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Old 11-07-2008, 11:00 AM   #1
jammi567
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Wizards from 1000 to 2800's Third Age

I know that we gotsome infomation about what they did during this period of time from the appendices, but is there anything else that we can infer them doing during this mysterious period?

I only went to that date, because after that, we know a lot of details about that peroid (even if some of it is contridictory!)
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Old 11-07-2008, 11:53 AM   #2
mithrand1r
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Gandalf

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Originally Posted by jammi568 View Post
I know that we gotsome infomation about what they did during this period of time from the appendices, but is there anything else that we can infer them doing during this mysterious period?

I only went to that date, because after that, we know a lot of details about that peroid (even if some of it is contridictory!)
They (the wizards) could not prevent the loss of a finger of a certain hobbit.

I think they were sent to ME to help prepare and fortify the free peoples of ME against the coming darkness of Sauron's return.

Not much is stated in LOTR about what the wizards do. Saruman was held in highest esteem by men. I gather he must have done something that men saw noteworthy.

Mithrandir and Radagast worked in their own way. I do not know anything about the other two.
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Old 11-07-2008, 01:29 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mithrand1r View Post
Not much is stated in LOTR about what the wizards do. Saruman was held in highest esteem by men. I gather he must have done something that men saw noteworthy.

Mithrandir and Radagast worked in their own way. I do not know anything about the other two.
We know that the wizards sat in the White Council - Saruman was even head of it, even though Galadriel would have preferred to have Gandalf in that position. In the UT especially there are glimpses of the work in that Council.

In the UT there are also some more details of an event that is only mentioned briefly in the Appendices - the Long Winter.
From The Tale of Years, LotR App.B:
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2758-9: The Long Winter follows. Great suffering and loss of life in Eriador and Rohan. Gandalf comes to the aid of the Shire-folk.
From The Quest of Erebor, UT:
Quote:
And then there was the Shire-folk. I began to have a warm place in my heart for them in the Long Winter, which none of you can remember. They were very hard put to it then: one of the worst pinches they have been in, dying of cold, and starving in the dreadful dearth that followed. But that was the time to see their courage, and their pity one for another. It was by their pity as much as by their tough uncomplaining courage that they survived.
As Gandalf tells here, he got to know the Hobbits properly that winter, as he was coming to their aid - bringing provisions and warm clothing, I would guess.
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Old 11-09-2008, 06:50 AM   #4
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Actually, jammi, it would be nice if you narrow your question somewhat - what exactly do you wish to discuss?
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Old 11-09-2008, 07:09 AM   #5
jammi567
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I sppose I want to know about the wizard's activities between that period of time. Such as: Did Gandalf help with the problems of the North? What was Saraman doing before he got the Keys to Orthanc? You know, those kind of questions.

Hope that helps.
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Old 11-09-2008, 07:57 AM   #6
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Thanks, jammi. You realise, though, that it would be mostly speculation, as there is nothing beyond what we could read in the Appendices and drafts for the appendices in HOME 12. And there is so little about the Wizards.

Did Gandalf help with the problems of the North?
I guess he did. He was supposed to organize resistance to evil, to make Elves and Men work together, also to add the heirs of Isildur put away their differences and unite. We know he had been true to his mission, so - yes.

When Gandalf came to the North, sometime after TA 1000, the old Arnor was already divided into three petty states: Arthedain, Cardolan and Rhudaur. They were fighting among themselves for possession of Amon Sul and the Great Palantir stationed there. By 1349, two of the states: Arthedain and Cardolan, became united and in the war of 1356 they fought together on one side. We can suppose that Gandalf had a hand in it.
However, he missed, or was unable to prevent the rise of Angmar. I guess he didn't understand straight away who and what was the new King of Angmar. Also he was unable to save Rhudaur. The Dunedain there were few and Gandalf likely had little influence on the Hillmen, if any.
By the way, I have an impression that at the beginning, Gandalf was too interested in Elves and less so in Men.

The war of 1409 came as a disaster. Amon Sul was destroyed, Fornost almost taken, Cardolan destroyed etc. Elves saved the day, defeating Angmar, but I think they joined the fray only because Angmar had attacked and besieged Rivendell directly. Maybe it was Gandalf who persuaded the Elves to do more than to break the siege of Rivendell.

Gandalf likely helped with the building of the coalition of Elves and Men in 1975. Firstly the Gondoreans agreed to sent help to Arnor, even despite the fact that the relationships between Earnil and Arvedui were strained after the latter's claim to the throne of Gondor. Here, I think, not only Gandalf had helped, but also Saruman. Saruman, influential with the court of Gondor, could have persuaded Earnil that the loss of the North to Angmar would be worse disaster than to support his rival. So Earnil did send help - albeit too late for Arvedui.
Gandalf likely worked on Elves, persuading them to help Men this time, despite the fact that this time no Elven strongholds had been directly attacked by Angmar. He managed to make Cirdan agree to receive Earnur's fleet and send an Elven contingent to battle. The decision of Galadriel to send help from Lorien to join with Rivendell's forces may be entirely due to Gandalf's influence.
I wonder - had Gandalf himself been in this battle in the Ettenmoors which ended Angmar and where Glorfindel made his prophecy? Maybe not - he was mostly working behind the scenes at this time.

Last edited by Gordis : 11-09-2008 at 07:59 AM.
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