Too much "atmosphere"!

Lizra · 10-07-2003, 09:16 PM

I'm reading RoTK again, and have noticed something that bugged me before. The constant descriptions about the darkness and lack of sun, the brown dusk, oppressive sunless dawns, blah, blah, blah....Sauron has made it dark! OK! I GET IT!!!

I just think that bit gets mentioned one too many times! (for me)

While I'm at it,

Too much mention of Denethor's uncanny ability to "see all". I guess this is annoying once you've read the book, and know what's going on. Over and over, remarks of his far sightedness! Geez!

Of course, I want to clonk Denethor many times as it is, yet I'd really like to clonk everyone who makes repeated remarks about his amazing knowledge and vision .....with the "you know what" round thing!

I think I'll go back and start counting the times the "dark clouds of doom" get mentioned.I bet it's over 50! I know it's a dramatic element...but enough already! I'm sure the digital recoloring will highlight the atmospheric gloom and doom.....meh...I guess I'm just touchy tonight!

Sheeana · 10-07-2003, 09:56 PM

Lizra, you evil woman!

Now I just KNOW that next time I'm reading ROTK, I'm going to be counting them!

Lizra · 10-08-2003, 07:46 AM

Great!

I started at pg 66...if you could just get the ones prior to that ! Heh!

The Gaffer · 10-08-2003, 11:51 AM

He he. Don't forget to include the portentous similes.

"like a dark hand stretching out to.." switch out the lights?? reach for another pack of Marlboros?? ask for some spare change??

Lizra · 10-08-2003, 07:16 PM

Yes...he really packs them in there! I bet some atmosphere references slipped by me!

Must recount!

Must start in TTT!

Rosie Gamgee · 10-09-2003, 01:24 PM

There does seem to be a lot of descriptions about how dark it is, but I think it perpetuates one's fear and depression- much like the characters in the book. It also gives one the impression that Minas Tirith, and Gondor for that matter, are usually very bright, sunny, merry places, and that this darkness is totally unusual. It keeps me thinking "Oh, great, they'll never get out of this one" until the end. I rather like it.

***Earniel*** · 10-09-2003, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sheeana
Lizra, you evil woman! Now I just KNOW that next time I'm reading ROTK, I'm going to be counting them!

Me too!

Noooo!

*starts rocking back and forth whimpering*

Let's say I never noticed it before, the comments about the dark and gloomy settings I mean. I do remember noticing the several comments about Denethor's far-reaching eye. Once you know about his secret TV-addiction, it's rather obvious.

***Valandil*** · 10-09-2003, 02:17 PM

Tolkien's writing is just very heavy on the descriptions in general: of weather, terrain, people, food, etc. I think that's why some people have a hard time reading it - at least at first. But I think it's also why we who read him get so entirely engrossed. Once you settle into his pace of story-telling, and get wrapped up into his level of detail... maybe it makes us CARE more, or feel more like we could BE there. He invested heavily in the creating - and we have to start investing heavily in understanding the creation. I actually find it quite charming.

Bombadillo · 10-09-2003, 09:37 PM

Yes, the repetition of the darkness sets the reader off a bit. It's really effective writing.

Elvengirl · 10-09-2003, 10:04 PM

I agree with Valandil. But I used to think he put in too much description, I wanted him to get on with the story and back to the action. I didn't want to hear about the clouds when Frodo is ALMOST to Mt. Doom.

But now I appreciate it and how much he put into the creation of this story. He really involves the reader into the universe he created.

Lizra · 10-10-2003, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bombadillo
Yes, the repetition of the darkness sets the reader off a bit. It's really effective writing.

By "sets the reader off" do you mean annoy?

Worked on me! I guess I need to eat breakfast before I read!

I like the way he would mention one character seeing the gleam of the setting sun (or some such thing) while another was also noting it somewhere else, in another chapter. That little tie in helped, and the occasional thought one hobbit would have for another, far away. Still, *** (still counting) versions of "Sauron made it dark" fanned my flames!

Gamigar · 10-13-2003, 05:35 PM

You people are evil

how dare you bring such unholy opinions onto this sacred message board. There are no flaws in Mr. Tolkiens writing.

Lizra · 10-13-2003, 05:36 PM

Oh my!

Bombadillo · 10-13-2003, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gamigar
You people are evil how dare you bring such unholy opinions onto this sacred message board. There are no flaws in Mr. Tolkiens writing.

Not me, not me! I remained faithful to the fantasy god!

Gamigar · 10-13-2003, 07:28 PM

thank you, i must have overlooked you. when i rule the world for 500 years i will be sure to spare you from my punishment.

Lizra · 10-13-2003, 08:09 PM

Call me evil then!

***Earniel*** · 10-14-2003, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gamigar
You people are evil how dare you bring such unholy opinions onto this sacred message board. There are no flaws in Mr. Tolkiens writing.

Now, now Gamigar. Tolkien's writing may be unparalelled yet (and the greatest and most inspiring fantasy work by one man that I have ever seen) but that doesn't mean there can't be parts that I or any one else may have wished to be different. 't is a matter of opinion.

- Evil Eärniel

Gamigar · 10-14-2003, 07:37 PM

Then change your opinion!

***Earniel*** · 10-15-2003, 07:18 AM

Make me.

Black Breathalizer · 10-15-2003, 11:51 AM

After the shocking blasphemy of this thread, I think it's safe to say that Lizra has replaced me as Public Enemy # 1 for all true-blue Tolkien Purists.

10-07-2003, 09:16 PM	#1
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Too much "atmosphere"! I'm reading RoTK again, and have noticed something that bugged me before. The constant descriptions about the darkness and lack of sun, the brown dusk, oppressive sunless dawns, blah, blah, blah....Sauron has made it dark! OK! I GET IT!!! I just think that bit gets mentioned one too many times! (for me) While I'm at it, Too much mention of Denethor's uncanny ability to "see all". I guess this is annoying once you've read the book, and know what's going on. Over and over, remarks of his far sightedness! Geez! Of course, I want to clonk Denethor many times as it is, yet I'd really like to clonk everyone who makes repeated remarks about his amazing knowledge and vision .....with the "you know what" round thing! I think I'll go back and start counting the times the "dark clouds of doom" get mentioned.I bet it's over 50! I know it's a dramatic element...but enough already! I'm sure the digital recoloring will highlight the atmospheric gloom and doom.....meh...I guess I'm just touchy tonight! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

10-08-2003, 07:46 AM	#3
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Great! I started at pg 66...if you could just get the ones prior to that ! Heh! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

10-08-2003, 07:16 PM	#5
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Yes...he really packs them in there! I bet some atmosphere references slipped by me! Must recount! Must start in TTT! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

10-09-2003, 01:24 PM	#6
Rosie Gamgee The Lovely Hobbit-Lass Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Bounded in a nut-shell Posts: 1,593	There does seem to be a lot of descriptions about how dark it is, but I think it perpetuates one's fear and depression- much like the characters in the book. It also gives one the impression that Minas Tirith, and Gondor for that matter, are usually very bright, sunny, merry places, and that this darkness is totally unusual. It keeps me thinking "Oh, great, they'll never get out of this one" until the end. I rather like it. __________________ It's New Years Day, just like the day before; Same old skies of grey, same empty bottles on the floor. Another year's gone by, and I was thinking once again, How can I take this losing hand and somehow win? Just give me One Good Year To get my feet back on the ground. I've been chasing grace; Grace ain't so easily found One bad hand can devil a man, chase him and carry him down. I've got to get out of here, just give me One Good Year!

10-09-2003, 09:37 PM	#9
Bombadillo "The Bomb" Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: all over the place Posts: 1,601	Yes, the repetition of the darkness sets the reader off a bit. It's really effective writing. __________________ Could it be that one path to enlightenment leads through insanity?

10-07-2003, 09:56 PM	#2
Sheeana Lord of the Pants Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,382	Lizra, you evil woman! Now I just KNOW that next time I'm reading ROTK, I'm going to be counting them!

10-08-2003, 11:51 AM	#4
The Gaffer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: In me taters Posts: 3,288	He he. Don't forget to include the portentous similes. "like a dark hand stretching out to.." switch out the lights?? reach for another pack of Marlboros?? ask for some spare change??

10-09-2003, 02:17 PM	#8
*Valandil* High King at Annuminas Administrator Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Wyoming - USA Posts: 10,752	Tolkien's writing is just very heavy on the descriptions in general: of weather, terrain, people, food, etc. I think that's why some people have a hard time reading it - at least at first. But I think it's also why we who read him get so entirely engrossed. Once you settle into his pace of story-telling, and get wrapped up into his level of detail... maybe it makes us CARE more, or feel more like we could BE there. He invested heavily in the creating - and we have to start investing heavily in understanding the creation. I actually find it quite charming.

10-09-2003, 10:04 PM	#10
Elvengirl Mirthful Maiden Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Rivendell Posts: 1,252	I agree with Valandil. But I used to think he put in too much description, I wanted him to get on with the story and back to the action. I didn't want to hear about the clouds when Frodo is ALMOST to Mt. Doom. But now I appreciate it and how much he put into the creation of this story. He really involves the reader into the universe he created. __________________ The Elves represent, as it were, the artistic, aesthetic, and purely scientific aspects of the Humane nature raised to a higher level than is actually seen in Men.~ J.R.R. Tolkien Wanna play? www.thievesguild.com

10-13-2003, 05:35 PM	#12
Gamigar Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: somewhere between here and there Posts: 116	You people are evil how dare you bring such unholy opinions onto this sacred message board. There are no flaws in Mr. Tolkiens writing. __________________ The road goes ever on and on Down from the door where it began Now far ahead the road has gone And I must follow if I can Pursuing it with eager feet Until it joins some larger way Where many paths and errands meet And wither then I can not say

10-13-2003, 05:36 PM	#13
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Oh my! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

10-13-2003, 07:28 PM	#15
Gamigar Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: somewhere between here and there Posts: 116	thank you, i must have overlooked you. when i rule the world for 500 years i will be sure to spare you from my punishment. __________________ The road goes ever on and on Down from the door where it began Now far ahead the road has gone And I must follow if I can Pursuing it with eager feet Until it joins some larger way Where many paths and errands meet And wither then I can not say

10-13-2003, 08:09 PM	#16
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Call me evil then! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

10-14-2003, 07:37 PM	#18
Gamigar Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: somewhere between here and there Posts: 116	Then change your opinion! __________________ The road goes ever on and on Down from the door where it began Now far ahead the road has gone And I must follow if I can Pursuing it with eager feet Until it joins some larger way Where many paths and errands meet And wither then I can not say Last edited by Gamigar : 10-14-2003 at 07:38 PM.

10-15-2003, 07:18 AM	#19
*Earniel* The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium) Posts: 14,363	Make me. __________________ We are not things.

10-15-2003, 11:51 AM	#20
Black Breathalizer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 828	After the shocking blasphemy of this thread, I think it's safe to say that Lizra has replaced me as Public Enemy # 1 for all true-blue Tolkien Purists.