Marilyn Manson

[Millane]

i read this the other day and we discussed it in our philosophy class and everyone found it very interesting. It is Marilyn Manson's response to being blamed for the Columbine shootings...

Columbine: Whose Fault Is It?
It is sad to think that the first few people on earth needed no books, movies, games or music to inspire cold-blooded murder. The day that Cain bashed his brother Abel's brains in, the only motivation he needed was his own human disposition to violence. Whether you interpret the Bible as literature or as the final word of whatever God may be, Christianity has given us an image of death and sexuality that we have based our culture around. A half-naked dead man hangs in most homes and around our necks, and we have just taken that for granted all our lives. Is it a symbol of hope or hopelessness? The world's most famous murder-suicide was also the birth of the death icon -- the blueprint for celebrity. Unfortunately, for all of their inspiring morality, nowhere in the Gospels is intelligence praised as a virtue.

A lot of people forget or never realize that I started my band as a criticism of these very issues of despair and hypocrisy. The name Marilyn Manson has never celebrated the sad fact that America puts killers on the cover of Time magazine, giving them as much notoriety as our favorite movie stars. From Jesse James to Charles Manson, the media, since their inception, have turned criminals into folk heroes. They just created two new ones when they plastered those dipshits Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris' pictures on the front of every newspaper. Don't be surprised if every kid who gets pushed around has two new idols.

We applaud the creation of a bomb whose sole purpose is to destroy all of mankind, and we grow up watching our president's brains splattered all over Texas. Times have not become more violent. They have just become more televised. Does anyone think the Civil War was the least bit civil? If television had existed, you could be sure they would have been there to cover it, or maybe even participate in it, like their violent car chase of Princess Di. Disgusting vultures looking for corpses, exploiting, ****ing, filming and serving it up for our hungry appetites in a gluttonous display of endless human stupidity.

When it comes down to who's to blame for the high school murders in Littleton, Colorado, throw a rock and you'll hit someone who's guilty. We're the people who sit back and tolerate children owning guns, and we're the ones who tune in and watch the up-to-the-minute details of what they do with them. I think it's terrible when anyone dies, especially if it is someone you know and love. But what is more offensive is that when these tragedies happen, most people don't really care any more than they would about the season finale of Friends or The Real World. I was dumbfounded as I watched the media snake right in, not missing a teardrop, interviewing the parents of dead children, televising the funerals. Then came the witch hunt.

Man's greatest fear is chaos. It was unthinkable that these kids did not have a simple black-and-white reason for their actions. And so a scapegoat was needed. I remember hearing the initial reports from Littleton, that Harris and Klebold were wearing makeup and were dressed like Marilyn Manson, whom they obviously must worship, since they were dressed in black. Of course, speculation snowballed into making me the poster boy for everything that is bad in the world. These two idiots weren't wearing makeup, and they weren't dressed like me or like goths. Since Middle America has not heard of the music they did listen to (KMFDM and Rammstein, among others), the media picked something they thought was similar.

Responsible journalists have reported with less publicity that Harris and Klebold were not Marilyn Manson fans -- that they even disliked my music. Even if they were fans, that gives them no excuse, nor does it mean that music is to blame. Did we look for James Huberty's inspiration when he gunned down people at McDonald's? What did Timothy McVeigh like to watch? What about David Koresh, Jim Jones? Do you think entertainment inspired Kip Kinkel, or should we blame the fact that his father bought him the guns he used in the Springfield, Oregon, murders? What inspires Bill Clinton to blow people up in Kosovo? Was it something that Monica Lewinsky said to him? Isn't killing just killing, regardless if it's in Vietnam or Jonesboro, Arkansas? Why do we justify one, just because it seems to be for the right reasons? Should there ever be a right reason? If a kid is old enough to drive a car or buy a gun, isn't he old enough to be held personally responsible for what he does with his car or gun? Or if he's a teenager, should someone else be blamed because he isn't as enlightened as an eighteen-year-old?

[Millane]

America loves to find an icon to hang its guilt on. But, admittedly, I have assumed the role of Antichrist; I am the Nineties voice of individuality, and people tend to associate anyone who looks and behaves differently with illegal or immoral activity. Deep down, most adults hate people who go against the grain. It's comical that people are naive enough to have forgotten Elvis, Jim Morrison and Ozzy so quickly. All of them were subjected to the same age-old arguments, scrutiny and prejudice. I wrote a song called "Lunchbox," and some journalists have interpreted it as a song about guns. Ironically, the song is about being picked on and fighting back with my Kiss lunch box, which I used as a weapon on the playground. In 1979, metal lunch boxes were banned because they were considered dangerous weapons in the hands of delinquents. I also wrote a song called "Get Your Gunn." The title is spelled with two n's because the song was a reaction to the murder of Dr. David Gunn, who was killed in Florida by pro-life activists while I was living there. That was the ultimate hypocrisy I witnessed growing up: that these people killed someone in the name of being "pro-life."

The somewhat positive messages of these songs are usually the ones that sensationalists misinterpret as promoting the very things I am decrying. Right now, everyone is thinking of how they can prevent things like Littleton. How do you prevent AIDS, world war, depression, car crashes? We live in a free country, but with that freedom there is a burden of personal responsibility. Rather than teaching a child what is moral and immoral, right and wrong, we first and foremost can establish what the laws that govern us are. You can always escape hell by not believing in it, but you cannot escape death and you cannot escape prison.

It is no wonder that kids are growing up more cynical; they have a lot of information in front of them. They can see that they are living in a world that's made of bullshit. In the past, there was always the idea that you could turn and run and start something better. But now America has become one big mall, and because of the Internet and all of the technology we have, there's nowhere to run. People are the same everywhere. Sometimes music, movies and books are the only things that let us feel like someone else feels like we do. I've always tried to let people know it's OK, or better, if you don't fit into the program. Use your imagination -- if some geek from Ohio can become something, why can't anyone else with the willpower and creativity?

I chose not to jump into the media frenzy and defend myself, though I was begged to be on every single TV show in existence. I didn't want to contribute to these fame-seeking journalists and opportunists looking to fill their churches or to get elected because of their self-righteous finger-pointing. They want to blame entertainment? Isn't religion the first real entertainment? People dress up in costumes, sing songs and dedicate themselves in eternal fandom. Everyone will agree that nothing was more entertaining than Clinton shooting off his prick and then his bombs in true political form. And the news -- that's obvious. So is entertainment to blame? I'd like media commentators to ask themselves, because their coverage of the event was some of the most gruesome entertainment any of us have seen.

I think that the National Rifle Association is far too powerful to take on, so most people choose Doom, The Basketball Diaries or yours truly. This kind of controversy does not help me sell records or tickets, and I wouldn't want it to. I'm a controversial artist, one who dares to have an opinion and bothers to create music and videos that challenge people's ideas in a world that is watered-down and hollow. In my work I examine the America we live in, and I've always tried to show people that the devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. So don't expect the end of the world to come one day out of the blue -- it's been happening every day for a long time.


-Marilyn Manson

Many people misjudge MM because of rumours or even the simple fact, as he said in the last paragraph, that he has a different view or opinion and people dont like it. Most of todays artists, if not all, wouldnt dare to do something that didnt fit into the norm, and as such their music and image loses any worth or meaning.
I would say i'd have to live in America to agree or disagree to his views on the society but im sure there are people who would disagree...
What is your view of Marilyn Manson? or basically say anything related to him i dont really care
2 more weeks till Grotesk Burlesk WOOO!

P.S. sorry the link wouldnt work and its too long for one post

[Sween]

A very intresting and well thought out quote from him there. i have to admit i do agree with him on many issues (not least the gun one).

I have to admitt ive allways thought it funny they tried to pin it on manson ive listened to manson so ngs and allthough they are all pretty crap there is nothing in them telling people to go out and kill

[Lalaith]

That's a really interesting article and I am glad that I read it.
I can say that I mostly agree with him. He has thought about his statement and I think he deserves that the people listen to his point of view.
And I appreciate him for being different. Not another clone in this ridiculous world.

[gimli7410]

i dont really have any response to this but i wanna say that i liked his response in bowling for columbine(im pretty sure this isnt the same speech)

also did you know mansons real name is brian hugh warner. just wanted to say that

[Millane]

Originally posted by gimli7410
i dont really have any response to this but i wanna say that i liked his response in bowling for columbine(im pretty sure this isnt the same speech)

also did you know mansons real name is brian hugh warner. just wanted to say that

this was an essay Manson wrote for the Rolling Stone magazine... yeah it always makes me laugh that the Antichrist Superstar has a name like Brian Marilyn Manson suits him a lot better hahaha.

That's a really interesting article and I am glad that I read it.
I can say that I mostly agree with him. He has thought about his statement and I think he deserves that the people listen to his point of view.
And I appreciate him for being different. Not another clone in this ridiculous world.

hmmm one of Mansons great talents is that he can get his point across in a very clear way, unlike some of his music where some people who dont think about it can take it the wrong way. on the 'not being another clone thing' i often wonder how people can take MM as being a bad influence on young people, at school we're urged to be different and thats basically MM's message. How that can be taken as hurting us younguns ill never know

I have to admitt ive allways thought it funny they tried to pin it on manson ive listened to manson so ngs and allthough they are all pretty crap there is nothing in them telling people to go out and kill

again the problem is people have a bad image of him and they look at everything he does in the worst possible context it could be seen in, the people who like him are labelled as freaks or goths automatically for the simple reason that they understand him and his music.

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by Millane

hmmm one of Mansons great talents is that he can get his point across in a very clear way, unlike some of his music where some people who dont think about it can take it the wrong way. on the 'not being another clone thing' i often wonder how people can take MM as being a bad influence on young people, at school we're urged to be different and thats basically MM's message. How that can be taken as hurting us younguns ill never know

In my opinion movies and computer games and lyrics can only influence persons who are already weak and need help. But I wouldn't rate that influence to high.
When I first saw MM I didn't think anything of him. He was just there. I don't know why, but I was never judging him.
But then he appeard on MTV's diary. His statements were really good and you could really see a glimpse of Brian Warner through the whole MM fassade. And I liked what he said.

People complain about peer pressure and the need for young people to be cool and in and to do things that everybody does and then on the other hand they complain abbout a person who is against all these things and does just his own thing.

[Ragnarok]

Originally posted by Millane
Most of todays artists, if not all, wouldnt dare to do something that didnt fit into the norm, and as such their music and image loses any worth or meaning.

Yea, I agree with you that mainstream music artists wouldn't dare try that.. but there are alot of other artists who do expresss themselves freely and don't care if it will affect their image.

Nevermore is a good example, I recommend their album "Politics In Ecstasy".

Politics in Ecstasy

I hate you, the pigs who turn the screws, I hate everything you stand for
I hate the world we've bred, political pigs we've fed, our fathers left us nothing but a dead world
Beyond repair down in despair, our fathers left us nothing
Choking on the influx of technology I realize the politics of ecstasy
And we can't change what's in stone
We've been had. Injustice to the masses, destroy the land and crush the poor
The pigs are fueled by greed, political ways obscene, our fathers left corruption in this dead world
Beyond repair down is despair, our fathers left us nothing
Choking on the puke of their industry, regurgitated propaganda ministry
Freedom's never free, the politics of ecstasy are these:
Freedom's never free, these are the politics of ecstasy:
I hate you , the pigs who turn the screws, I hate everything you stand for
I hate the world we've bred, political pigs we've fed, our fathers left us nothing but a dead world
Beyond repair down in despair, our fathers left us nothing
Choking on the influx of technology I realize the politics of ecstasy
Freedom's never free, the politics of ecstasy are these:
Freedom's never free, the politics of ecstasy are these:
If you take a step back and you realize your home can't be a perfect world
There's still hope the hate you fell will fade, injustice is gone:
Injustice is gone for a little while

[Sheeana]

Well, that sounds like it was ripped off Harrison's "Piggies"

Have you seen the little piggies
crawling in the dirt?
And for all the little piggies
life is getting worse,
always having dirt to play around in.

Have you seen the bigger piggies
in their starched white shirts?
You will find the bigger piggies
stirring up the dirt,
always have clean shirts to play around in.

In their styes with all their backing
they don't care what goes on around.
In their eyes there's something lacking
what they need's a damn good whacking.

Everywhere there's lots of piggies
living piggy lives.
You can see them out for dinner
with their piggy wives
clutching forks and knives to eat their bacon.

[Ornelírë Mistë]

This is my favorite thread I have ever found on Entmoot. I can't say that I disagree with a single thing Manson said. His clarity help me put into words what I have agreed with all along. Difference should be encouraged. People or things or games or anything that seems violent to the media are simply expressing their opinions through what they dislike. People are full of all kinds of opinions, which ones they may present should be examined carefully. People who have been described as "different" have been hounded and bothered. Many instances, they will not tolerate this and simply express what bothers them. In individuals, sometimes this is the only communication. It was true for me a while back...
Too many things are too familiar these days to be taken seriously.
For all the telecommunications we have today, communication is at an all-time low. And I don't mean the spread of news.

[Millane]

Originally posted by Ragnarok
Yea, I agree with you that mainstream music artists wouldn't dare try that.. but there are alot of other artists who do expresss themselves freely and don't care if it will affect their image.

yeah there would be plenty of bands that would and do dare to challenge a set behaviour code but i think a lot of artists would start out that way and then descend to just working for money, they fail to see that maybe other people may appreciate their views and still buy their cds.
OrnelÃ*rë Mistë do you like Marilyn Manson or just like the whole self-expression idea... either way keep it up or we'll all become Mechanical Animals

[gimli7410]

it turns out my english teacher really likes manson. im not sure if its for his music but he likes what he says like in the article in this thread.

[Millane]

Originally posted by Lalaith
But then he appeard on MTV's diary. His statements were really good and you could really see a glimpse of Brian Warner through the whole MM fassade. And I liked what he said.

Marilyn Manson and Brian Warner are one in the same... i havent got the article with me but it was addressing this issue. He says that there is no difference between the two and that is one thing that he has recieved much praise for, being a 'true' artist i cant find that article but ill put it up when i can... here is something i found on the MM site the other day

Johnny Depp speaks on Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory remake
Johnny Depp is keen to take on the lead role in Tim Burtons's, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory remake, but he'll happily step aside if rocker Marilyn Manson wants the part.

Manson and Depp are the only names in the running to recreate the beloved ROALD DAHL eccentric, and Depp admits the rocker would be the perfect Wonka.

He says, "It's an exciting possibility for me to go back and do another film with Tim. It would be a ball. I'll keep all my digits crossed, as it were.

"That said, I'd go and see Manson as Willy Wonka. I'd go and see him in anything."

[posted 9/6/2003 U.S.A.]

i for one would love to see MM play Willy Wonka

only 5 days till GROTESK BURLESK

[Khamûl]

Wait a minute, back up the Oompa Loompa truck here... Marilyn Manson as Willy Wonka?! I think that would be seriously disturbing to little kids.

[Millane]

Originally posted by Khamûl
Wait a minute, back up the Oompa Loompa truck here... Marilyn Manson as Willy Wonka?! I think that would be seriously disturbing to little kids.

yeah it would be pretty ****ed for the kiddies, but i think if Tim Burton is doing it it's gunna be disturbing whoever plays Wonka. It annoyed the **** out of me when Craig David got his mug on some crappy tv show and they (him and the interviewer) started talking about how Craig David must be the only one to be inspired by Charlie and the Chocolate factory, fool had obviously never heard of Marilyn Manson

[Millane]

ohhhh i have finally been to the GROTESK GURLESK and now i can fully appreciate Manson to the degree he deserves... There were so many cool fans their, of course there were the losers that rocked up in metallica, soad and even one brave soul in a RHCP shirts, and their was a sick bloke that was dressed up as a girl talking about the time he met MM, he said he was great but M.W Gacy was a bit of a loser so he stole his belt...
i got excited at one point when he asked some girl her name which sounded very elvish and i said that to my friend and then Manson said 'sounds like some sorta Lord of the Rings ****'

has anyone seen the This is the New **** video, it has him singing to a fake crowd (the real crowds are so much better) but it has his set and it was so incredibly cool that i wont attemtp to describe it... He dressed up as Mickey Mouse and did its a small world after all which was great... and then when the lights came back on and everyone thought it had finished we heard 'we hate love, we love hate, we hate love, we love hate...' and he came back and did Irresponsible Hate Anthem to finish it off.

the start of the concert was soooo funny, Mandy Kane opened for MM and he came out and tried to look cool by opening vic tinnies at the start of each song and he threw one into the crowd and someone threw it back at him, then the big chant of "**** YOU, WE WANT MANSON" went up and the wanker had the nerve to say im better than Manson... then i think MK got a bit angry coz John 5 was on the side getting his guitar ready and someone screamed out 'ITS JOHN 5' and he waved and basically destroyed the song... anyway i can talk for hours about this so ill stop now

[Comic Book Guy]

Bah, Alice Cooper does it far better.

[gimli7410]

Originally posted by Millane
There were so many cool fans their, of course there were the losers that rocked up in metallica, soad

hey hey dont knock soad they are goodand mettalica is god so....

[Millane]

Originally posted by gimli7410
hey hey dont knock soad they are goodand mettalica is god so....

ohhh im not having a go at the different bands (cept maybe RHCP ) but why go to a MM concert in a SOAD shirt?

Bah, Alice Cooper does it far better.

ohhhh man ive become addicted to Manson since GB... normally i would laugh at someone who went to the Big Day Out, but if Manson will be their i will. I cant say im the biggest Alice Cooper fan but i agree with the reporters that have claimed Manson as the best performer of this (if not all) time

[gimli7410]

Originally posted by Millane
ohhh im not having a go at the different bands (cept maybe RHCP ) but why go to a MM concert in a SOAD shirt?

true true. make fun of rhcp as much as you want though