i hate musicals - Page 2

Faramir · 08-07-2002, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magicshrivve
Musicals are stupid. There should have never been a LOTR musical. I hate musicals. >: (

Good for you. Next?

hama1 · 08-10-2002, 12:42 AM

I think the ABBA musical you are referring to is Mamma Mia! and as far as I know it has done actually quite well. As far as using JRRT's lyrics I actually do very little of that as you can see by looking at the Lyrics page on the site. Rather I try to incorporate his prose into my own lyrics and yes I have written my own melodies/music for them. While I I know I risk the wrath of other Tolkien Lovers here, I feel Tolkien's lyrics leave a soemthing to be desired in as far as adapting them to a musical format.

Galenavar · 08-11-2002, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Of course it's really silly for people to break out into song.

Just thought I'd say that even though it seems silly, it happens a whole lot. Well, in my life anyway. I, and my family, will quite randomly just break out into song on a daily basis. We feel like singing, so we sing! When I go to drama meetings at school, if someone is humming something, chances are, we all join in!

It is wonderful to break out into song. It really does relieve stress when you can start singing and not worry about what everyone else thinks. I reccomend a daily dose of song, at least once a day, to relieve unwanted stress and make the world seem a better place.

hama1 · 08-11-2002, 11:15 PM

Galenavar is a wise Hobbit....and Hobbits are known to break out into song at any moment...

janus13 · 08-18-2002, 09:44 PM

yes, truly, hama1. does your musical have any good hobbit-songs we could break out into?

janus13 · 08-18-2002, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hama1
While I I know I risk the wrath of other Tolkien Lovers here, I feel Tolkien's lyrics leave a soemthing to be desired in as far as adapting them to a musical format.

you have a point, I guess. many of the songs in the books are just breaks from the action, whereas the songs in musicals are supposed to advance the story line. whether they ever do or not i am beginning to doubt, since i just finished the run of a musical where a good third of the songs were scene change covers. i suppose you don't have time to put in any songs that don't have much to do with the plot..... i'm lamenting the fact that audiences are too impatient for more than 2 1/2 hours of GOOD, QUALITY THEATRE! i mean jeez. can't we just have more intermissions?

ok, realizing now that this may not be what you had in mind about adapting lyrics at all. clarify? I think Tolkein's songs are quite good.... i've played some of them on the guitar myself.

hama1 · 08-19-2002, 12:05 AM

Played them on the guitar? To what music? Or did you let your own creativity and love of Tolkien inspire you to develop your own melodies?

As far a s Tolkien's shortcomings as a lyricist I would suggest that most of his lyrics use a simple A.B.B.A OR A.B.A.B. rhyme scheme. Are some of his metaphors powerful yes but ingeneral it is rather simple stuff...but then he wasn't trying to write for musicals and was probably trying to stay within the dialectic of the lanbguage structure that infused his work.

janus13 · 08-20-2002, 08:36 PM

ok, i see what you mean. simple rhyming structure in a musical would make the audience go to sleep.

i make up my own melodies when playing Tolkein's songs on the guitar.... have to have some part of it be original, right?

have you looked at the "I made a song" thread in the books forum? as a lyricist you would probably be interested. for those songs we have to use already existing tunes so other people know what the song is supposed to sound like, although i don't know why we bother, because no one ever knows the songs we're using anyway

hama1 · 08-24-2002, 12:36 AM

I haven't checked out "I made a song" but I will, I will.

entss89 · 09-05-2002, 04:57 PM

IF YOU HATE MUSICALS THEN YOU SHOULD HAVE NEVER WENT IN HERE!

SORRY IF I UPSET YOU!

galadriel · 09-13-2002, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Galenavar
I, and my family, will quite randomly just break out into song on a daily basis. We feel like singing, so we sing!

Actually, I sing a lot too. And I have a bad voice! After school, when me and my friends are bored, we start singing songs (too often musicals) in the hallway. Rocky Horror, Guys and Dolls, and Buffy the Musical (yes, there was a musical episode of Buffy. It was funny!) are our personal favorites. Sure, we get weird looks, but that's just part of the fun!

Agburanar · 09-16-2002, 08:19 AM

Haha. Yes. The musical Buffy was quite, erm, individual...

I like it!

galadriel · 09-16-2002, 09:59 PM

"Bunnies... it must be *bunnies*!!!" <entmooters blink and run in the other direction.>
Uh, yeah.

Agburanar · 09-24-2002, 10:50 AM

We're doing 'HONK!' at the moment...

It's such a great show. I don't think it would work with LoTR, though it would be interesting to try and fit in as many puns as possible. It could be very funny...

Hasty Ent · 09-24-2002, 07:36 PM

Not too crazy about musicals, but I love opera... I would be first in line to see LotR as an opera. Of course, any one ever see Wagner's Ring Cycle? Not the same story, but it certainly shares many of the same themes. Most of the musicals that I've seen simply don't have the depth and scope of opera... And you need plenty of both for Tolkien.

hama1 · 09-26-2002, 12:28 AM

Hasty,

Thank you for the post...and I agree...LotR would be wonderful as an opera. Unfortunately or perhaps not, I have no pretentious of greatness. I write musicals. However, as for depth and scope in musicals, have you ever seen Les Miz, Miss Saigon or Ragtime?

Hasty Ent · 09-27-2002, 07:51 PM

Hello hama1,
Les Miz is the only one of the three I saw, and I hated it. A great story, but the production was so over the top I found myself watching the flying scenery (and mentally calculating the budget) instead of entering the world of Victor Hugo. I wouldn't mind seeing Miss Saigon or Ragtime, but it seems that these productions (as well as anything Andrew Lloyd Weber produces) are wildly expensive. When I do go to theater I try to go to small local productions mounted on shoestring budgets. That seems to leave the success of the play up to the script and the actors (!!!) instead of whether there is enough money to bring in a helicopter. All too often big budget musicals rely on the flash of the set to appeal to audiences (much like Hollywood blockbusters).

PS And what's this about no pretention to greatness? You should, no, you must aspire to greatness no matter what you do. After all, isn't every creative endeavor about transcendence?

galadriel · 09-27-2002, 10:11 PM

Hasty Ent, the fancy-schmancy production of Les Miserables you saw sounds like the one I saw in New York, with a rotating hydraulics set. It was a bit showy, but the actors were so terrific that the set didn't bother me.

However, I agree; I love local plays/musicals. My school has a really wonderful drama program. We win a lot of awards.

I'm not actually involved with drama, but I'm a groupie; I go to all the productions. In fact, after seeing my school's version of Guys and Dolls and a commercial production, I actually preferred a few of the actors from my high school! The simplicity definitely adds to the show and helps you to appreciate the talent of everyone involved.

hama1 · 09-29-2002, 01:46 AM

Hasty,

As for my pretentions...I was simply trying to say that I do not feel I could write an opera...I write musicals. Actualy I do not think Les MIz has any "flying" set elements but rather the rotating sets that Galadriel refers to...although no hydraulics...the rotating stage relies on a huge chain and the movement of the set peices that are driven onto the stage rely on electronics not hydraulics...(admittedly a minor point).

However, the relative granduer of the set I envision for The One Ring is dependent on the story,; how else to bring The Mines of Moria or the Battle of Pellonor Fields etc., to the stage, rather than trying to bring the audience in because of a set. I think in some scenes, the story demands it.

Just FYI, I believe the original capitalization for Les Miz was something in the area of $8 million. The One Ring will probably be double that.

Galenavar · 09-30-2002, 05:18 PM

Quote:

My school has a really wonderful drama program. We win a lot of awards

Mine too!!!

And I know where you're coming from with

Quote:

I actually preferred a few of the actors from my high school! The simplicity definitely adds to the show and helps you to appreciate the talent of everyone involved.

We did a production of Damn Yankees, and after one of the rehersals, we all watched a movie version. Wow, we were a lot better. The people in the movie just didn't...sound as good? As right? I don't know haw to put it, but it was wrong. And our set was a lot better. Yes, the movie was more realistic, but ours was a huge rotating thing! We called it Mongo(yeah, yeah, we're dorks sometimes) and we got applause every single night for every single scene change.

Anyway, there's my little hysterical rant.

08-18-2002, 09:44 PM	#25
janus13 Sapling Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Lothlórien Posts: 12	yes, truly, hama1. does your musical have any good hobbit-songs we could break out into? __________________ "O Boromir! Beyond the gate the seaward road runs south, But you came not with the wailing gulls from the grey sea's mouth."

08-20-2002, 08:36 PM	#28
janus13 Sapling Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Lothlórien Posts: 12	ok, i see what you mean. simple rhyming structure in a musical would make the audience go to sleep. i make up my own melodies when playing Tolkein's songs on the guitar.... have to have some part of it be original, right? have you looked at the "I made a song" thread in the books forum? as a lyricist you would probably be interested. for those songs we have to use already existing tunes so other people know what the song is supposed to sound like, although i don't know why we bother, because no one ever knows the songs we're using anyway __________________ "O Boromir! Beyond the gate the seaward road runs south, But you came not with the wailing gulls from the grey sea's mouth."

09-05-2002, 04:57 PM	#30
entss89 lord of the ents Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: nc Posts: 539	HI IF YOU HATE MUSICALS THEN YOU SHOULD HAVE NEVER WENT IN HERE! SORRY IF I UPSET YOU!

09-16-2002, 08:19 AM	#32
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	Haha. Yes. The musical Buffy was quite, erm, individual... I like it! __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

09-16-2002, 09:59 PM	#33
galadriel Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: a castle made of clouds Posts: 459	"Bunnies... it must be bunnies!!!" <entmooters blink and run in the other direction.> Uh, yeah. __________________ Human kind cannot bear very much reality. dreamflower - for all things Lady Galadriel

08-10-2002, 12:42 AM	#22
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	I think the ABBA musical you are referring to is Mamma Mia! and as far as I know it has done actually quite well. As far as using JRRT's lyrics I actually do very little of that as you can see by looking at the Lyrics page on the site. Rather I try to incorporate his prose into my own lyrics and yes I have written my own melodies/music for them. While I I know I risk the wrath of other Tolkien Lovers here, I feel Tolkien's lyrics leave a soemthing to be desired in as far as adapting them to a musical format.

08-11-2002, 11:15 PM	#24
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Galenavar is a wise Hobbit....and Hobbits are known to break out into song at any moment...

08-19-2002, 12:05 AM	#27
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Played them on the guitar? To what music? Or did you let your own creativity and love of Tolkien inspire you to develop your own melodies? As far a s Tolkien's shortcomings as a lyricist I would suggest that most of his lyrics use a simple A.B.B.A OR A.B.A.B. rhyme scheme. Are some of his metaphors powerful yes but ingeneral it is rather simple stuff...but then he wasn't trying to write for musicals and was probably trying to stay within the dialectic of the lanbguage structure that infused his work.

08-24-2002, 12:36 AM	#29
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	I haven't checked out "I made a song" but I will, I will.

09-24-2002, 10:50 AM	#34
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	We're doing 'HONK!' at the moment... It's such a great show. I don't think it would work with LoTR, though it would be interesting to try and fit in as many puns as possible. It could be very funny... __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

09-24-2002, 07:36 PM	#35
Hasty Ent Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 516	Not too crazy about musicals, but I love opera... I would be first in line to see LotR as an opera. Of course, any one ever see Wagner's Ring Cycle? Not the same story, but it certainly shares many of the same themes. Most of the musicals that I've seen simply don't have the depth and scope of opera... And you need plenty of both for Tolkien. __________________ Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it. George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

09-26-2002, 12:28 AM	#36
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Hasty, Thank you for the post...and I agree...LotR would be wonderful as an opera. Unfortunately or perhaps not, I have no pretentious of greatness. I write musicals. However, as for depth and scope in musicals, have you ever seen Les Miz, Miss Saigon or Ragtime?

09-27-2002, 07:51 PM	#37
Hasty Ent Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 516	Hello hama1, Les Miz is the only one of the three I saw, and I hated it. A great story, but the production was so over the top I found myself watching the flying scenery (and mentally calculating the budget) instead of entering the world of Victor Hugo. I wouldn't mind seeing Miss Saigon or Ragtime, but it seems that these productions (as well as anything Andrew Lloyd Weber produces) are wildly expensive. When I do go to theater I try to go to small local productions mounted on shoestring budgets. That seems to leave the success of the play up to the script and the actors (!!!) instead of whether there is enough money to bring in a helicopter. All too often big budget musicals rely on the flash of the set to appeal to audiences (much like Hollywood blockbusters). PS And what's this about no pretention to greatness? You should, no, you must aspire to greatness no matter what you do. After all, isn't every creative endeavor about transcendence? __________________ Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it. George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) Last edited by Hasty Ent : 09-27-2002 at 07:54 PM.

09-27-2002, 10:11 PM	#38
galadriel Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: a castle made of clouds Posts: 459	Hasty Ent, the fancy-schmancy production of Les Miserables you saw sounds like the one I saw in New York, with a rotating hydraulics set. It was a bit showy, but the actors were so terrific that the set didn't bother me. However, I agree; I love local plays/musicals. My school has a really wonderful drama program. We win a lot of awards. I'm not actually involved with drama, but I'm a groupie; I go to all the productions. In fact, after seeing my school's version of Guys and Dolls and a commercial production, I actually preferred a few of the actors from my high school! The simplicity definitely adds to the show and helps you to appreciate the talent of everyone involved. __________________ Human kind cannot bear very much reality. dreamflower - for all things Lady Galadriel

09-29-2002, 01:46 AM	#39
hama1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NY and MA Posts: 133	Hasty, As for my pretentions...I was simply trying to say that I do not feel I could write an opera...I write musicals. Actualy I do not think Les MIz has any "flying" set elements but rather the rotating sets that Galadriel refers to...although no hydraulics...the rotating stage relies on a huge chain and the movement of the set peices that are driven onto the stage rely on electronics not hydraulics...(admittedly a minor point). However, the relative granduer of the set I envision for The One Ring is dependent on the story,; how else to bring The Mines of Moria or the Battle of Pellonor Fields etc., to the stage, rather than trying to bring the audience in because of a set. I think in some scenes, the story demands it. Just FYI, I believe the original capitalization for Les Miz was something in the area of $8 million. The One Ring will probably be double that.

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