Rock Is Dead

Millane · 12-09-2003, 06:37 AM

Rock is Dead, unfortunate but true

me and a friend were talking about music the other day and i was arguing that even though we should have the ability to make better music nowadays than say 30 years ago (we have all the resources they had only now we have more and better) music is in its dark ages, he says that i am stupid and that music has gotten better its just a few losers are pulling modern musics image down... i think there are only a handful of modern artists that i would give up my time and listen to, Marilyn Manson, NIN, Audioslave and a few others... this list compared to old Giants of the music world Pink Floyd, the Beatles, David Bowie, Queen, Bob Dylan, Nick Cave (still going great guns though

) etc etc etc... please give your views and add any of your fav musicians to the great old or great new catagories.

gimli7410 · 12-09-2003, 11:50 AM

i think music isnt really going down but evolving. i mean we have more technology and instruments but some people as your friend said bring down the image. i.e. linkin park, they see themselves as metal but when has metal ever had a DJ, same goes for slipknot but i like their music. i gtg but ill continue this later

Beor · 12-09-2003, 02:04 PM

I have to agree with Millane. Rock and Roll as it was once known is dead, and it has been replaced by a bunch of feel-good pansies, whos idea of rock is dancing around like idiots and showing up on TRL to hear people scream at them. No more do rock stars destroy everything on (The Who), no one OD's on cocaine and comes back with songs just as good (Eric Clapton), no one Partys like Led Zepplin. Rock is dead, but it still stands a chance to come back, as long people still remember the classics and learn to abhore the vast majority of new music, demanding a return to the ATTITUDE that was Rock n' Roll.

(should have put this in the venting thread)

Elfhelm · 12-09-2003, 02:29 PM

It is a myth that Rock and Roll was ever alive. In fact, the greats did not create Rock and Roll. They played what they wanted o play. Some was folk music with a skiffle beat. Some was rythm and blues in accordance with a chicago style of the "race records". Some were just songs in the manner of the older songwriters. One or two bands focused on playing the same kind of song over and over, and they called themselves rock bands. They were not the greats. The greats were diverse in their output and their influences. Rock was a myth. Musicians play music. The good ones are sincere. That is the only constant. My two cents ... and I went to the opening day of Hard Day's Night in my town, so consider the source.

***gdl96*** · 12-09-2003, 04:52 PM

As long as the White Stipes are around, rock will still have a glimmer of hope.

elendili · 12-09-2003, 05:10 PM

I agree with you if you compare nowadays number ones like Britney Spears to the older generation like Queen, Deep Purple, Nirvana there is no comparison and even the older musicians have gone downhill like Madona and i have to say this
The Darkness is a joke
they couln't do decent rock if they tried

gimli7410 · 12-09-2003, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gdl96
As long as the White Stipes are around, rock will still have a glimmer of hope.

are you joking

cassiopeia · 12-09-2003, 08:32 PM

I've said it before: for the most part I dislike all modern music. I listen to radio stations that play music from the sixties and seventies. (Millane: do you get Gold 104? That's what I listen to!) I love The Beatles, Elvis, David Bowie, Eric Clapton, Bob Dylan, Roy Orbison. Crowded House was a good band, but they split up. I like U2, although I haven't like many of their recent songs. Oasis and Silverchair are okay, but they can't beat the oldies.

***gdl96*** · 12-09-2003, 09:14 PM

No gimli, I am not joking. The White Stripes represent all that is great about rock and roll music today.

But I still haven't heard any bands today who can compare to Led Zeppelin, the Beatles, the Doors, Queen, Hendrix, Jethro Tull, etc.

gimli7410 · 12-09-2003, 10:19 PM

i like their songs but whenever i hear him sing,jack white sounds nothing like he normally does and im not talking about a little off, like way off. i just think they get extra help from evolution

Insidious Rex · 12-09-2003, 11:35 PM

Yes rock is dead. Or at least hibernating pretty damn hard. Either way its a shame. But what can you expect. Change is the only constant and music has become not at all about the music but simply about image. there has always been the image gimick but at least before there was some musical talent in there as well. now musical talent is secondary at best. what matters is how you look and if you can pull headlines by being outragious and attracting attention to yourself. the last time rock was popular was the early 90's when grunge was peaking. Then Kobain died and grunge collapsed under its own weight almost over night. and all that was left was pop divas and boy bands in a post apocolyptic musical wasteland. can you see the tumbleweeds blowing? is that a rock oasis I see over the horizon? or just another mirage...

its been a long time since we rock and rolled...

Lizra · 12-10-2003, 12:49 AM

I'm waiting for the third rockabilly revival.

I prefer rock and roll, not just rock. This band looks good to me. Gotta get it! Anyone seen them?

www.bloodshotrecords.com/bands.php3?bandid=35

Rock needs to get back to it's roots!

Beor · 12-10-2003, 01:16 PM

Heh, Heh, murder boogies. AWESOME!

I am pretty new to computers, Lizra, is there any way to hear their music on that link? They sound real good. I'd like to listen to them. (Cant go buy an album, nearest music store is a continent away (I'm not a mariner of Numernor (whoops, how did that get into the general messages?!)))

Anyway, there are a few bands out there that are doing their best to keep the spirit of rock alive, such as ministry. Al Jorgenssen is insane, sorta like Ted Nugent in the old days.

Back in the day of Hank Williams Jr and David Allen Coe, Country used to be good too, and it was definitely akin to Rock and Roll, but When Rock started withering, so did country, and now all we've got is a bunch of whimpering little boys. All music is dying, so its time to look back and find solice in the sweet melodies of The Doors and Creedence Clearwater Revival, and Willie Nelson. Screw these idiots trying to make music. (Also, we've still got the Rolling Stones, but even Mic Jager isnt fighting the power anymore.....He got Knighted! Oh well...)

Sween · 12-10-2003, 04:37 PM

Music as with most things in life is completally up to the individual and therefore it will never die because someone somewhere will allways love that. I dont like any of the modern bands you mentioned but that doesnt mean i dont like some other bands so rock will never die but we mite just not allways like what form it is in the present.

Ornelírë Mistë · 12-10-2003, 05:23 PM

Rock music can bee seen as evolving or dead. The rock of 30 years ago is dead, ie- no longer being made, though still loved. It probably has some influence on music being made today. Yet music has to change over thirty years. It is still rock, but it different. It really is a question of whether or not you like it then. Does quality make a genre? No. So rock is dead, or it has evolved into something else.

My opinion is that most music today is not my thing. There should be another renaissance, and another art movement sort of like Abstract Expressionism. (its not all abstract, its not all expressive- it's characterized by a will to rebel, break from the norm.)

Comic Book Guy · 12-10-2003, 05:33 PM

The Darkness are fast becoming the most popular band in Britain and they are undeniably a rockin' band.

Elfhelm · 12-10-2003, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gdl96
I still haven't heard any bands today who can compare to Led Zeppelin, the Beatles, the Doors, Queen, Hendrix, Jethro Tull, etc.

That's because...

Led Zeppelin, not afraid to use a mandolin.
Beatles, not afraid to skiffle.
The Doors (um, well, not my cuppa)...
Queen, not afraid to harmonize vocals.
Hendrix, not afraid to do something bizarre with his guitar.
Jethro Tull, not afraid to play flute solos, or use a symphony orchestra.

But I must object on one ground. If the Beatles were good then, doesn't it merit at least LISTENING ONCE to George's posthumous album?

And if Ian Anderson was great then, isn't there a chance that something on the new album is worth listening to?

Dave Matthews Band has a lot of talent. They are not constrained by narrow definitions about what is and is not rock. Thank you, Dave!

I think most people find it EASY to decide what they like at age 17 and never have to make another artistic judgement again. And funny thing is, what people like at 17 is what their friends like. So did they ever develop any ear at all? I doubt it. Having an opinion other than Disco Sucks and Rock is Dead might actually require mental effort.

***gdl96*** · 12-10-2003, 07:48 PM

Most my friends don't care for Zeppelin and the White Stripes and all the other bands I like at all. I like what I like.

Elfhelm · 12-10-2003, 08:44 PM

I meant "most people", present company excepted.

Most people listen to what their friends like. Most people buy what their friends have. Since the music business is just a big audio fashion show anymore, the values of our disposable culture override just about every artistic judgement involved in real music listening. But there are and will always be musicians who are honest and sincere.

FoolofaTook · 12-10-2003, 09:30 PM

Rock has definetly changed over the last 30 years. It has evolved, but into what exactly? Most "musicians" nowadays are more interested in there image and selling records. The quality of their music is poor. There is no real heart in any of the "rock bands" now, well with the exception of a few good bands. I inparticular hate all the Creed, Default, Nickelback sort-of bands; they are garbage. It sounds like they're all trying to rip-off Pearl Jam, but doing it very poorly. Their songs sound all the same. I'm afraid that rock, as we once knew it, is pretty much dead.

12-09-2003, 06:37 AM	#1
Millane The Dude Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: at the altar of my ego Posts: 1,685	Rock Is Dead Rock is Dead, unfortunate but true me and a friend were talking about music the other day and i was arguing that even though we should have the ability to make better music nowadays than say 30 years ago (we have all the resources they had only now we have more and better) music is in its dark ages, he says that i am stupid and that music has gotten better its just a few losers are pulling modern musics image down... i think there are only a handful of modern artists that i would give up my time and listen to, Marilyn Manson, NIN, Audioslave and a few others... this list compared to old Giants of the music world Pink Floyd, the Beatles, David Bowie, Queen, Bob Dylan, Nick Cave (still going great guns though ) etc etc etc... please give your views and add any of your fav musicians to the great old or great new catagories. __________________ Ill heal your wounds, ill set you free,

12-09-2003, 11:50 AM	#2
gimli7410 the dumb stoner canuck Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: canada Posts: 2,542	i think music isnt really going down but evolving. i mean we have more technology and instruments but some people as your friend said bring down the image. i.e. linkin park, they see themselves as metal but when has metal ever had a DJ, same goes for slipknot but i like their music. i gtg but ill continue this later __________________ -"Down with the system"-Serj tankian of system of a down -“Humans have been on the earth for millions of years, yet we don’t believe man began thinking until he started building walls. And what good have these walls ever done us?”-Serj tankian of soad -"stupid people do stupid things"-Serj tankian of soad "Trying is the first step to failure" Homer Simpson "It isn't going to be easy"-jerseydevil "only the good die young" I AM CANADIAN If the people lead, the leaders will follow.

12-09-2003, 02:04 PM	#3
Beor founder of the color blue Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: E-Space Posts: 1,727	I have to agree with Millane. Rock and Roll as it was once known is dead, and it has been replaced by a bunch of feel-good pansies, whos idea of rock is dancing around like idiots and showing up on TRL to hear people scream at them. No more do rock stars destroy everything on (The Who), no one OD's on cocaine and comes back with songs just as good (Eric Clapton), no one Partys like Led Zepplin. Rock is dead, but it still stands a chance to come back, as long people still remember the classics and learn to abhore the vast majority of new music, demanding a return to the ATTITUDE that was Rock n' Roll. (should have put this in the venting thread) __________________ Well, there it is.

12-09-2003, 02:29 PM	#4
Elfhelm Marshal of the Eastmark Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,412	It is a myth that Rock and Roll was ever alive. In fact, the greats did not create Rock and Roll. They played what they wanted o play. Some was folk music with a skiffle beat. Some was rythm and blues in accordance with a chicago style of the "race records". Some were just songs in the manner of the older songwriters. One or two bands focused on playing the same kind of song over and over, and they called themselves rock bands. They were not the greats. The greats were diverse in their output and their influences. Rock was a myth. Musicians play music. The good ones are sincere. That is the only constant. My two cents ... and I went to the opening day of Hard Day's Night in my town, so consider the source. __________________ cya

12-09-2003, 05:10 PM	#6
elendili Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: a galaxy far far away (aka Manchester) Posts: 320	I agree with you if you compare nowadays number ones like Britney Spears to the older generation like Queen, Deep Purple, Nirvana there is no comparison and even the older musicians have gone downhill like Madona and i have to say this The Darkness is a joke they couln't do decent rock if they tried __________________ Dovie'andi se tovya sagain "Courage my soul, now learn to wield The weight of thine immortal shield Place on thy head thy helmet bright Ballance thy sword against the fight See where an army strong as fair With silken banners spreads the air Now if thy bee'st that thing divine In this days combat let it shine: And shew that nature wants an art To conqeur one resolved heart" Andrew Marvell

12-09-2003, 04:52 PM	#5
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	As long as the White Stipes are around, rock will still have a glimmer of hope.

12-09-2003, 08:32 PM	#8
cassiopeia Viggoholic Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 1,749	I've said it before: for the most part I dislike all modern music. I listen to radio stations that play music from the sixties and seventies. (Millane: do you get Gold 104? That's what I listen to!) I love The Beatles, Elvis, David Bowie, Eric Clapton, Bob Dylan, Roy Orbison. Crowded House was a good band, but they split up. I like U2, although I haven't like many of their recent songs. Oasis and Silverchair are okay, but they can't beat the oldies. __________________ Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.

12-09-2003, 09:14 PM	#9
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	No gimli, I am not joking. The White Stripes represent all that is great about rock and roll music today. But I still haven't heard any bands today who can compare to Led Zeppelin, the Beatles, the Doors, Queen, Hendrix, Jethro Tull, etc.

12-09-2003, 10:19 PM	#10
gimli7410 the dumb stoner canuck Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: canada Posts: 2,542	i like their songs but whenever i hear him sing,jack white sounds nothing like he normally does and im not talking about a little off, like way off. i just think they get extra help from evolution __________________ -"Down with the system"-Serj tankian of system of a down -“Humans have been on the earth for millions of years, yet we don’t believe man began thinking until he started building walls. And what good have these walls ever done us?”-Serj tankian of soad -"stupid people do stupid things"-Serj tankian of soad "Trying is the first step to failure" Homer Simpson "It isn't going to be easy"-jerseydevil "only the good die young" I AM CANADIAN If the people lead, the leaders will follow.

12-09-2003, 11:35 PM	#11
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	Yes rock is dead. Or at least hibernating pretty damn hard. Either way its a shame. But what can you expect. Change is the only constant and music has become not at all about the music but simply about image. there has always been the image gimick but at least before there was some musical talent in there as well. now musical talent is secondary at best. what matters is how you look and if you can pull headlines by being outragious and attracting attention to yourself. the last time rock was popular was the early 90's when grunge was peaking. Then Kobain died and grunge collapsed under its own weight almost over night. and all that was left was pop divas and boy bands in a post apocolyptic musical wasteland. can you see the tumbleweeds blowing? is that a rock oasis I see over the horizon? or just another mirage... its been a long time since we rock and rolled... __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

12-10-2003, 12:49 AM	#12
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	I'm waiting for the third rockabilly revival. I prefer rock and roll, not just rock. This band looks good to me. Gotta get it! Anyone seen them? www.bloodshotrecords.com/bands.php3?bandid=35 Rock needs to get back to it's roots! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

12-10-2003, 01:16 PM	#13
Beor founder of the color blue Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: E-Space Posts: 1,727	Heh, Heh, murder boogies. AWESOME! I am pretty new to computers, Lizra, is there any way to hear their music on that link? They sound real good. I'd like to listen to them. (Cant go buy an album, nearest music store is a continent away (I'm not a mariner of Numernor (whoops, how did that get into the general messages?!))) Anyway, there are a few bands out there that are doing their best to keep the spirit of rock alive, such as ministry. Al Jorgenssen is insane, sorta like Ted Nugent in the old days. Back in the day of Hank Williams Jr and David Allen Coe, Country used to be good too, and it was definitely akin to Rock and Roll, but When Rock started withering, so did country, and now all we've got is a bunch of whimpering little boys. All music is dying, so its time to look back and find solice in the sweet melodies of The Doors and Creedence Clearwater Revival, and Willie Nelson. Screw these idiots trying to make music. (Also, we've still got the Rolling Stones, but even Mic Jager isnt fighting the power anymore.....He got Knighted! Oh well...) __________________ Well, there it is.

12-10-2003, 04:37 PM	#14
Sween im quite stupid Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cockermouth Posts: 2,058	Music as with most things in life is completally up to the individual and therefore it will never die because someone somewhere will allways love that. I dont like any of the modern bands you mentioned but that doesnt mean i dont like some other bands so rock will never die but we mite just not allways like what form it is in the present. __________________ Yeah god hes ok but i would rather be judged by a sheep than that idiot

12-10-2003, 05:23 PM	#15
Ornelírë Mistë Elven Warrior Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 482	Rock music can bee seen as evolving or dead. The rock of 30 years ago is dead, ie- no longer being made, though still loved. It probably has some influence on music being made today. Yet music has to change over thirty years. It is still rock, but it different. It really is a question of whether or not you like it then. Does quality make a genre? No. So rock is dead, or it has evolved into something else. My opinion is that most music today is not my thing. There should be another renaissance, and another art movement sort of like Abstract Expressionism. (its not all abstract, its not all expressive- it's characterized by a will to rebel, break from the norm.) __________________ "Lot of people say this city looks like Hell," Allie said. She took a long drag from her cigarette. The glowing tip burned a hole in the darkness. "Most people never been to Hell," Jacob said. She looked at him and he could hear the smile in her voice. "And I suppose you have?" Last edited by Ornelírë Mistë : 12-10-2003 at 05:25 PM.

12-10-2003, 05:33 PM	#16
Comic Book Guy Best Ex-Administrator ever Join Date: May 2001 Location: Ireland Posts: 60,547	The Darkness are fast becoming the most popular band in Britain and they are undeniably a rockin' band.

12-10-2003, 07:48 PM	#18
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	Most my friends don't care for Zeppelin and the White Stripes and all the other bands I like at all. I like what I like.

12-10-2003, 08:44 PM	#19
Elfhelm Marshal of the Eastmark Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,412	I meant "most people", present company excepted. Most people listen to what their friends like. Most people buy what their friends have. Since the music business is just a big audio fashion show anymore, the values of our disposable culture override just about every artistic judgement involved in real music listening. But there are and will always be musicians who are honest and sincere. __________________ cya

12-10-2003, 09:30 PM	#20
FoolofaTook Elven Warrior Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: ??? Posts: 214	Rock has definetly changed over the last 30 years. It has evolved, but into what exactly? Most "musicians" nowadays are more interested in there image and selling records. The quality of their music is poor. There is no real heart in any of the "rock bands" now, well with the exception of a few good bands. I inparticular hate all the Creed, Default, Nickelback sort-of bands; they are garbage. It sounds like they're all trying to rip-off Pearl Jam, but doing it very poorly. Their songs sound all the same. I'm afraid that rock, as we once knew it, is pretty much dead.

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