What if you owned your own country...?

[Lotesse]

Gwai's country sounds sort of cool, but I don't know how I'd feel about being a citizen of Damned If I Know. And the religion thing, eh.. But I absolutely love the sound of Isla Rana. Now, that would be a country I could so dig on living in, most definitely. I need to go back & read up on everyone else's countries, just responding on this page's entries. Of course, I did read up on Lief's terrifying country, and holy mother of scary ideas! will most definitely be avoiding going anywhere near that border... One of these days, when I've got the time, I'd love to fill this one out & describe what my country would be like. I so rarely go online any more, haven't had the time...

But, yeah, Isla Rana... I want to visit that one, at the very least. So awesome...

[Earniel]

I'm sure I can get you a tourist visum.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Isla Rana sounds good, but I really don't think the drinking age and driving age being the same is a good idea at all...

[Earniel]

It works over here. Well, 'works' is perhaps too big a word...

Besides, I'm pretty sure that the minimum age for alcohol is sadly enough an empty formality for the majority of today's teenagers, regardless of whether it's higher or lower than the driving age.

[Meriadoc Brandybuck]

Originally Posted by HOBBIT

If there are examples of "Islamists" getting "whatever they want" in public schools in the United States, I don't see how that wouldn't be fit to discuss in this topic. If you feel that way, can you post it in a more fit topic? Maybe the Muslims one?

I'm curious to see what you mean.

I'll just do it here.
The University of Michigan is installing foot-washing stations for Muslims that will be payed for by the people of Michigan, i.e., taxes. And I think there's another school that lets Muslim student take time out of school so they can pray.

[Lotesse]

And? So? How many activities and preferences belonging to the religions of Christianity and Judaism have been sanctioned, supported and paid for by tax-paying citizens of the United States, over the history of our country? A hell of a lot, that's how many. Why should Muslims have to be excluded?

[Meriadoc Brandybuck]

Originally Posted by Lotesse

And? So? How many activities and preferences belonging to the religions of Christianity and Judaism have been sanctioned, supported and paid for by tax-paying citizens of the United States, over the history of our country? A hell of a lot, that's how many. Why should Muslims have to be excluded?

I'm not an expert on this subject in particular, so I can't really answer your questions. But actually, as far as the Muslims being allowed to pray in public school, why can't Christians, etc.? That's what confuses me.

Anyway, as far as public schools go in my un-named country, you pray, like, in the morning before class starts, if you want to, whatever type of prayer you want.

[HOBBIT]

In the Muslim religion they have to pray 5 times a day - that is part of their religion. It makes sense that some schools would let them get of class to go pray. They have to do it during certain times of the day too, I'm pretty sure. Christians don't have to pray a set number of times a day or during certain times.

Christians can pray all they want in public schools. That isn't illegal at all. Perfectly legal and I'm sure that many do. What is illegal is public school sanctioned prayer - ie prayer led by or endorsed by teachers.

You can't lead a class in prayer or have the whole class pray.

It makes sense that that is in Michigan, that state has the most Muslims I think. Most densely populated with them.

Christians and Jews have always been accomodated. I don't see the difference.
---
In your country what if you don't want to pray?

[Lotesse]

Originally Posted by HOBBIT

You can't lead a class in prayer or have the whole class pray.

I know, not now, not any longer, but up until only very recently we did pray in class, in public school. Well, I'm in my thirties now, so public school days for me was the seventies and eighties, but we sure had Christian prayer in school back then. I am not sure when the legislation went through that outlawed this practice; must've been sometime within the last 15-20 some-ought years...

Originally Posted by HOBBIT

Christians and Jews have always been accomodated. I don't see the difference.

I know, me neither. Religion is religion; why play favourites?

[Meriadoc Brandybuck]

Originally Posted by HOBBIT

In your country what if you don't want to pray?

Then you don't have to.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally Posted by HOBBIT

They have to do it during certain times of the day too, I'm pretty sure.

Indeed, and that's what makes it commendable for a uni to let them out to do so. I do wonder, if a student wanted to go to daily Mass, and mass time conflicted with his class schedule, what would be the policy?

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

Indeed, and that's what makes it commendable for a uni to let them out to do so. I do wonder, if a student wanted to go to daily Mass, and mass time conflicted with his class schedule, what would be the policy?

As it's not a requirement for Catholics to go to daily mass, I would see no reason for them to move the schedule unless it were a specifically Catholic college. I believe that reflects the current policies, although I admit I don't know the specific policy for my own school

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

in england a lot of schools even those that are VC still have all kids, regardless of religion, 'pray' in assemblies, although it is losing ground so far as i know

[Gwaimir Windgem]

The requirement for prayer at specific times is not stringently observed; as I understand it, it is permissible to make up missed prayers at night, so that a Muslim does not HAVE to be out of class at that time in order to practice his religion. Nevertheless, I think it is right that he should be so, and similarly for the Catholic going to daily Mass, or other religious observances at set times (I can't really think of any others that one is liable to come across often; few Protestants and Orthodox have the Eucharist on a daily basis, etc.)

[sisterandcousinandaunt]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

The requirement for prayer at specific times is not stringently observed; as I understand it, it is permissible to make up missed prayers at night, so that a Muslim does not HAVE to be out of class at that time in order to practice his religion. Nevertheless, I think it is right that he should be so, and similarly for the Catholic going to daily Mass, or other religious observances at set times (I can't really think of any others that one is liable to come across often; few Protestants and Orthodox have the Eucharist on a daily basis, etc.)

Can I have my religious holidays off, please?

I assure you, it's essential.

[trolls' bane]

Originally Posted by sisterandcousinandaunt

Can I have my religious holidays off, please?

I assure you, it's essential.

I'm part Christian and part Jewish, and I've got some Muslim and Hindi in me. Can I have them all off? Please? You don't want me going to hell, now do you?

[GrayMouser]

Okay, I was going to do the liberal/libertarian thing, but what the heck, let's go for a Republic of Virtue.

1 - What would you make the legal drinking age? 17
2 - Driving age? 17 with restrictions- daylight, adult supervision etc (more lenient for rural areas) . Motorcycle restriction 250cc till 19. Less of a problem because 17 and 18 year olds are doing mandatory national service (see below)
3 - Age of sexual consent? 16, with Romeo/Juliet provisions
4 - Voting age? 19, after completion of national service
5 - At what age would someone become an adult (free from parental control)?
17, but Mom and Dad could rat on them if they misbehaved while on leave.

6 - What types of recreational drugs (if any) would be legal?
- Pot yes, but potency restricted
- Tobacco yes, subject to bans in non-open public places and business
-
- Alcohol yes
- LSD, mescaline, mushroomsyes, but subject to psychiatric testing and controlled situations (taking the fun out)
- Caffeine Gawd, yes!
- Heroin, Cocaine, meth etc Banned, but if someone gets hooked, controlled access under supervision
-

7 - Can people have guns? (if so - who and what kind?) Swiss-type militia with AK-47s under every bed. Long guns yes, handguns no

8 - What would be the name of your country? Utopia, of course

9 - Would you have the death penalty? no

10 - What would be the speed limit? Dunno. Cars would be heavily regulated, with fuel-efficiency foremost and lots of public transport. Sorry, no Maseratis


11 - What types of religions would be permitted or restricted? All religions permitted, but since equality of the sexes is one of our founding tenets, partriarchal (or matriarchal, should they arise) religions will have to conform to the Constitution in their actions- they can believe whatever they want.

Which of the following would be legal:
12 - Porn? yes
13 - Prostitution? yes, but regulated- no streetwalkers or pimps
14 - Polygamy? yes
15 - Homosexuality? yes
16 - Stem cell research? yes
17 - Human Cloning? tissues and organs, not people
18 - Cock Fighting? no- all cruel to animal sports will be banned, as will fur
19 - Slavery? no
20 - Hunting? meat or pest control, no trophies
21 - Fishing? yes
22 - Eating meat? yes, but no factory farming, or hormones(including imports). Meat will be more expensive and less a part of the diet
23 - Littering? strict environmental laws
24 - Unisex bathrooms?
25 - Suicide? your body, your life
26 - Gay marriage? marriage will be a civil ceremony involving two or more consenting adults
27 - Abortion? yes

28 - What types of sexual activity (if any) would be illegal? nothing involving one or more consenting adults. So no pedophilia, necrophilia, or bestiality
29 - Would your county be clothing optional or clothing mandatory? mandatory in public-same laws for men and women (the female breast is not obscene), but nude beaches and parks
30 - Would you have obscenity laws? If so - how would you define "obscene".no

31 - What system would you set up for collecting taxes?
- Income tax? (how much?) strongly progressive with minimum income guarantee to everyone, though you'd have to do public work or have good reason why not. Heavy estate tax- No Paris Hiltons
- Sales tax? (how much?) 15 percent with food and clothing exception
- Import/Export tax? (how much?) no

32 - What criteria would someone need to pass to become a citizen? citizenship test, five years residence, no serious criminal record
33 - What types of people would you allow (or not allow) into your country?

34 - What type of government would you establish? parliamentary democracy with a written constitution with very strong guarantees on civil rights
35 - To what degree would your government be allowed to censor or restrict the media?
not at all

36 - Aside from laws - what sort of unofficial (and unenforced) cultural rules and traditions would you like to establish? For example - taking shoes off before entering someone's home. Or not eating with the left hand.

Strong bias toward sexual equality. Men expected to do their share of housework; lots of part-time jobs for women with children, as well as government day-care.

De-emphasize material wealth. Ostentatious displays of luxury- cars, houses, yachts- generally looked down upon (and heavily-taxed ).

More emphasis on leisure- mandatory 5-6 week vacations; people who devote themselves to their jobs (for money, rather than interest) are pitied. Social status for community service- including politics and defense- and personal talents. Ideal citizen is someone who does an honest job, takes active part in society and develops diverse interests.

Public education is compulsory until 17, and private schools are banned, though of course you can send your kid to whatever class you want after school or weekends.

After graduation all 17-year-olds must do two years of national service, split between military training and community activity. The first year involves public construction and environmental work; the second involves service to others- the elderly, shut-ins, handicapped, and children.
As well, training in life-skills are given. Driving, first-aid, cooking and domestic chores, child-care, mechanical, technical and construction skills are taught, equally for boys and girls of course. The idea is to produce self-reliant well-rounded citizens. Civics courses are also included, in which the future citizens are encouraged in critical thinking.

(One of the problems in this society is a tendency toward conformity and complacency enforced by social norms.)

After this the newly-enfranchised citizens receive a 'social credit' for their service- they can either enroll in higher education, do a technical/vocational program oriented towards trades such as plumbing, electronics, medicine, or law, start a business, or put a payment on a house.

[GrayMouser]

double post

[Lief Erikson]

Originally Posted by GrayMouser

31 - What system would you set up for collecting taxes?
- Income tax? (how much?) strongly progressive with minimum income guarantee to everyone, though you'd have to do public work or have good reason why not. Heavy estate tax- No Paris Hiltons

You know, if it's quite stronly progressive, you'll greatly reduce the motivation for people to seek high skill jobs. High skill jobs are also usually higher wage, so the two go hand in hand.

[brownjenkins]

I disagree. People will always seek positions where they can make more money. It doesn't matter how much more, just that it is more.