*IronParrot* Fowl Administrator Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Calgary or Edmonton, Canada Posts: 53,420	If you liked this book, the movie to watch is Brazil. __________________ All of IronParrot's posts are guaranteed to be 100% intelligent and/or sarcastic, comprising no genetically modified content and tested on no cute furry little animals unless the SPCA is looking elsewhere. If you observe a failure to uphold this warranty, please contact a forum administrator immediately to receive a full refund on your Entmoot registration. Blog: Nick's Café Canadien

06-05-2002, 09:05 PM	#16
cassiopeia Viggoholic Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 1,749	How about watching Big Brother? I did read half of 1984, but I then got distracted and stopped. I will read it again when I get the chance. __________________ Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.

06-10-2002, 12:10 AM	#17
XRogue Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2000 Location: D/FW Texas, USA Posts: 345	1984 and Animal Farm are excellent, excellent books. They have been on my "regular re-read" list for years. Another interesting book is Fatherland, which was written by Robert Harris. (author of Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal) Fatherland speculates on what might have happened if Germany had won WWII. Not, alas, as good as Orwell, but nobody is these days. Fatherland was also made into a movie, starring Rutger Hauer. __________________ Farewell wherever you fare, till your Eyries recieve you at the journey's end.

06-14-2002, 08:59 AM	#18
Draken Elf Lord Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Durham, England Posts: 694	Orwell was deeply disappointed by politics of all hues, having renounced a comfortable middle-class colonialist lifestyle, gone to fight in Spain against the Fascists but finding his deadliest enemies there were the dogmatic doublethinking communist and anarchist factions who were supposed to have been on his side. "Homage to Catalonia" tells about it, and if you read that you'll see a lot of what pops up later as fiction in 1984. He was also a pessimistic sod and was originally going to call it 1948, so near did he think it was. Also I think it was written as a warning, and so COULDN'T have a happy ending really. Agree that "Brazil" covers the same theme, very differently though and with a wonderful dark humour. Not that it is less depressing, ultimately. On the plus side, I really think that the more extreme and totalitarian a government is, the more seeds for its own downfall it sows. It might take years or even decades, but they all fall in the end. __________________ I'm beset by self-doubt ....or am I?

06-20-2002, 12:55 AM	#20
Jadera Elven Warrior Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Somewhere out there Posts: 205	I just finished reading Animal Farm two days ago. It was on the disturbing side, I found. I have to friends who read it, one of them thought it was funny, and the other thought it was scary. I tend to agree with the scary theory. Like someone else said, I held hope throughout the enitre story that they would overthrow the pigs and start again. The most impact part to me was when Napoleaon ordered the 'vet' for poor Boxer... And yes, the end scene when they couldn't tell the pigs from men was quite alarming. It was a very well written book, with the subliminal and not-so-subliminal political messages. Interesting fact though, that while Orwell criticized Communism, he himself was a Socialist. __________________ Whaaaaaaaaaat?? ~Chivalry isn't dead, it just transferred to women~

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