Sauron's Palantir

Finglas · 11-07-2001, 08:43 PM

In The Two Towers, when Frodo and Sam have caught Gollum, Gollum contends with Sauron telling him to stop looking at him. It seems odd that Sauron could be looking at Gollum (using a palantir I supose) yet not notice the two hobbits who are with him. Had Sauron defiled his Palantir so that it could only see his servants, or is this kind of tunnel vision charicteristic of all of the Palantiri?

easterlinge · 11-08-2001, 01:02 AM

At some time, Gollum was captured and brought before Sauron, then let go (why is something I mean to ask, though? Why let him go at all?)

When Frodo and Sam captured him, Gollum sort of relived the experience, remembering whatever it was Sauron did to him. I don't think Sauron was looking at him with the palantir, it's all in Gollum's head.

BUt why was Gollum released at all from Mordor?

ryan · 11-08-2001, 03:42 AM

Did anyone see the simpsons halloween last night? The thing bart made out of the frog in the harry-potter sequence looked kind of like gollum. Perhaps Burns was meant to be sauruman? Or sauron! Perhaps a mix of the both?

Telchar · 11-08-2001, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by easterlinge
BUt why was Gollum released at all from Mordor?

Probably because Sauron knew that the ring had effected him for so long so he, Gollum, would be more worth for him, Sauron, alive, because he would search for the Ring. And if he found it it would be an easy task to take it from him, atleast that might be what Sauron thought..

Finglas · 11-08-2001, 05:53 PM

Thanks easterlinge. That makes a lot more sense than what I was thinking! As for the new question about why Gollum was released, I agree with Telchar. Sauron knew that the ring would be easier taken from one of his servants than from an enemy. Knowing that Gollum would try to find the ring if he could, Sauron released him.

From what I have heard, vol. 6-9 of HoME might have some info on this, but I haven't read them yet

Wayfarer · 11-08-2001, 05:58 PM

Sauron's palintir was the palintir of minas ith... what? that wasn't your question?

Never mind.

Finglas · 11-08-2001, 06:09 PM

Don't worry Wayfarer; I never do.

Wayfarer · 11-08-2001, 06:15 PM

Heheh

For some reason I assumed that would be what you wanted to know. Permit me some self depreciating humor.

KingElessar8 · 11-10-2001, 05:14 AM

Frodo was able to "feel" the Eye of Sauron more and more the closer he drew to Mordor. Gollum having borne the Ring for so much longer than Frodo probably experienced the same sort of thing, even without actually being in possesion of the Ring. The "eye" was a sort of complusion to him, and he wanted to be free of it, just as a part of him wanted to be free of the Ring - the Ring and the Eye are very linked, after all. I dont believe there is any way that Sauron was actually looking at Smeagol - likely he would have had him captured if he had known he was near his realm.

Kirinki54 · 11-11-2001, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KingElessar8
I dont believe there is any way that Sauron was actually looking at Smeagol - likely he would have had him captured if he had known he was near his realm.

I think so too.

Nice to see you here, King Elessar!!

KingElessar8 · 11-11-2001, 12:49 PM

Thanks!

easterlinge · 11-11-2001, 09:22 PM

But how was Sauron planning to recover the Ring from Gollum? Strider, Thranduil's Mirkwooders, Faramir's Rangers and the Orcish Trackers of the Morgai had a devil of a time tracking him down.

Nobody got him, except Strider!!

I've got this strange image of an enraged Sauron receiving negative reports from all his trackers.

Kirinki54 · 11-12-2001, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by easterlinge
But how was Sauron planning to recover the Ring from Gollum? Strider, Thranduil's Mirkwooders, Faramir's Rangers and the Orcish Trackers of the Morgai had a devil of a time tracking him down.

Nobody got him, except Strider!!

I've got this strange image of an enraged Sauron receiving negative reports from all his trackers.

IMO, if Gollum had got hold of the Ring and claimed it, Sauron would have been instantly alerted. He would have sent his Nazgul to swoop the Ring up in a blink! Gollum´s case was indeed a hopeless one...

KingElessar8 · 11-13-2001, 02:56 PM

I always felt that if Gollum had recovered the Ring, he would have ended up taking the Ring to Sauron. Not by his own volition. The power the Ring had over him would have been nearly total, he would have been in the vicinity of Mordor, and Sauron was trying to draw all evil things (not to mention the Ring) to him. I think invariably, Gollum would have been drawn to the Barad-Dur, and finally caught by Saurons servants.

11-07-2001, 08:43 PM	#1
Finglas Enting Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: here, there, everywhere Posts: 88	Sauron's Palantir In The Two Towers, when Frodo and Sam have caught Gollum, Gollum contends with Sauron telling him to stop looking at him. It seems odd that Sauron could be looking at Gollum (using a palantir I supose) yet not notice the two hobbits who are with him. Had Sauron defiled his Palantir so that it could only see his servants, or is this kind of tunnel vision charicteristic of all of the Palantiri?

11-08-2001, 03:42 AM	#3
ryan t2t relic Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Bay Area, California Posts: 531	Did anyone see the simpsons halloween last night? The thing bart made out of the frog in the harry-potter sequence looked kind of like gollum. Perhaps Burns was meant to be sauruman? Or sauron! Perhaps a mix of the both? __________________ "And the Lord spoke, "Send me your money, Empty thine wallets into my pockets my pockets, the pockets of Ryan, Ryan, he who will deliver the money unto me. Then you will truley be happy." And the people followed, and all was well." --Ryan 62:33

11-08-2001, 05:53 PM	#5
Finglas Enting Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: here, there, everywhere Posts: 88	Thanks easterlinge. That makes a lot more sense than what I was thinking! As for the new question about why Gollum was released, I agree with Telchar. Sauron knew that the ring would be easier taken from one of his servants than from an enemy. Knowing that Gollum would try to find the ring if he could, Sauron released him. From what I have heard, vol. 6-9 of HoME might have some info on this, but I haven't read them yet Last edited by Finglas : 11-08-2001 at 06:06 PM.

11-08-2001, 05:58 PM	#6
Wayfarer The Insufferable Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,333	Sauron's palintir was the palintir of minas ith... what? that wasn't your question? Never mind. __________________ Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned

11-08-2001, 06:15 PM	#8
Wayfarer The Insufferable Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,333	Heheh For some reason I assumed that would be what you wanted to know. Permit me some self depreciating humor. __________________ Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned

11-08-2001, 01:02 AM	#2
easterlinge Elven Warrior Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Farthest Khand, the darkest East... Posts: 442	At some time, Gollum was captured and brought before Sauron, then let go (why is something I mean to ask, though? Why let him go at all?) When Frodo and Sam captured him, Gollum sort of relived the experience, remembering whatever it was Sauron did to him. I don't think Sauron was looking at him with the palantir, it's all in Gollum's head. BUt why was Gollum released at all from Mordor?

11-08-2001, 06:09 PM	#7
Finglas Enting Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: here, there, everywhere Posts: 88	Don't worry Wayfarer; I never do.

11-10-2001, 05:14 AM	#9
KingElessar8 Hobbit Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 15	Frodo was able to "feel" the Eye of Sauron more and more the closer he drew to Mordor. Gollum having borne the Ring for so much longer than Frodo probably experienced the same sort of thing, even without actually being in possesion of the Ring. The "eye" was a sort of complusion to him, and he wanted to be free of it, just as a part of him wanted to be free of the Ring - the Ring and the Eye are very linked, after all. I dont believe there is any way that Sauron was actually looking at Smeagol - likely he would have had him captured if he had known he was near his realm.

11-11-2001, 12:49 PM	#11
KingElessar8 Hobbit Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 15	Thanks!

11-11-2001, 09:22 PM	#12
easterlinge Elven Warrior Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Farthest Khand, the darkest East... Posts: 442	But how was Sauron planning to recover the Ring from Gollum? Strider, Thranduil's Mirkwooders, Faramir's Rangers and the Orcish Trackers of the Morgai had a devil of a time tracking him down. Nobody got him, except Strider!! I've got this strange image of an enraged Sauron receiving negative reports from all his trackers. Last edited by easterlinge : 11-11-2001 at 10:27 PM.

11-13-2001, 02:56 PM	#14
KingElessar8 Hobbit Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 15	I always felt that if Gollum had recovered the Ring, he would have ended up taking the Ring to Sauron. Not by his own volition. The power the Ring had over him would have been nearly total, he would have been in the vicinity of Mordor, and Sauron was trying to draw all evil things (not to mention the Ring) to him. I think invariably, Gollum would have been drawn to the Barad-Dur, and finally caught by Saurons servants.

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