Opinions/Theories about the Nature and State of Bomadil (Tom)

[Radagast]

I did a search on this and it returned nothing and I noticed that most of the posts on LotR Books don't seem to be discussing much to do with the actual books (no criticism intended there).
So, I started this to hear the many varying opinions that my fellow Mooters may hold on the enigma of Tom Bombadil. Bring forth your obscure theories!

Okay, to get the ball rolling here's my thoughts on old Tom.

Tom is one of the oldest if not the oldest on Middle Earth. Tom remarks:

'But you are young and I am old. Eldest, that's what I am. Mark my words, my young friends: Tom was here before the river and the trees; Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn, He made paths before the Big People and saw the Little People arriving. He was here before the kings and graves and barrow-wights. When the Elves passed westward Tom was here already, before the seas were bent. He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless- before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'

Tom is called Iarwain Ben-adar which means "old and without father" by the Elves.
'Without father' rules out the possibility of him being mortal and he is certainly not an elf. Seeing things as early as he did (acorn raindrop etc) probably implies that he was present at the creation of the world or was himself, one of the first things to be created.
Which opens up the possibility that Tom may be a Maia, of course it also opens the possibility of him being a Valar but that is also extremely unlikely from reading the Silmarillion.

Those are my thoughts so far but no doubt I'll be enlightened as to what other Mooters think?

[Christiana]

I read a magnificant essay in another thread about this.

[Radagast]

Hmm is no one really interested?

[Lizra]

ha ha, I honestly don't think he "fits in". I didn't when I first read it, use to joke about the guy. He sure is neat tho! I'm no scholar, I just read LoTR and the Hobbit for pleasure. Someone could write a new ending where Bombadil was involved.

[Comic Book Guy]

ha ha, I honestly don't think he "fits in". I didn't when I first read it, use to joke about the guy. He sure is neat tho! I'm no scholar, I just read LoTR and the Hobbit for pleasure. Someone could write a new ending where Bombadil was involved.

He is in a way, Gandalf visits Bombadil before leaving Middle-Earth with the Hobbits being disapointed that they didn't get to see him.

Anybody ever heard of the Bombadil/Witch King theory? It's a great theory.

[Tar-Elendil]

any theory is better than the one about tulkas-tom.

[Comic Book Guy]

Bombadil/Witch King Theory

1. We never hear of Tom at all during the whole of the First Age. The Nine Rings aren't forged until the Second Age. QED.

2. You never see the two of them together.

3. In the first part of Fellowship of the Ring, the Nazgul are sent to the Shire to look for the wandering Baggins. Interestingly, Tom says to Frodo at the dinner-table: "...I was waiting for you. We heard news of you, and learned that you were wandering... But Tom had an errand there, that he dared not hinder" (Fellowship p.137 hardback, emphasis mine: note the fear Tom has of his master, Sauron!).

4. In Tom's questioning of the Hobbits, JRRT notes that "there was a glint in his eyes when he heard of the Riders." (Fellowship p. 144) I think he was concerned that his double-life might have been noticed. Interestingly, Tom immediately changes the subject of conversation!
Furthermore, the One Ring had no effect on Tom - which seems consistent with Tolkien's observations about how the Nazgul would have handled the same priceless object (Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, #246): "They were... in no way deceived as to the real lordship of the Ring."

5. It's also interesting to note that Tom could see Frodo clearly while Frodo was wearing the Ring (Fellowship p. 144 hardback) - just as the Witch-king could see Frodo clearly while he was wearing the Ring at Weathertop! (Fellowship p. 208 hardback)

6. Perhaps most damning, however, is the incident with the Barrow-wights (Fellowship pp. 151-155), where Tom - with nothing more than a few simple words (p. 154) - commands the Barrow-wight to leave. And it does, without argument. Why would the Wight be so completely under Tom's control? Because in his alternate guise as the Witch-king of Angmar, Tom ordered the Wight to inhabit the barrow in the first place! Turning to Return of the King, Appendix A, p. 321, "evil spirits out of Angmar... entered into the deserted mounds and dwelt there." Obviously the Witch-king was reponsible for sending the wights there; just as obviously, the Witch-king (disguised as Tom) would be capable of ordering them to leave!
(This is related to another passage, which has since been brought to my attention. On Fellowship page 158 hardback, Tom is guiding the Hobbits back towards the Road when he gazes towards the borders of Cardolan. "Tom said that it had once been the boundary of a kingdom, but a very long time ago. He seemed to remember something sad about it, and would not say much." Since Tom, as the Witch-king, was the one who destroyed the kingdom of Cardolan, it's little wonder that he wouldn't say much about his involvement. Perhaps his remembering "something sad" reveals some remorse at being the instrument of Cardolan's destruction...?)

...Yep: I think we have an airtight case here.

...It's worth noting that, after the Witch-king was dead, Gandalf said he was "going to have a long talk with Bombadil" (Return of the King, p. 275). Curiously, he never tells anyone about the meeting later... and he's right there at the Grey Havens at the end of the book, undelayed it seems by long conversation. I think we can therefore theorize that Gandalf made it to the Old Forest, but that Tom (once the so-called "Witch-king" had died) was nowhere to be found!

...Of course, all this brings up the curiosity of motive. What would make the Witch-King of Angmar sport such a double identity? I suppose that the Witch-king, once of proud Numenorean ancestry, felt trapped by the guise of evil which Sauron had tricked him into, and in the fullness of time forged this alternate identity for himself so that he could occasionally feel happy, helpful, noble, and more at one with himself and his lineage. The situation is perhaps analagous to a crossdresser who, feeling trapped in a man's body, would occasionally assume the identity of a woman. It therefore makes sense that the Witch-king's other identity would be so peculiarly enigmatic, and perhaps sheds light on JRRT's observation in Letters #144: "And even in a mythical Age there must be some enigmas, as there always are. Tom Bombadil is one (intentionally)."

...Who else would be aware of Tom's double-life, I wonder? Since Tom repeatedly claims to have been around "before the river and the trees", and indeed even claims to be older than the Ents (Fellowship p. 142), surely the eldest of the Elves would know he was lying. Elrond plays along with Tom in public, being kind enough not to reveal his secret, but also seems to know that Tom and the Witch-king are one and the same; hence his refusal to give the Ring to Tom for safekeeping (Fellowship p. 278-9): "Power to defy the Enemy is not in him."

[Tar-Elendil]

my theory:
he is a crazy maiar.

[BeardofPants]

He seems more powerful than a "mere" maiar... But I guess it's possible...

Could he be one of the Istari? *thinks* No... I guess not. Gandalf would know who he was then... Um...

Could he be an unmentioned Ainur? Aaaarrggh...

[Tar-Elendil]

tom wears bue doesnt he? mebbe hes one of the blue istari?:P

[Christiana]

I think that he is Aule.

[Comic Book Guy]

If Nolendil was here, he'd say Tom's a Knee Walking Turkey, or whatever.

I think that he is Aule.

Aule wasn't a controlling person but a creating person, when he created the dwarves he "Desired no lordship". Bombadil always says that he is the master.

Alatar and Pallando went into the lands east of Mordor.

[azalea]

So would Goldberry be the Witch King's secret mistress?

[galadriel88]

Interesting theories, esp. the Witch King one. Me? I just think he's a really cool guy who goes around singing all the time.

[emplynx]

Originally posted by Comic Book Guy
If Nolendil was here, he'd say Tom's a Knee Walking Turkey, or whatever.

One of the many inside jokes I have been left out of.

[Tar-Elendil]

Alatar and Pallando went into the lands east of Mordor.

and? they could have returned once upon a time:P
i dont see any similarities between Aule and Tom.

[Andúril]

No. Aule could have opened his can-o-whoopass on Sauron, his old padawan...

[Jador]

I believe that Tom must be a Miar,to have been there before even Melkor,he must also have had some power to survive the first war's in which the earth was boken and re-shaped.
I think he's a good guy! Another thought,what about Goldberry,if she is the daughter of the river,then what does that make her,a Miar also?
To be honest,they are both enigma's,and we will probebly never understand Tolkien's plan for them(If indeed he had one)

[Comic Book Guy]

and? they could have returned once upon a time:P

Tolkien said in a letter

They went as Emissaries to distant regions, East and South, dar out of Numenorian Range... I suspect that they were founders or begginners of secret cults that outlasted the fall of Sauron

This means they would be occupied by their cults at the War of the Ring.

[Christiana]

Hey guys, I just got Creatures of Tolkien,& it says in there

He was a very strange and merry spirit...Always singing or speaking in rhymes,he seemed a nonsensical and eccentric being, yet he was absolute master of the Old Forrest...,and no evil within the World was strong enough to touch him in his realm.

and also...

other spirits...lived within the Old Forest.One of these was the River-woman of the Windywithle,and another was her daughter Goldberry...

Hows that