America the Proud?

[Sister Golden Hair]

Have you ever lived anywhere else? Do you have anything to compare how bad you have it in the US first hand?

Be careful what you wish for. Wishes can come true.

[HOBBIT]

OrnelÃ*rë Mistë :
Ok, move to Canada or Mexico (live in some rainforest naked, i dont care). See how much more rights as a minor you would have... Or move to Europe when you are old enough if you love it much more.

I wonder how long it would take for you to come crawling back to the us.

Minors don't get a lot of say in any government. That is a silly reason not to have pride in your country - especially one like the usa.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Well said, Tristan.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by OrnelÃ*rë Mistë
Proud? Proud!?I'm not in the least bit proud of my country. As a minor, I have no say in this government. If it were up to me, there would be a great woodlands with people living there, in the wild. Many of them with just a backpack of stuff. I'd be among them. I don't like saying I'm American. I like saying I have English ancestors, and Italian, German, and Irish. I'd move if I could.

Europe has less woodland than us - but I guess you have never been outside the country. It's great that we have a democracy - that way the utopian dreamers like you don't bring us back to the stone age.

I think people are proud of our democracy. It was the first modern one, it is commendable- but do not let us forget the blood shed by us. Let us not fail to realise other governments established in Europe which are more efficient. I'm all for socialism, but that wouldn't work here.

How are they more efficient? Do you know anything really about them? Have lived under their governments? Do you know how much trouble Germany is in with unemployment and stuff right now? Do you know that countries are less likely to hire there than in the US because of all the employee benefits they have to pay and all the regulations?

EDIT: what sense of nations and borders and patriotism? we are all human, we might take pride in our collective whole and learn from our collective mistakes. i understand the desire to be recognized in a group- I do desire this. if only this could be without a lack of faith in humanity.

yeah - I'm sure you care just as much for some stranger in another state as you do your mother and father too.

By the way - I was just curious - where would you put the factory to make your backpack? Also - where would the houses be? I mean - literally speaking - we have to build SOMEWHERE.

[sun-star]

Originally posted by Ruinel
I don't mean to rain on your parade, but wasn't King Charles I beheaded? I'm not really familiar with your history so I'm not sure.

I was hoping no one would notice I said that before I had a chance to come and fix it! You are absolutely right. Blame it on back-to-school brain overload on my part, but I totally forgot a key part of that British history I claim to be so proud of. History's actually my best subject - honest!

Originally posted by jerseydevil
As for Sun-Stars patriotism comment - seems like that was a crack at Americans.

Not every comment in favour of another country is a criticism of the US, jerseydevil. I wasn't talking about America, I was talking specifically and exclusively about Britain. I was saying "this is how it is in Britain and I like it". You say "it's different in the US, and I like that better". Fine. It doesn't have to be a confrontation all the time.

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by sun-star
I was hoping no one would notice I said that before I had a chance to come and fix it! You are absolutely right....

That's quite alright. History was/is actually my worst subject. I just couldn't stay awake during all those dates and names.
Flashback to studying history: *reads:* "...the American Civil War started on April 12, 1861 at the bombing of Fort Sumter...."
wimper *
... eyes glaze over... eye lids droop...* (-.-) zzzzzzzzzz *face falls flat into history book*

[Sheeana]

LOL! I really love it how they tell you the same frellin' stuff EVERY bloody year! (nothing worse than NZ history, I tell you - especially since there's only a 150 years or so of it!!)

[HOBBIT]

Originally posted by Ruinel
That's quite alright. History was/is actually my worst subject. I just couldn't stay awake during all those dates and names.
Flashback to studying history: *reads:* "...the American Civil War started on April 12, 1861 at the bombing of Fort Sumter...."
wimper *
... eyes glaze over... eye lids droop...* (-.-) zzzzzzzzzz *face falls flat into history book*

oh really, why? History is one of my favorite and best subjects.

[Ornelírë Mistë]

Originally posted by HOBBIT
OrnelÃ*rë Mistë :
Ok, move to Canada or Mexico (live in some rainforest naked, i dont care). See how much more rights as a minor you would have... Or move to Europe when you are old enough if you love it much more.

I wonder how long it would take for you to come crawling back to the us.

Minors don't get a lot of say in any government. That is a silly reason not to have pride in your country - especially one like the usa.

I plan to move. I would not come crawling back. I didn't say I disliked the gov't because I currently have no say. it is good minors have no say in many ways. I was stating that for other reasons.

Jerseydevil:
Europe has less woodland than us - but I guess you have never been outside the country. It's great that we have a democracy - that way the utopian dreamers like you don't bring us back to the stone age.
I wouldn't just go out and live in the woods. I'd die, and I love the city. Suburbs I can't take. Yes, you ignoramus, people can love the forest and cities. I am not a utopian dreamer. You can not say that about someone you don't know, based on a few sentences. The Stone Age? I wouldnt make anyone live there. I never said I wish we were all back there or anything. If you're implying that if I were to govern the country, I wouldnt do that. I wouldnt govern the country either.
I have been outside the country, to Europe in fact. All over France: Paris, Nice, Honfleur, Honjee (sp?), Chartres, Beaune. I've been to Italy, to Rome, Florence, Siena, and Venice. I went to Germany, in Frankfurt.

yeah - I'm sure you care just as much for some stranger in another state as you do your mother and father too.

By the way - I was just curious - where would you put the factory to make your backpack? Also - where would the houses be? I mean - literally speaking - we have to build SOMEWHERE.
I do so care. People can genuinely care for others, it's called loving-kindness. I think you dislike your parents, and I think care about few people other than yourself.
Just because I didn't mention buildings doesn't mean there'd be none anywhere. I would not buy a commercial backpack. Ideally, I'd have one made of strong fabric to suit my needs. I would be one of a few people who just happen to live in the forest. I don't see why you should criticize a bizarre fantasy you have heard little off. You always take everything as an attack, don't you!

How are they more efficient? Do you know anything really about them? Have lived under their governments? Do you know how much trouble Germany is in with unemployment and stuff right now? Do you know that countries are less likely to hire there than in the US because of all the employee benefits they have to pay and all the regulations?
I know more about them than you think I do. There is no avoiding problems in a nation.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by OrnelÃ*rë Mistë
I think you dislike your parents, and I think care about few people other than yourself.

You have A LOT of growing up to do.

Just because I didn't mention buildings doesn't mean there'd be none anywhere. I would not buy a commercial backpack. Ideally, I'd have one made of strong fabric to suit my needs. I would be one of a few people who just happen to live in the forest. I don't see why you should criticize a bizarre fantasy you have heard little off. You always take everything as an attack, don't you!

Where would I think you were attacking me with that - although in various posts you have. It seems you live in a fanatasy world. You seem very ignorant about history and politics - but yet have a lot to say.

I know more about them than you think I do. There is no avoiding problems in a nation.

So then - why do you think they're better than us? You seem to think they can have all these benefits and it doesn't cost anything.

Elighten me in your thoughts beside making ignorant statements such as - "I think you dislike your parents, and I think care about few people other than yourself. "

[Ornelírë Mistë]

National health care costs a lot. Never implied it didn't, everything takes money. They pay more taxes, yet do not have to pay separate health bills. Let me remind you that I am not an adult, so saying I need to grow up is nothing I don't already know. Nothing is more immature that insulting someone's dreams, no matter how pathetic, for no reason. Go ahead and tell me they're stupid, but a tactful way would be more reasonable. As for history, I think I know a good amount for someone my grade level. And I'm willing to learn more, so I shall, and that goes for politics too. You assume I do not know many things I do not include in my political posts, often I leave them out because there is no reason to mention them or that they are too obvious. You claim I live in a fantasy world, but if I do I shall certainly come out of it. I get school work done, I have a social life, I have outside interests, I have goals. I can be imaginative in my idle day dreams and in the real world. There is nothing wrong in seeing the world as it could be, for I realize that I can't (and don't want to) change the world into it.
So then - why do you think they're better than us?
They aren't necessarily, but based your many posts it seems you think we are better than them. I'd love to hear your argument

[GrayMouser]

Originally posted by Sheeana
LOL! I really love it how they tell you the same frellin' stuff EVERY bloody year! (nothing worse than NZ history, I tell you - especially since there's only a 150 years or so of it!!)

You want they should change it every year?

"Last year we told you New Zealand was first settled by the Maoris, this year we're bringing in six Eskimos on an ice floe, and next year we hope to be able to get a bunch of exiled Numenorians ."

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by OrnelÃ*rë Mistë
National health care costs a lot. Never implied it didn't, everything takes money. They pay more taxes, yet do not have to pay separate health bills.

So? I don't want the government managing my health care - it end up into a fiasco just like Social Security.

Let me remind you that I am not an adult, so saying I need to grow up is nothing I don't already know.

Well then don't make ignorant attacking statements about me and my family.

Nothing is more immature that insulting someone's dreams, no matter how pathetic, for no reason.

If your going to say that you want people to live in the woods with only a backpack on a serious political discussion thread - then you have to be able to put up with people saying that they're stupid.

Go ahead and tell me they're stupid, but a tactful way would be more reasonable.

Well I guess I did just do that.

As for history, I think I know a good amount for someone my grade level. And I'm willing to learn more, so I shall, and that goes for politics too.

By your posts though - you seem pretty closed minded about politics. I am glad that you are willing to learn more.

You assume I do not know many things I do not include in my political posts, often I leave them out because there is no reason to mention them or that they are too obvious.

Well many of your posts show that you are lacking a basic understanding of current affairs and history. Such as your statement claiming that we have left Afganistan.

You claim I live in a fantasy world, but if I do I shall certainly come out of it. I get school work done, I have a social life, I have outside interests, I have goals. I can be imaginative in my idle day dreams and in the real world. There is nothing wrong in seeing the world as it could be, for I realize that I can't (and don't want to) change the world into it.

According to your posts it sounded like you wanted the world that way. You can have your day dreams - it's what books are made from - but to state them on a political discussion like this as if you really want it to happen - is strange.

They aren't necessarily, but based your many posts it seems you think we are better than them. I'd love to hear your argument

If you look at my past posts I repeatedly state that I do not think we are better then them. I however don't think they are better than us like so many people like to say on this board. If you don't think they're better then the US then why do you want to move there? Did you not say...

Proud? Proud!?I'm not in the least bit proud of my country... I don't like saying I'm American. I like saying I have English ancestors, and Italian, German, and Irish. I'd move if I could.

To me - it doesn't sound like you think America is just as good as Europe and you state that you are ashamed of being American.

The only reason why I bring up the things Europe has done is because of the constant America Bashing. Last year it was really bad - this year it comes around every once in a while. As Hobbit - said - if you don't like it move. But you may find the grass isn't as green on the other side.

[Ornelírë Mistë]

So? I don't want the government managing my health care - it end up into a fiasco just like Social Security.
This could very well happen.

Well then don't make ignorant attacking statements about me and my family.
I'm sorry, and I hope you apologize for insulting me.

If your going to say that you want people to live in the woods with only a backpack on a serious political discussion thread - then you have to be able to put up with people saying that they're stupid.
I don't want people to live in the woods, I just want myself to live in the woods if possible. I can put up with people calling me stupid if they do it nicely the first time around. I don't think my post was unclear on that. The idea to post it was stupid, but I think as an individual I am more foolish than stupid, though certainly not smart.

Well many of your posts show that you are lacking a basic understanding of current affairs and history. Such as your statement claiming that we have left Afganistan.
I'm trying to be more with the news. I'm learning more as I post.

According to your posts it sounded like you wanted the world that way. You can have your day dreams - it's what books are made from - but to state them on a political discussion like this as if you really want it to happen - is strange.
True, I do regret posting that. I know I'm odd, I'm not really bothered by it but I try to be normal. I shall edit!

To me - it doesn't sound like you think America is just as good as Europe and you state that you are ashamed of being American.

The only reason why I bring up the things Europe has done is because of the constant America Bashing. Last year it was really bad - this year it comes around every once in a while. As Hobbit - said - if you don't like it move. But you may find the grass isn't as green on the other side.
I'm just frustrated about some goings on in the country and some in the past, my fault. I do plan to move, I and will see if the grass is greener. I too am sick of all the people criticizing America, though I'm sure I doesn't seem like I do. I live in America, but I am not the country. It's not my fault some things seem to be messed up. Sometimes it seems like the criticisors comments have so much merit. They do, but I wish... Oh well. Everywhere there are problems. I'll probably regret posting another weird post. Woo!

[HOBBIT]

Oh - speaking of this book ( A people's history of america)


I have to read it now for Honors US History.

My teacher is insane and he likes this Zinn book.

The text book for honors history is "The American Pageant" by Thomas Bailey, which is a very good textbook (but also a bit boring).

My teacher also wants to use the Howard Zinn book and compare them - he even put up at a comparison chart between the two books.


I had to read the first chapter of "A people's history" for homework, and wow this guy sure is negative about our history.