If it was possible to cut someone out of the movie, who would it be? - Page 5

b.banner · 03-05-2004, 02:40 PM

thats weird because i just finished the books recently! and i didnt read about him?

Last Child of Ungoliant · 03-08-2004, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by b.banner
thats weird because i just finished the books recently! and i didnt read about him?

i now quote from the book:
(ROTK [book 5], Chapter VI 'The Battle of The Pelennor Fields'

"... they had been mustering for the sack of the City and the rape of Gondor, waiting on the call of their Captain. He now was destroyed; but Gothmog the Lieutenant of Morgul had flung them into the fray; ..."

go to www.glyphweb.com/arda (the Encyclopaedia of Arda)
and look up gothmog for more information.

Beor · 03-09-2004, 06:13 AM

I dont know if this is the right place to post this, but I just watched the FOTR again yesterday, and I really cant stand the part when the movie is leading in, and they have Galadriel (the lovely Cate Blanchett) say:

Quote:

The world has changed; I can feel it in the water.

This really irks me, because everyone in the whole damn Middle-earth knows that the place was changed. Did the whole sinking of great Numenor (Sp?) escape her, to where she all of a sudden realises that there is a whole island missing? And did it also escape her that all the land west of the Ered Wetherin (Blue Mts, I think, need to check the map again, I'd imagine) sunk into the ocean when the Valar came and destroyed Melkor or whatever?

I know its a little thing, but it really gets to me. Sorry. This should probably be in the vent thread.

Oh, and i think they should get rid of the jackass who decided to kill that one dude in that one scene that didnt even exist in the book. I cant remember his name for the life of Hamas! that was it. Get rid of the guy who had him killed right there.

Last Child of Ungoliant · 03-09-2004, 02:42 PM

yes, in the book, hama doesnt die until the orcs attack the hornburg there was no need for him to be killed off in that awful warg scene

Mrs Maggot · 03-10-2004, 02:30 AM

Quote:

The world has changed; I can feel it in the water.

My problem with this line si more that it was actually said by treebeard in the books. Why give it to Galadriel? Why not have Treebeard say it?

Beor · 03-10-2004, 01:44 PM

Oh, someone really says this? Well, talk about being a jackass. Good point with having Galadriel say it though, and I'll tell you why they gave it to G rather than Treebeard, its because they dont want you to take the trees too seriously, they are no better than dwarves in PJ's eyes.

by the way, I am happy

but not about this

Lotesse · 08-08-2005, 11:40 PM

Falagar, you say Haldir? No! I loved Haldir! Now Celeborn, on the other hand, could probably have taken a cut - far too vacuous of a character portrayal, taking up precious screen time with his monotone dialogue. So silly. And someone mentioned the elves at Helm's Deep - I agree, although it WAS cheaply gratifying to see them come in at the last minute to help out; such a Hollywood moment

.

I liked PJ's little cameos. He IS the director, after all; he gave us Lord of the Rings in film when every studio had previously never even considered such a project. I, for one, appreciate this fact enormously even though I take issue with a great many un-called-for liberties he took with Tolkien's story and characters. Still and all, his vision provided all of us with enjoyable, entertaining and beautifully filmed movies about Lord of the Rings.

Other than that, I can't think of any other actors that should have been cut. Au contraire, I think many MORE actors should have been cast, and portraying characters we should have seen, like Glorfindel, and Tom Bombadil, and Erkenbrand, and a host of others...

tolkienfan · 08-09-2005, 12:52 PM

I think that if Celeborn had been cut I would be upset about it. If you didn't like the way he spoke then you could recast him or something. He doesn't add too much to the story but I think it was nice to have him there.

ItalianLegolas · 08-09-2005, 01:36 PM

Some of the hobbits. To many hobbits. It was like an invasion of hobbitses.

No, I would say... Gothmog

Quote:

like the Mouth of Sauron (who i was extremely disappointed not to see in the film )

Well if your that desperate to see him, Chrys, hes in the RotK game.

Lotesse · 08-09-2005, 01:39 PM

Mouth is in the Extended edition, too, you guys.

*grits teeth* baby steps to 90 seconds, baby steps to 90 seconds...

ItalianLegolas · 08-09-2005, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lotesse

Mouth is in the Extended edition, too, you guys.

Oh yeahhhhh, I forgot about that.

TomthePilgrim · 08-24-2005, 03:17 PM

Yeah, Mouth was definitely something I would not have missed. (besides, it would have allowed for more 'House of Healing' scenes')

When we discuss something like this, we have to keep in mind that the Movie trilogy is no more than a retelling of the Book trilogy. Each generation changes the old stories; Tolkien re-wrote to old stories that he had found to fit his times, and Jackson has done the same.
The elves arriving to support Rohan at Helm's Deep was not in the book, but most of the fans I know approved of the change. The conversation with Saruman in the beginning of ROTK is another addition I like, if only to give Christopher Lee another chance to shine as Saruman.
I'd have loved seeing a well-portrayed Tom Bombadil. I'd have loved to see more of Buckland and the conversation with Farmer Maggot. However, when all is said and done, the Jackson movies are an outstanding representation of Tolkien's world, one unlikely to be outshown for many years (decades?) to come.

That being said, I could have done with a lot less Arwen. (and a lot more Eowyn)

Curubethion · 08-24-2005, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ItalianLegolas

Well if your that desperate to see him, Chrys, hes in the RotK game.

He's also in the ROTK EE.

Holbytla · 08-24-2005, 08:15 PM

Wisely said, TomthePilgrim (I happen to agree

). Except that MoS should absolutely be there, but not in that manner. He made an almost comic appearance, not what you would expect in that stage of the film, aarrgh! Not the sinister, dark, menacing, arrogant, impressive figure I pictured. And his horse was all too small..

Come to think of it, I don't think any characters should be cut, but too many where too much altered, for my taste. Didn't like the interpretation of the Breelanders, the Army of the Dead, Faramir (almost forgiven in TTT EE and Rotk..), the wargs, Arwen should be in, but not Sissy - Arwen. She is a wise Lady who is essential to the plot, and I'm sure I could add more, but why be so negative? I would also love to see Farmer Maggot (one of my fave chapters that!), and TB. But, as they're not important for the plot so to speak.. It's important to keep in mind that book and film are two different mediums and that the films are mere interpretations. Filmwise I loved the Elves at Helm's Deep (the music score added much to the impressive arrival). I believe PJ succeded in many ways, but it wouldn't have hurt him to trust Tolkien's own words and dialogues more.

I'm not sure if Tolkien actually rewrote myths and stories to fit his own times? I mean, old - fashioned heroic romances? And I suppose he rreinvented rather than rewrote, though heavily inspired. Somehow it was spot on

.

Holbytla

03-05-2004, 02:40 PM	#81
b.banner Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Trying to keep a hold on my temper so I don't turn into a big green guy. Posts: 572	thats weird because i just finished the books recently! and i didnt read about him? __________________ "We are going to tickle some Aes Sedai under the chin, rescue a mule, and put a snip-nosed girl on the Lion Throne. Oh, yes. That's Aviendha. Don't look at her cross-wise or she'll try to cut your throat and probably slit her own by mistake."-Mat Cauthon from Wheel of Time "Don't make me angry, you wouldn't like me when I'm angry...."-Dr. Bruce Banner HULK BATMAN THE FLASH

03-10-2004, 01:44 PM	#86
Beor founder of the color blue Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: E-Space Posts: 1,727	Oh, someone really says this? Well, talk about being a jackass. Good point with having Galadriel say it though, and I'll tell you why they gave it to G rather than Treebeard, its because they dont want you to take the trees too seriously, they are no better than dwarves in PJ's eyes. by the way, I am happy but not about this __________________ Well, there it is.

08-08-2005, 11:40 PM	#87
Lotesse of the House of Fëanor Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,150	Falagar, you say Haldir? No! I loved Haldir! Now Celeborn, on the other hand, could probably have taken a cut - far too vacuous of a character portrayal, taking up precious screen time with his monotone dialogue. So silly. And someone mentioned the elves at Helm's Deep - I agree, although it WAS cheaply gratifying to see them come in at the last minute to help out; such a Hollywood moment . I liked PJ's little cameos. He IS the director, after all; he gave us Lord of the Rings in film when every studio had previously never even considered such a project. I, for one, appreciate this fact enormously even though I take issue with a great many un-called-for liberties he took with Tolkien's story and characters. Still and all, his vision provided all of us with enjoyable, entertaining and beautifully filmed movies about Lord of the Rings. Other than that, I can't think of any other actors that should have been cut. Au contraire, I think many MORE actors should have been cast, and portraying characters we should have seen, like Glorfindel, and Tom Bombadil, and Erkenbrand, and a host of others... __________________ Few people have the imagination for reality. ~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

08-09-2005, 12:52 PM	#88
tolkienfan Elf Lord Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: The Internet Posts: 803	I think that if Celeborn had been cut I would be upset about it. If you didn't like the way he spoke then you could recast him or something. He doesn't add too much to the story but I think it was nice to have him there. __________________ Don't be hasty! Thanks so much to Last Child of Ungoliant, Twista, and BeardofPants for my avatar!

08-09-2005, 01:39 PM	#90
Lotesse of the House of Fëanor Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,150	Mouth is in the Extended edition, too, you guys. grits teeth baby steps to 90 seconds, baby steps to 90 seconds... __________________ Few people have the imagination for reality. ~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

03-09-2004, 02:42 PM	#84
Last Child of Ungoliant The Intermittent One Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: here and there Posts: 4,671	yes, in the book, hama doesnt die until the orcs attack the hornburg there was no need for him to be killed off in that awful warg scene

08-24-2005, 03:17 PM	#92
TomthePilgrim Enting Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: The Great Northwest Posts: 54	Yeah, Mouth was definitely something I would not have missed. (besides, it would have allowed for more 'House of Healing' scenes') When we discuss something like this, we have to keep in mind that the Movie trilogy is no more than a retelling of the Book trilogy. Each generation changes the old stories; Tolkien re-wrote to old stories that he had found to fit his times, and Jackson has done the same. The elves arriving to support Rohan at Helm's Deep was not in the book, but most of the fans I know approved of the change. The conversation with Saruman in the beginning of ROTK is another addition I like, if only to give Christopher Lee another chance to shine as Saruman. I'd have loved seeing a well-portrayed Tom Bombadil. I'd have loved to see more of Buckland and the conversation with Farmer Maggot. However, when all is said and done, the Jackson movies are an outstanding representation of Tolkien's world, one unlikely to be outshown for many years (decades?) to come. That being said, I could have done with a lot less Arwen. (and a lot more Eowyn)

08-24-2005, 08:15 PM	#94
Holbytla Sapling Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: In a hole in the ground. Posts: 7	Wisely said, TomthePilgrim (I happen to agree ). Except that MoS should absolutely be there, but not in that manner. He made an almost comic appearance, not what you would expect in that stage of the film, aarrgh! Not the sinister, dark, menacing, arrogant, impressive figure I pictured. And his horse was all too small.. Come to think of it, I don't think any characters should be cut, but too many where too much altered, for my taste. Didn't like the interpretation of the Breelanders, the Army of the Dead, Faramir (almost forgiven in TTT EE and Rotk..), the wargs, Arwen should be in, but not Sissy - Arwen. She is a wise Lady who is essential to the plot, and I'm sure I could add more, but why be so negative? I would also love to see Farmer Maggot (one of my fave chapters that!), and TB. But, as they're not important for the plot so to speak.. It's important to keep in mind that book and film are two different mediums and that the films are mere interpretations. Filmwise I loved the Elves at Helm's Deep (the music score added much to the impressive arrival). I believe PJ succeded in many ways, but it wouldn't have hurt him to trust Tolkien's own words and dialogues more. I'm not sure if Tolkien actually rewrote myths and stories to fit his own times? I mean, old - fashioned heroic romances? And I suppose he rreinvented rather than rewrote, though heavily inspired. Somehow it was spot on . Holbytla

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