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#1 |
Sapling
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: FV, CA
Posts: 11
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Alternative Numenor...
Anybody up for "alt" history? (I have a weakness for it--having matriculated with a degree in [Ancient] History.
![]() I'm not sure if this belongs in this forum or the Sil forum...well, here it goes...I haven't seen anyone propose any kind of question or thread on this topic (I did do the customary search--and did not find any.) What if Numenor (somehow) survived and did not fall? How would it happen? Civil War? When? How? Most "alt" history seems to point to Pharazon usurping the throne--what about earlier? Maybe in Adunakhor's time? (the Elendili may have been stronger and been better able to resist). How about Tar-Ciryatan--it was said (UT) that he forced Minastir to give up the Sceptre "earlier" than he wanted. What if Minastir flatly refused? Does Ciryatan rebel? (or does he wait the 4 years until dad croaks anyway?) Of course, there are always more complications--Tar-Telperien's reign and death have some issues ![]() ![]() ![]() Going back to Minastir--he seems like a genuinely good king--and surrendured the Sceptre and exited a few years later like a good King of Numenor. Interestingly, I found one web source that says Minastir may have had the same desire to live and rule on; see here: http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/...r-Minastir.htm Ok, the question becomes, does Minastir want to follow this path? Elros's rule till death is not disputed, Telperien may become the "model" for Minastir...is Minastir trying follow suit? Maybe Cirytan is "reacting" to this--"listen, dad, you're breaking with 'tradition' here...", Minastir blinks, "but son, Tar-Minyatur ruled till he passed on--and your Sainted Great Aunt, who made me King, by the way." "Dad, he grew weary, passed the Stick [Numenoreans were a bit 'cultured'...ed.], and then died! Don't you remember our own history??? We all know Aunt Telperien went as mad as Turin before she 'lost herself' with the servants!" Minastir blinks again...and calls his servant "boy, uh, more of that fine Andunie White, I think..." Enough said. ![]() So Ciryatan, has this decision to make..."Dad and those creepy elves! There is a fortune, just waiting to be picked up!!! Blast it--there's a golden opportunity here--dad's just going to have to see reason...". Somehow he cajoles the old man (...more wine...dad?) to give it up--and lets cirrohsis do the rest...and Ciryatan goes off to claim his fortune, or does he...? Some of the loyal servants--who are early "temperance" adopters...start grumbling; "What's junior doing to the old man? He can't even get up to the summit--without being carried in that fancy litter--to perform the rites to Eru! And when he does he keeps playing with his zipper...and can barely slur out the prayers as it is. Simply shameful." Maybe some of the other servants (who being more 'worldly'), "No, no, no! You have it all wrong! The old man is trying to be like Tar-Minyatur--and shaming himself in the process--all for the desire to be like those creepy elves!" Hence the lines are now drawn--the King's Men v. the Elendili. ![]() Any other ideas? ![]()
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Rainbows are not promises...they are threats. "Next time...I use FIRE.", God/Illuvatar/Eru/Allah. Always be insincere, even when you don't mean it... There are two types of people in this world: those with loaded guns...and those who dig. |
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#2 |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Wyoming - USA
Posts: 10,752
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Interesting thought.
There might even be two possibilities to explore: an early "change of heart" for Numenor, in which they basically continued in the "Faithful" mindset - as you say, from about the middle of the Second Age onward. The other might be at the last: Resistance to Ar-Pharazon's power grab, which places Tar-Miriel on the throne after her father Tar-Palantir. Enough Numenoreans are scandalized by what Pharazon would like to do - and the Lords of Andunie (successfully) exert all the power they have to prevent it. Numenor still has not redeemed itself for all its earlier excesses, and the hearts of the people are still largely turned away from the commands of the Valar and friendship with the Eldar, but at least they don't send a fleet to Valinor. There's no major expeditionary force to Middle Earth and humble Sauron, but he doesn't come to the island either. Future Kings come from the Faithful (assuming Miriel marries someone who is Faithful - and they manage to raise the kids right) - and maybe, just maybe, the hearts of the people are slowly turned back. Meanwhile, there's that growing matter of Sauron back on the mainland... with Gil-galad the sole powerful figure to resist him. Where would things go from there?
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My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!! |
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#3 |
Sapling
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: FV, CA
Posts: 11
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Pharazon is always picked on...
I don't call him Ar-Pharazon--he's a usurper in my mind
![]() I really don't know if the faithful would have been able to pull it out by this time; I think Pharazon deposed Amandil of lordship (nice friend ![]() ![]() ![]() I read a very interesting bit of fan fiction that dealt with some of this--Pharazon coming home after a self-imposed banishment to ME while Tar-Palantir was doing what he could (in a nest of vipers...even with Gimilzager assuming room temperature at some point). He turns up in Armenlos and sneaks into Miriel's bedroom on the night before her accession (with the help of traitorous servants) and forcibly "ass rapes" her (excuse the expletive--I want the full effect to be felt ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() On to #2--let's say that one of the traitorous servants is discovered...and (after a bit of persuasion with the business end of a...choose favorite blunt instrument ) tells of Pharazon's plans to "interrupt" Miriel's quiet slumber. Amandil may have thought it "crazy talk"--his friend wouldn't do that (he's either a "sap" or a "appeaser")--but Elendil and Sons are mad as hell and are going "nail" this golden boy to the "tree of woe". Elendil (and co) rally the faithful forces, and "set-up" junior for an "ambush". Since Isildur has the blonde hair--he gets to dress up as Miriel (of course he's just thrilled...); the rest are convienently hiding (and trying not to laugh at Isildur's misfortune) in the bedroom so that Isildur isn't abused--sexually...( ![]() Well, I have to say I like version #2 better than #1--the only one that ends up with a sore bum (after a fashion) is "golden boy". Both scenarios don't require huge armies--duking it out and leaving an awful mess. And version #1 isn't child-friendly (trying to avoid that "NC-17" rating thru artful cutting). So, that's my "Pharazon un-manned" scenario of Numenor surviving. ![]()
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Rainbows are not promises...they are threats. "Next time...I use FIRE.", God/Illuvatar/Eru/Allah. Always be insincere, even when you don't mean it... There are two types of people in this world: those with loaded guns...and those who dig. |
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