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08-31-2003, 10:35 AM
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Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Parkersburg WV
Posts: 110
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Why Elrond?
I think it is very odd that when Haldir arrives at Helm's Deep, he said that "Lord Elrond" sends us. I mean, he comes from Lorien, from Galadriel, who holds seniority over Elrond by a long shot. I think he should have said that Lady Galadriel sends her greetings. Plus, Elrond is more disdainful of men and Middle-Earth than he was in the first movie, while Galadriel is more hopeful, or at least more caring.
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Fingolfin: The Mighty Elven Lord who challenged Morgoth to single combat! |
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08-31-2003, 11:01 AM
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#2 |
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Domesticated Swing Babe
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Reality
Posts: 5,340
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But I believe Elrond is the one who thinks elves should help men in this last bit. (before they leave) Elrond set up the Fellowship!
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Happy Atheist Go Democrats! |
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08-31-2003, 01:55 PM
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#3 |
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Long lost mooter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,342
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I also think we're going to see more about this in the EE, from what I saw in the preview.
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08-31-2003, 02:34 PM
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High King of Númenórë
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Númenórë <--United States of America
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Quote:
Also, while Elrond has appeared to be disdainful towards mankind, he has always been one to reach out to men, at least those of a certain line of men anyway  Remember Elrond's brother began the line of Numenor, he also knows Aragorn is destined to help his people, Elrond did have a strong alliance with men at one time as well and even though he see's the weaknesses in men, he also sees the other side as well, the side Aragorn has shown him. Although I don't see why the Elves going to Helm's deep ocurred, I can understand the rationale for it in a couple different ways...
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen
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08-31-2003, 05:02 PM
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Enting
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Middle of Germany
Posts: 87
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Re: Why Elrond?
Quote:
IMHO that means: He comes from Lothlorien, but the people of Rohan do not know the Lady of the woods, they surely know Rivendell and its Master, so he tells them a name they know. And at least Elrond 'spoke' with Galadriel earlier. But I do hope the EE explain more.
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Finarwë *********************** A! Elbereth Gilthoniel! silivren penna m?*riel o menel aglar elenath, Gilthoniel, A! Elbereth! |
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08-31-2003, 06:33 PM
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#6 |
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An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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Re: Re: Why Elrond?
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Finarwe
[B]As far as I remember (just gave the DVD to a good friend), Haldir said something like "I bring words of Elrond from Rivendell". IMHO that means: He comes from Lothlorien, but the people of Rohan do not know the Lady of the woods, they surely know Rivendell and its Master, so he tells them a name they know. And at least Elrond 'spoke' with Galadriel earlier. I AGREE WITH THIS LINE OF REASONING....CAPS LOCK STUCK.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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09-01-2003, 12:50 AM
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#7 |
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Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Parkersburg WV
Posts: 110
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Most of these responses are describing the Elrond in the books. In the movie, he is pretty much done with men and is only concerned with heading to Valinor and persuading Arwen to go with him. Yes, the Fellowship starts from Rivendell, but really, he had little to do with it except telling Gandalf to get the ring out of there, because, "the time of the Elves is over...we are leaving these shores." The Fellowship took form of its own accord while he stood by and watched.
Maybe Haldir should have said, "I bring word from Lady Galadriel and Lord Elrond...etc." Actually, that whole telepathic thing between Galadriel and Elrond bugs me. If they had to add that part to the movie, it would have made more sense to me if Galadriel had sent them anyhow, since the Fellowship had visited Lorien only a few weeks or so before that and was in more of a position to know their plight. I guess we all come away with different perceptions of the whole thing...
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Fingolfin: The Mighty Elven Lord who challenged Morgoth to single combat! |
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09-01-2003, 02:57 AM
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Elven Warrior
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: The Second Drawer Down
Posts: 407
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Re: Re: Re: Why Elrond?
Quote:
Woops! Off-topic!    Erm... Yes! The Elrond-Galadriel telepathy thing annoyed me too. Like Galadriel's Miss Exposition for TTT... Lanelf.
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Hey, I'm back! *resounding silence* You didn't even notice I was gone, did you? Well, I'm back now anyway. Artemis Fowl must find Mulch Diggums! You'll never shut down the real Napster |
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09-01-2003, 09:12 AM
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#9 |
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An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Why Elrond?
The most common reason, aside from the key sticking sometimes is that I've left my glasses in another room or downstairs and so using the capitals allows me to see what I'm writing.
......I didn't want you to think I was computer illiterate.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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09-01-2003, 09:24 AM
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Domesticated Swing Babe
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Reality
Posts: 5,340
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"At the City of the Trees, Elrond calls a council of the Elves. He believes that they should help in the struggle against Sauron, but not everybody agrees." .....(picture of Galadriel here, with the caption "The Rings of the Elf Lords were not made as weapons of war or conquest. They cannot come to the aid of Men." .......below Galadriel's picture is Celeborn, with caption "The alliance between Men and Elves is over." ) How Haldir came to be the leader might be because there were no other elves introduced from Rivendell, just Elrond and Arwen. Wasn't Arwen originally coming to Helms Deep anyway? Too bad they couldn't have given Figwit a real name and sent him! Fan girls would have grooved! Think what that would have done for that guy's career!
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Happy Atheist Go Democrats! |
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09-01-2003, 09:46 AM
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#11 |
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An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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Did anyone else have a version where Frodo and Sam are taken to Gondor? I really freaked at that. And I stopped counting differences in the movie and the book, 37 minutes into the movie. Overwhelming.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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09-01-2003, 10:38 AM
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#12 |
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Greatest Elven woman of Aman
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7
Posts: 4,285
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What? Spock, didn't you see the movie in the theatre?
I love Lizra's Figwit idea.
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--Life is hard, and then we die. |
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09-01-2003, 11:25 AM
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#13 |
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An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Artanis
[B]What? Spock, didn't you see the movie in the theatre? No I waited until my pre-ordered DVD arrived. After watching what they cut next time I'll wait for the extended version for sure.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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09-01-2003, 11:40 AM
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#14 |
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Greatest Elven woman of Aman
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7
Posts: 4,285
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Hehe, that may be the most sensible thing to do.
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--Life is hard, and then we die. |
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09-01-2003, 12:04 PM
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#15 | |
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Mootis per forum
Administrator 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Spain
Posts: 61,439
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Why Elrond?
Quote:
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Do not be hasty. That is my motto. Now we'll have a drink and go to the Entmoot. |
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09-01-2003, 01:11 PM
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#16 | |
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High King of Númenórë
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Númenórë <--United States of America
Posts: 1,947
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Quote:
__________________
'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen
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09-01-2003, 01:15 PM
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#17 | |
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High King of Númenórë
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Númenórë <--United States of America
Posts: 1,947
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Spock
[B] Quote:
That stinks, movies like this are best scene on the big screen...
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen
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09-01-2003, 01:58 PM
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#18 | |
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Long lost mooter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,342
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Quote:
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09-01-2003, 05:49 PM
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#19 | |
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Enting
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Middle of Germany
Posts: 87
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Quote:
 No Glorfindel, no Figwit, no sons of Elrond! A dead Haldir!!!  The first thing I will do after ROTK will be: Reading the books again!
__________________
Finarwë *********************** A! Elbereth Gilthoniel! silivren penna m?*riel o menel aglar elenath, Gilthoniel, A! Elbereth! |
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