The Sindar

Biscuit · 01-19-2002, 08:01 AM

I was reading on another thread that people think Thranduil was greedy. Generally there seems to be a similarity between the Sindar in this way. Think about Thingol (who I think Thranduil in the Hobbit is very similar to), he filled his halls with gold and jewels and apparently valued a simaril more than his daughter. Also Oropher (Thranduil's father)had the same sort of personality, in the battle of the last alliance he wouldn't march under Gil-galads banner and charged the gates of Mordor before any signal was given (and died). Generally all the Sindar seem a bit less wise then the Noldor. Even Celeborn , who is Sindar, is a bit like this in LOTR. Could this be because the Noldor went to Valinor and were taught by the Valar, but the Sindar who were part of the Avari weren't?

afro-elf · 01-19-2002, 05:00 PM

To address part of your question, the Sindar are not Avari.

Avari are the ( unwilling or refusers) they never started on the journey to Aman.

Sindar and Avari are Moriquendi ( dark Elves). Those who never saw the light of Valinor.

Sindar are also Umanyar ( those not of Aman) they started on the journey but never completed it.

Kirinki54 · 01-19-2002, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Biscuit
Generally all the Sindar seem a bit less wise then the Noldor.

IMHO the wisdom of the Noldor could be discussed a lot! At least in the Elder days...

Lightice · 01-19-2002, 05:59 PM

On my opinion, they were very wise, but not too smart...
They loved their work too much.

afro-elf · 01-19-2002, 06:19 PM

Lightice I would say the opposite.

That were very smart but lacked wisdom.

They were smart enough to forge and built but lacked wisdom in many of their choices.

An example off the top of my head would be Feanor was smart enough to know he could never succeed but lacked the wisdom to withdraw.

Biscuit · 01-20-2002, 12:00 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by afro-elf
[B]To address part of your question, the Sindar are not Avari.

Sorry, I only realised that they weren't Avari later.

Seems also that the Sindar weren't as skilled at making stuff as the Noldor. Thingol had to have the Dwarves help him make the necklace for the silmaril.
Doesn't it say somewhere in the Silmarillion the Noldor were taught crafts by the Valar?

afro-elf · 01-20-2002, 01:18 PM

I believe you are correct there.

Ñólendil · 01-23-2002, 07:54 PM

I moved this from The Hobbit forum as it's a rather broad subject, I think.

I agree that the Grey-elves collectively were not as wise as 'the most gifted race of the Eldar', mainly because of the latter's contact with the Holy Ones of the Blessed Realm. But I don't think that makes them greedy or Racist. Thingol, Thranduil, Celeborn are three examples of individual Elves who were not so nice and rather prejudice before they opened their eyes. Though, Thingol was counted among the Elves of the Light (Caledhil or Calaquendi). But they were only individuals. Look at Beleg Cúthalion or Legolas son of Thranduil. Legolas shared some of the prejudice of his father obviously, but he was a nice guy.

Also I should mention that Celeborn the Wise at the end of the Third Age was accounted most wise of all the Eldar remaining in Middle-earth. That includes Noldor.

01-19-2002, 08:01 AM	#1
Biscuit Sapling Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Scotland Posts: 8	The Sindar I was reading on another thread that people think Thranduil was greedy. Generally there seems to be a similarity between the Sindar in this way. Think about Thingol (who I think Thranduil in the Hobbit is very similar to), he filled his halls with gold and jewels and apparently valued a simaril more than his daughter. Also Oropher (Thranduil's father)had the same sort of personality, in the battle of the last alliance he wouldn't march under Gil-galads banner and charged the gates of Mordor before any signal was given (and died). Generally all the Sindar seem a bit less wise then the Noldor. Even Celeborn , who is Sindar, is a bit like this in LOTR. Could this be because the Noldor went to Valinor and were taught by the Valar, but the Sindar who were part of the Avari weren't?

01-19-2002, 05:00 PM	#2
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	To address part of your question, the Sindar are not Avari. Avari are the ( unwilling or refusers) they never started on the journey to Aman. Sindar and Avari are Moriquendi ( dark Elves). Those who never saw the light of Valinor. Sindar are also Umanyar ( those not of Aman) they started on the journey but never completed it. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

01-19-2002, 06:19 PM	#5
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	Lightice I would say the opposite. That were very smart but lacked wisdom. They were smart enough to forge and built but lacked wisdom in many of their choices. An example off the top of my head would be Feanor was smart enough to know he could never succeed but lacked the wisdom to withdraw. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. Last edited by afro-elf : 01-19-2002 at 06:22 PM.

01-20-2002, 01:18 PM	#7
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	I believe you are correct there. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

01-23-2002, 07:54 PM	#8
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	I moved this from The Hobbit forum as it's a rather broad subject, I think. I agree that the Grey-elves collectively were not as wise as 'the most gifted race of the Eldar', mainly because of the latter's contact with the Holy Ones of the Blessed Realm. But I don't think that makes them greedy or Racist. Thingol, Thranduil, Celeborn are three examples of individual Elves who were not so nice and rather prejudice before they opened their eyes. Though, Thingol was counted among the Elves of the Light (Caledhil or Calaquendi). But they were only individuals. Look at Beleg Cúthalion or Legolas son of Thranduil. Legolas shared some of the prejudice of his father obviously, but he was a nice guy. Also I should mention that Celeborn the Wise at the end of the Third Age was accounted most wise of all the Eldar remaining in Middle-earth. That includes Noldor. __________________ Falmon -- Dylan

01-19-2002, 05:59 PM	#4
Lightice Elven Warrior Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 192	On my opinion, they were very wise, but not too smart... They loved their work too much.

01-20-2002, 12:00 PM	#6
Biscuit Sapling Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Scotland Posts: 8	[QUOTE]Originally posted by afro-elf [B]To address part of your question, the Sindar are not Avari. Sorry, I only realised that they weren't Avari later. Seems also that the Sindar weren't as skilled at making stuff as the Noldor. Thingol had to have the Dwarves help him make the necklace for the silmaril. Doesn't it say somewhere in the Silmarillion the Noldor were taught crafts by the Valar?

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
The Silmarillion: Ch.10. Of the Sindar	Elanor Gamgee	The Silmarillion Project	18	10-19-2018 08:33 AM
Celeborn; Sindar or Teleri of Aman?	Willow Oran	The Silmarillion	17	12-04-2008 04:19 PM
Did Sindar sail to the West in the fist age?	afro-elf	The Silmarillion	4	02-07-2003 11:10 PM
Sindar great warriors?	afro-elf	Middle Earth	2	08-08-2002 07:46 PM
where are the sindar?	afro-elf	Lord of the Rings Books	19	01-14-2002 11:16 PM