i hate musicals - Page 3

Galenavar · 09-30-2002, 05:24 PM

Quote:

the set I envision for The One Ring is dependent on the story,; how else to bring The Mines of Moria or the Battle of Pellonor Fields etc., to the stage, rather than trying to bring the audience in because of a set. I think in some scenes, the story demands it.

Here here! I would love to see how the battle scenes and chases by the Ringwraiths would be portrayed, and especially the Mines. For One Ring, a big impressive set will definately be necessary at one point or another(at least), just to get the full effect of the story.

>leans back as eyes glaze over, imagining the possibilities<

galadriel · 10-01-2002, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Galenavar
The people in the movie just didn't...sound as good? As right?

Sometimes the interpretation just isn't right. For instance, the guy at my high school who played Sky Masterson in Guys and Dolls was *so* good. I swear he's going to be famous someday. Then I went and saw a commercial production, and the actor they cast for Sky was an ugly creep! He was disturbing where he should have been charismatic. It was such a tragedy!!!

Hasty Ent · 10-01-2002, 09:28 PM

Hello hama1,

[QUOTE]Originally posted by hama1
Actualy I do not think Les MIz has any "flying" set elements but rather the rotating sets that Galadriel refers to...although no hydraulics...the rotating stage relies on a huge chain and the movement of the set peices that are driven onto the stage rely on electronics not hydraulics...(admittedly a minor point). [/QUOTE

You're absolutely right, and I stand (sit) corrected.

[QUOTE]However, the relative granduer of the set I envision for The One Ring is dependent on the story,; how else to bring The Mines of Moria or the Battle of Pellonor Fields etc., to the stage, rather than trying to bring the audience in because of a set. I think in some scenes, the story demands it] [/QUOTE

I agree. The operas I've seen varied in their scale depending on the narrative. My distrust of big budget theater/film stems from too many productions using sets to camouflage bad scripts. This is certainly not directed to you personally, only a generalization.

[QUOTE]Just FYI, I believe the original capitalization for Les Miz was something in the area of $8 million. The One Ring will probably be double that. [/QUOTE

What will that mean for ticket prices?

hama1 · 10-01-2002, 11:09 PM

Obviously ticket prices will be determined by a number of things and ultimately be the decision of the producers. It will depend on the theater and on the market in general. I believe currently the top ticket price on Broadway for orchestra seats is in the $120 to $100 range. My guess is that the show would have to be staged at one of the larger Broadway houses such as the Ford Center, The Broadway or Marquis which all seat 1400 to 1500 people. The least expensive seats would probably be in the $35-$40 range providing for a potential weekly gross of roughly $750,000 or so.

Goldberry1 · 10-02-2002, 04:50 PM

i cant stand musicals either, but who's making this thing? i've never even heard about it!

Agburanar · 10-03-2002, 04:16 AM

The flying element I can think of from 'Les Mis' is the bit where Javert throws himself off the bridge and it goes up. A stunning effect by most accounts.

Galenavar · 10-03-2002, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Javert throws himself off the bridge and it goes up

I loved that part!!!! Yeah, that could be interpreted as morbid. Anyway, it's just one of those things where you, well at least me, sit there stunned, whether you knew it would happen or not. That's the only flying set piece I can think of also.

Ethereal · 10-06-2002, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Goldberry1
who's making this thing? i've never even heard about it!

i've never heard of it either!! who IS making it, and where is it being performed?

Giroth · 10-07-2002, 05:33 PM

Well, I think the original post was just an opinion.Magicshrivve just went on this board to state his or her opinion.

In my opinion, musicals are stupid also.But that is just MY thought

hama1 · 10-07-2002, 09:47 PM

For information about The One Ring go to the website. There is a link on the main page at Tolkien Trail.

Hama

Agburanar · 10-08-2002, 10:15 AM

Giroth, what is stupid? Why can anything be defined as stupid? Pointless maybe, gerogatory perhaps, tasteless maybe. Stupid is a very general opinion to have of anything.

Just an opinion!

Giroth · 10-09-2002, 02:11 PM

Ok,Ok, pointless.

.......my opinion..........

Blackboar · 11-21-2002, 01:52 PM

LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical.
Imagine the story being sung all the way
through. The chracters would be different
and you can't fight propaly. Well you could
but it wouln't be realistic. And what about
when Gandalf falls into the shadow? And
when Frodo puts the ring on? It just wouln't
be the same!

Blackboar · 11-21-2002, 01:54 PM

I would still see it though!!!

Galenavar · 11-21-2002, 11:48 PM

Blackboar- 2 things

Numero uno, I can't help but lol to the fact that you'd still see it. Hooray! Good for you.

Number two, who says LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical? I know it's your opinion, but...who says? This may be more for hama to speak about, but I'm going to anyway. What's wrong with it being sung all the way through? The characters would still be the same characters we know and love, you can do extremely realistic fighting onstage, and everything else, well...it's a show! It's not supposed to be the exact same and most shows leave something to the audience's imagination anyway. Still, it's incredible some of the stuff you can do on a stage! Sorry, but I'm just trying to understand your pov better.

hama1 · 11-22-2002, 02:28 AM

Galvenar,

Thank you for your spirited defence. I almost feel as Frodo to your Aragon...defending me at every turn. However, Blackboar raises some excellent points.

Quote:

LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical.

If The One Ring or it's telling of LotR is ever as good as a musical as LotR is as a novel than I am a helluva a lot more talented than I (or anyone else for that matter) have ever given myself credit for. My goal was not to write something as good as LotR. My goal was to adapt LotR into as moving and well crafted a musical as could possibly be achieved or perhaps more humbly, as I could possibly achieve. Perhaps an obtuse reference but I don't think West Side Story is good as Romeo and Juliet, I don't think My Fair Lady is as good as Pygmilion nor Les MIZ as good as Victor Hugo's original work. However, I think all three are excellent musicals.

Quote:

Imagine the story being sung all the way

Well that IS the way I originally imagined it. However, my imagination got the best of me. It didn't work as a sung through operatic musical...or at least my meager talents couldn't make it work. So, as you can see by reading the script, it is not sung through but rather a more standard musical format with libretto and lyrics.

As for the "effects"...Gandalf falling into the abyss and Frodo putting on the ring, etc...I think the stage effects possible today are quite amazing but you are right. They won't be the same. I can match neither the power of the human imagination nor that of computer generated imaging. The challenges of live stage are very different. Whereas Peter Jackson could refilm a scene eighty times for a week to get what he wanted just once, I have to write a script and the director and creative team have to stage it so that we get it right every time eight times a week.

I luckily have to things going for me. The first is that audiences at live performances have a willingness to suspend disbelief. They understand the limitations of live theater and their minds ask only that you make it look enough like something is happening to allow them to believe that it is. I was in a National Tour of Romeo and Juliet and as Mercucio I died eight times a week. Twice on Wednesdays and twice on Saturday. I also came out for my curtain call at the end of each performance. The audience knew I wasn't dead but they were willing to suspend disbelief. As an example in The One Ring, I don't need Gandalf to fall. I need the set to rise. From the perspective of the audience the effect and affect is the same. The second thing I have going for me is the power of music. If I have written them as well as I think I have, Aragorn's "One More Tomorrow", Gandalf's "Beyond the Questions", Eowyn's "With His Words" and Sam's "I am Your Friend" and of course the duet between Sam and Frodo at the end of te show will evoke enough emotion in the audience as any passage in the original novel.

Blackboar...I hope this answers some of your questions...I do believe this is one of my longest responses in months.

Blackboar · 12-07-2002, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Galenavar
Blackboar- 2 things

Numero uno, I can't help but lol to the fact that you'd still see it. Hooray! Good for you.

Number two, who says LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical? I know it's your opinion, but...who says? This may be more for hama to speak about, but I'm going to anyway. What's wrong with it being sung all the way through? The characters would still be the same characters we know and love, you can do extremely realistic fighting onstage, and everything else, well...it's a show! It's not supposed to be the exact same and most shows leave something to the audience's imagination anyway. Still, it's incredible some of the stuff you can do on a stage! Sorry, but I'm just trying to understand your pov better.

Actually, now I've read all the lyrics and script, I think it would be really good!!

hama1 · 12-14-2002, 02:08 AM

Blackboar,

I am honored that you have taken the time to read the script and even more so that you actually like it. I hope it will be god too!

Hama

Elenessiel · 12-27-2002, 04:14 AM

Although I understand why Peter Jackson and company discarded nearly all of Tolkein's songs and poems, I miss them. One of my favorite complaints about the trilogy is that it is full of maps and songs. I love maps and songs. May excessive maps and songs persist and multiply. Music, for me, conveys power and emotion that mere words are unable to encompass. Howard Shore's score is incredible, and wonderfully enhances the magic of the story. So how much cooler would it be to unite the power of the words and the music? Thank you so much for bringing the music in LotR alive!
Oh, and I too heartily enjoy spontaneous outburts of song and dance. I dream of spontaneous outbursts of song and dance. A current e-bay commercial features just such as scene. I love it. My whole family loves it. However, I think our own recreations of musical numbers would be a little more successful if we didn't carry a tune in a leaky bucket.

hama1 · 12-29-2002, 02:12 AM

Ellenesiel...

You have a unique and seemingly joyous outlook on life. Congratulations...and never lose it. Your comment about the power and emotion of music conveying more than mere words could hope to is why there is musical theatre.

Hama

10-01-2002, 09:28 PM	#43
Hasty Ent Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 516	Hello hama1, [QUOTE]Originally posted by hama1 Actualy I do not think Les MIz has any "flying" set elements but rather the rotating sets that Galadriel refers to...although no hydraulics...the rotating stage relies on a huge chain and the movement of the set peices that are driven onto the stage rely on electronics not hydraulics...(admittedly a minor point). [/QUOTE You're absolutely right, and I stand (sit) corrected. [QUOTE]However, the relative granduer of the set I envision for The One Ring is dependent on the story,; how else to bring The Mines of Moria or the Battle of Pellonor Fields etc., to the stage, rather than trying to bring the audience in because of a set. I think in some scenes, the story demands it] [/QUOTE I agree. The operas I've seen varied in their scale depending on the narrative. My distrust of big budget theater/film stems from too many productions using sets to camouflage bad scripts. This is certainly not directed to you personally, only a generalization. [QUOTE]Just FYI, I believe the original capitalization for Les Miz was something in the area of $8 million. The One Ring will probably be double that. [/QUOTE What will that mean for ticket prices? __________________ Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it. George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

10-03-2002, 04:16 AM	#46
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	The flying element I can think of from 'Les Mis' is the bit where Javert throws himself off the bridge and it goes up. A stunning effect by most accounts. __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

10-08-2002, 10:15 AM	#51
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	Giroth, what is stupid? Why can anything be defined as stupid? Pointless maybe, gerogatory perhaps, tasteless maybe. Stupid is a very general opinion to have of anything. Just an opinion! __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

11-21-2002, 11:48 PM	#55
Galenavar Elven Warrior Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: WI Posts: 129	Blackboar- 2 things Numero uno, I can't help but lol to the fact that you'd still see it. Hooray! Good for you. Number two, who says LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical? I know it's your opinion, but...who says? This may be more for hama to speak about, but I'm going to anyway. What's wrong with it being sung all the way through? The characters would still be the same characters we know and love, you can do extremely realistic fighting onstage, and everything else, well...it's a show! It's not supposed to be the exact same and most shows leave something to the audience's imagination anyway. Still, it's incredible some of the stuff you can do on a stage! Sorry, but I'm just trying to understand your pov better. __________________ Galenavar Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo If there's no magic, there's no meaning.

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10-01-2002, 11:09 PM	#44
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Obviously ticket prices will be determined by a number of things and ultimately be the decision of the producers. It will depend on the theater and on the market in general. I believe currently the top ticket price on Broadway for orchestra seats is in the $120 to $100 range. My guess is that the show would have to be staged at one of the larger Broadway houses such as the Ford Center, The Broadway or Marquis which all seat 1400 to 1500 people. The least expensive seats would probably be in the $35-$40 range providing for a potential weekly gross of roughly $750,000 or so.

10-02-2002, 04:50 PM	#45
Goldberry1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: DC or Delaware, depending on the time of year Posts: 244	i cant stand musicals either, but who's making this thing? i've never even heard about it!

10-07-2002, 05:33 PM	#49
Giroth The Dragonqueen Join Date: May 2002 Location: sunny Cali! Posts: 423	Well, I think the original post was just an opinion.Magicshrivve just went on this board to state his or her opinion. In my opinion, musicals are stupid also.But that is just MY thought

10-07-2002, 09:47 PM	#50
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	For information about The One Ring go to the website. There is a link on the main page at Tolkien Trail. Hama

10-09-2002, 02:11 PM	#52
Giroth The Dragonqueen Join Date: May 2002 Location: sunny Cali! Posts: 423	Ok,Ok, pointless. .......my opinion..........

11-21-2002, 01:52 PM	#53
Blackboar Legolas's beloved sister and Queen of the Wood Elves of Mirkwood Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Under the hill at Bag-end, Hobbiton the Shire Or Rivendell,I can't remember!!!!!!!!!! Posts: 1,086	LotR just wouln't be as good in a musical. Imagine the story being sung all the way through. The chracters would be different and you can't fight propaly. Well you could but it wouln't be realistic. And what about when Gandalf falls into the shadow? And when Frodo puts the ring on? It just wouln't be the same!

11-21-2002, 01:54 PM	#54
Blackboar Legolas's beloved sister and Queen of the Wood Elves of Mirkwood Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Under the hill at Bag-end, Hobbiton the Shire Or Rivendell,I can't remember!!!!!!!!!! Posts: 1,086	I would still see it though!!!

12-14-2002, 02:08 AM	#58
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Blackboar, I am honored that you have taken the time to read the script and even more so that you actually like it. I hope it will be god too! Hama

12-27-2002, 04:14 AM	#59
Elenessiel Hobbit Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Not Nebraska Posts: 17	Although I understand why Peter Jackson and company discarded nearly all of Tolkein's songs and poems, I miss them. One of my favorite complaints about the trilogy is that it is full of maps and songs. I love maps and songs. May excessive maps and songs persist and multiply. Music, for me, conveys power and emotion that mere words are unable to encompass. Howard Shore's score is incredible, and wonderfully enhances the magic of the story. So how much cooler would it be to unite the power of the words and the music? Thank you so much for bringing the music in LotR alive! Oh, and I too heartily enjoy spontaneous outburts of song and dance. I dream of spontaneous outbursts of song and dance. A current e-bay commercial features just such as scene. I love it. My whole family loves it. However, I think our own recreations of musical numbers would be a little more successful if we didn't carry a tune in a leaky bucket.

12-29-2002, 02:12 AM	#60
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Ellenesiel... You have a unique and seemingly joyous outlook on life. Congratulations...and never lose it. Your comment about the power and emotion of music conveying more than mere words could hope to is why there is musical theatre. Hama