Your thoughts on women shaving legs and arm pits

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by afro-elf
Women will make those comments to about your unshaveness.

No male is holding a gun to your head to make you shave.

.
To blame men on shaving your arm pits and legs is like men blaming women on having to shave their beards.

It is a cultural product that is not SOLELY enforced by either gender.

I know that some women would do that. And I hate them for doing that. I don't deny that there are some stupid, ..... women, who judge other women.

And I was not talking about women. But I guess (never tried it) men would do their part too, if they met an unshaved women.

And of course it is a cultural thing. Some cultures do have it, others not, but that doesn't mean that it is not a "sexual" thing.


PS: Yah, Artanis is right.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by GrayMouser
I don't know, ask Bombadillo about the significance- he's the one that introduced the term originally.

I was just supplying the definition for someone who asked, and putting it in context.

Okay, I have spoke to Bombadillo, and he has edited his post. Let's carry on, and we shall leave these derogatory terms out of this discussion. Fair enough, everyone?

[Sheeana]

Lalaith - Do you shave your legs or armpits? If not, have you ever done it before? Do you keep up with fashion to some extent? Do you watch certain movies when they come out because they're popular? Watch certain tv shows because everyone else is? Do you eat certain things because of the belief that it will make you skinnier? Do you diet? Worry about your weight? Read popular magazines? Dye your hair?

I started shaving my legs when I was 13 because I was made to be self-conscious about it by other women, not men (at that age I don't believe that men/boys particularly care if you're shaving or not - and most girls start shaving as early as 10 or 11.) Does that make me stupid? Because I succumbed to shaving due to peer pressure? Have you never been subjected to it? Forgive my cynicism, but you don't strike me as the type to completely avoid peer pressure successfully.

To state that shaving is due to rampant sexism is to grossly oversimplify the problem. It is a byproduct of our culture as much as it is sexual politics. And it is only prevalent in certain areas - it may well be that where you come from, to shave is not the done thing. I don't know. But there are certainly other places in the world where shaving is not popular. My point is that to fight against culture can be pretty tough: so who are you to judge those who shave?

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
hey can I at least use nare or something? at least you have nothing down there to cut off.

Oh, fine. You can wax it off then.

[afro-elf]

If you put Nair on your head can you go without shaving.

I shave my head.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
hey can I at least use nare or something? at least you have nothing down there to cut off.

What, are you thinking of the famous Mr. Bobbit?

I haven't used Nair for years - is it any good now? It used to stink to high heaven!

I like the way it looks (legs) and I like the way it makes me smell better (pits).

[GrayMouser]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
Okay, I have spoke to Bombadillo, and he has edited his post. Let's carry on, and we shall leave these derogatory terms out of this discussion. Fair enough, everyone?

Sounds good to me.

By coincidence, an article on the origins of hairlessness in humans
from yesterday's New York Times:

Once hairlessness had evolved through natural selection, Dr. Pagel and Dr. Bodmer suggest, it then became subject to sexual selection, the development of features in one sex that appeal to the other. Among the newly furless humans, bare skin would have served, like the peacock's tail, as a signal of fitness. The pains women take to keep their bodies free of hair — joined now by some men — may be no mere fashion statement but the latest echo of an ancient instinct. Dr. Pagel's and Dr. Bodmer's article appeared in a recent issue of The Proceedings of the Royal Society.
<snip>

Another conundrum is why women have less body hair than men. Though both sexes may prefer less hair in the other, the pressure of sexual selection in this case may be greater on women, whether because men have had greater powers of choice or an more intense interest in physical attributes. "Common use of depilatory agents testifies to the continuing attractions of hairlessness, especially in human females," the two researchers write.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/19/science/19HAIR.html

(May require free registration)

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by Sheeana
Lalaith - Do you shave your legs or armpits? If not, have you ever done it before? Do you keep up with fashion to some extent? Do you watch certain movies when they come out because they're popular? Watch certain tv shows because everyone else is? Do you eat certain things because of the belief that it will make you skinnier? Do you diet? Worry about your weight? Read popular magazines? Dye your hair?

I started shaving my legs when I was 13 because I was made to be self-conscious about it by other women, not men (at that age I don't believe that men/boys particularly care if you're shaving or not - and most girls start shaving as early as 10 or 11.) Does that make me stupid? Because I succumbed to shaving due to peer pressure? Have you never been subjected to it? Forgive my cynicism, but you don't strike me as the type to completely avoid peer pressure successfully.

To state that shaving is due to rampant sexism is to grossly oversimplify the problem. It is a byproduct of our culture as much as it is sexual politics. And it is only prevalent in certain areas - it may well be that where you come from, to shave is not the done thing. I don't know. But there are certainly other places in the world where shaving is not popular. My point is that to fight against culture can be pretty tough: so who are you to judge those who shave?

Knew that question would come sometimes. Yes I do.
About fashion and all that stuff.
I am not keeping up with fashion. It's not that I run around like an old granny (and if I did it would still be my decision) but I just don't care for the latest fashion trends and what stars wear and what commercials are telling us what we should wear. I buy the clothes that I like and then I wear them, no matter if they are in fashion or not.
Usually I watch a movie because I want to watch it (eg the most watched german movie of the last years, every body saw it, I never did) and not because it is in or anything like that. The same for TV shows.
I have died my hair, more than once and I still would want to have black hair, but I just don't dye my hair anymore because I don't want to. I'm just satisfied with what I have now.

If you are talking about this girlie or woman magazines: I never liked them. There are thousands of pictures of clothes and everything. Annoying. And then they have these Help-sites where they tell the readers that they should feel comfortable just the way they are, even if they are not that thin, but their models are all like I-have-never-eaten-before. That's stupid.

I was worried about my weight before, I am still sometimes. But It got better. I have learned that people should appreciate who you are and like you the way you are and not what you look like or how you dress.
So if anyone doesn't like my hair colour, okay, if anyone says my clothes aren't in, okay, they don't have to deal with me. Take me as I am or leave it.

(puh, that was a long reply).

so who are you to judge those who shave?
I don't judge those who shave and I don't judge those who don't shave. I believe it is not my right to judge anyone (which doesn't mean that I don't do it sometimes).
But I dislike it, when other people judge those who don't shave or those who shave (because I dislike judging in general).

I don't want to quarrel with anyone in here, but I (it is my opinion, sorry) that men play their parts in that issue.

[Earniel]

Originally posted by Jonathan
I don't think they shave in Belgium either. Do they?

Was that just to lure me out?

Belgian woman shave, well some definately do. Armpits and legs. Most men don't. The same in France as far as I know.

Personally I shave my legs and armpits. I like the smooth feeling on my legs. But I still only shave my legs in summer, when it's warm enough to walk with bare legs. In winter I don't see the need to shave and all the hair adds another layer of warmth so I'd be foolish if I shaved it off then.

I think shaven legs are also prettier but I'm fully aware that's a cultural influence. It's both men and women that make up the culture, so I'm not going to blame just one sex for turning shaven legs into a beauty ideal. Besides I still have to hear that a woman who doesn't shave is immediatly called ugly.

I only started shaving around 17 I think and it was my mother who put me up to it, not a guy. Although I know most girls at school at that time shaved to appear prettier to the boys. But then I think of all the guys who have to shave their face almost daily because the girls don't like it when it prickles. Two sides of a coin.

In my eyes shaving is a very small deal, I worry more that looking stravingly thin is for many girls a beauty ideal. It's incredibly unhealthy and most of it is just in your head. So compared to that shaving yes or no is but a trifle. Shave if you want to and if you don't, hey no problem what so ever.

[HOBBIT]

I don't want to quarrel with anyone in here, but I (it is my opinion, sorry) that men play their parts in that issue.

In what way you still person? :P Well, they play their parts in it - but Women have an EQUAL part in that as part of society.

I admit that I would definitely find a girl more attractive with shaved legs...its just what I'm used to. All I've ever really seen from bith is hairless girls - it wasnt until my pre-teens that I even realized that girls shaved their legs - i just thought they were naturally hairless.

I would probably be really freaked out to see a cute girl in super short shorts with legs as hairy as mine! It wouldn't fit.

Lalaith, is it also mens fault that women wear makeup? lipstick? pluck your eyelashes? trim your eyebrows? starve yourselves? treat your hair every two seconds?? use deoderant? shampoo? I THINK NOT. It is just part of our society which consists of both male and female. If you don't like any of those things, just stop doing it! Don't be a hypocrite. I'm a guy and I wouldn't really mind that much if you stopped with some of those - i mean it would be nice to see how you really look....and girls in elementary school start wearing make up and lipstick - ridiculous!

Also - men and women are different! Why should men shave, imo? Pointless - girls still find hairy guys attractive, doesn't usually go the other way. In fact, some ppl are freaked out by shaven guys. Should men wear skirts and dresses too? Make-up? Lip stick? Good idea -not.

Found this article...explains how the whole shaving legs thing started. http://simpleplanet.homestead.com/shaving.html

[Jonathan]

Originally posted by Jonathan
I don't think they shave in Belgium either. Do they?

Originally posted by Eärniel
Was that just to lure me out?

LOL! Well I guess that's just a myth then, and Belgian women actually shave. I never entered any deep into the studies of Belgiam women's body hair when I was in Brussels

[congressmn]

Originally posted by afro-elf
If you put Nair on your head can you go without shaving.

I shave my head.

NAIR: National Arrangements for Incidents involving Radioactivity

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by HOBBIT
In what way you still person? :P Well, they play their parts in it - but Women have an EQUAL part in that as part of society.

I admit that I would definitely find a girl more attractive with shaved legs...its just what I'm used to. All I've ever really seen from bith is hairless girls - it wasnt until my pre-teens that I even realized that girls shaved their legs - i just thought they were naturally hairless.

I would probably be really freaked out to see a cute girl in super short shorts with legs as hairy as mine! It wouldn't fit.

Lalaith, is it also mens fault that women wear makeup? lipstick? pluck your eyelashes? trim your eyebrows? starve yourselves? treat your hair every two seconds?? use deoderant? shampoo? I THINK NOT. It is just part of our society which consists of both male and female. If you don't like any of those things, just stop doing it! Don't be a hypocrite. I'm a guy and I wouldn't really mind that much if you stopped with some of those - i mean it would be nice to see how you really look....and girls in elementary school start wearing make up and lipstick - ridiculous!

Also - men and women are different! Why should men shave, imo? Pointless - girls still find hairy guys attractive, doesn't usually go the other way. In fact, some ppl are freaked out by shaven guys. Should men wear skirts and dresses too? Make-up? Lip stick? Good idea -not.

Found this article...explains how the whole shaving legs thing started. http://simpleplanet.homestead.com/shaving.html

First, I don't think that women really play an equal part in our society .... at least not in some things.

I guess to a certain degree it is mens fault that women do all these things. They want men to find them attractive. But I say to a certain degree, there will always be girls who don't even talk to their children or best girl friends without wearing make up. I don't mind, it's their thing.

But personally, I know a lot of girls who would never dress special or wear make up when they just meet with their best friends.

And I thing I realized when I watched the younger girls ..... young girls wear tons of make up, dress to kill when they go out and do all these things ... because they want boys to like them.
As soon as they grow up, most of the girls stop doing that. They just don't want to look like that anymore.
Why's that? Probably because they don't want to look like a bitch anymore, just to attract some guys. They are old enough to understand, that it is not necessary.

And now, towards the end, because I don't think that I have much more to say in this thread, you all know my opinion, I have a little story.
There's a boy at our school. He has hairy feet, no question. But that's not the point. The point is, that he always critizises all the girls. Tells them to shave their arm (talking about arms, not arm pits), he controlls their feet of they are well-shaved and all these stuff. I know he is only one, but there are certainly others.
=> Men are not innocent!

[Earniel]

Originally posted by Jonathan
LOL! Well I guess that's just a myth then, and Belgian women actually shave. I never entered any deep into the studies of Belgiam women's body hair when I was in Brussels

There are MYTHS dealing with whether or not Belgian women shave? You Swedish people have no life.

Originally posted by Lalaith
I know he is only one, but there are certainly others.
=> Men are not innocent!

Like we're all sweet lil' angels...

Oh wait we are....

*flaps her wings*

[Lanelf]

Originally posted by Lalaith
There's a boy at our school. He has hairy feet, no question. But that's not the point. The point is, that he always critizises all the girls. Tells them to shave their arm (talking about arms, not arm pits), he controlls their feet of they are well-shaved and all these stuff. I know he is only one, but there are certainly others.
=> Men are not innocent!

What a little [Bleep]!
I agree with Eärniel - I don't shave in winter either. Well, not unless we've got swimming in sport lessons. Which is a stupid idea in winter anyway. But my school was never known for its great ideas.
Lanelf.

[HOBBIT]

Lalaith: So hypocritical - you spout all this about how its all mens fault that women shave (and also wear makeup, after i brought it up), and you admit that you do it yourself!

If you really felt that strongly - then just go hairy. Obviously you too are a victim of this horrible society

And your icon - with questional content i might add - displays a girl in a bikini definetely shaved.

You make these silly accusations...does it make you feel better to try to put down guys??

Girls shave because they want to! Many girls here have said that it was pressure from fellow females that they started shaving and that they like smoother legs and it makes them feel sexy.

And so what if a girl wants to look good to impress guys???? Like guys don't try to look nice to impress girls?

I'm sorry, but you need a big wake up call.

Maybe you think there should be no guys so you women can not worry about impressing us and go hairy and without makeup and all that junk.

Also think about this - women naturally do not have as much body hair as men. Not many women have tons of hair on their legs naturally - like compared me for example. Shaving male legs would be more of a hassal and would look less natural.

"men are not innocent"
what does that mean? like women are? silliness.

[Fat middle]

Hey, calm down there

Try not to fall into personal

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by HOBBIT
Lalaith: So hypocritical - you spout all this about how its all mens fault that women shave (and also wear makeup, after i brought it up), and you admit that you do it yourself!

If you really felt that strongly - then just go hairy. Obviously you too are a victim of this horrible society

And your icon - with questional content i might add - displays a girl in a bikini definetely shaved.

You make these silly accusations...does it make you feel better to try to put down guys??

Girls shave because they want to! Many girls here have said that it was pressure from fellow females that they started shaving and that they like smoother legs and it makes them feel sexy.

And so what if a girl wants to look good to impress guys???? Like guys don't try to look nice to impress girls?

I'm sorry, but you need a big wake up call.

Maybe you think there should be no guys so you women can not worry about impressing us and go hairy and without makeup and all that junk.

Also think about this - women naturally do not have as much body hair as men. Not many women have tons of hair on their legs naturally - like compared me for example. Shaving male legs would be more of a hassal and would look less natural.

"men are not innocent"
what does that mean? like women are? silliness.

Ah, I could say something really unfriendly now ... nearly done it, but do you know what? I won't let myself down to that low level of conversation.

I don't think that I should let anyone talk to me like that, but okay, well.

To answer:
First, I can do what I want. (as I said that other girls can do what they want) If I want to shave it's my thing and I don't have to explain to anyone why I am doing it. At least I admit that I am doing it.

And if you had read my posts carefully you would have noticed that I didn't say that it is ALL mens fault. Partly it is also the fault of the women. And that's why I said men are not innocent. They are not innocent when we are talking about women shaving their legs. So don't try to take my words wrong.

I never said that I was perfect and some things I just do because I like them, even if they are in fashion.

I have this avatar because I think she looks good. No need to explain that.

I am not trying to put guys down. I don't need that. I know that men and women should be equal. I am just saying my opinion.
I could say something else to that topic, but if I do so, you will go and say again that I am making silly accusations.

Oh, then it looks natural when women have shaved legs. ha. That's just a thing we are used to, that has nothing to do with "natural".

Personally I believe that you just needed someone to be mean to because if you had read my posts carefully you would have realized that I said most of that before.


(sorry, some things may sound mean, but that's not because I want to sound mean but because I don't find the right words in english)

[Fat middle]

Okay. I think that response was inevitable , so I'll say again and for the last time: let's stop talking about Lalaith, this topic is about shaved & unshaved women

... well, I mean women in general, not that Lalaith wasn't one of them

[Lalaith]

Originally posted by Fat middle
Okay. I think that response was inevitable , so I'll say again and for the last time: let's stop talking about Lalaith, this topic is about shaved & unshaved women

... well, I mean women in general, not that Lalaith wasn't one of them

I mean I can still edit it.
I'm not into discussing my opinion all the time.

[Ruinel]

I shave my legs but a good friend of mine does not. But she has blond hair and it is barely noticable. I have auburn hair against pale skin, and you bet that dark hair is noticable. As far as attracting men, she does and she has a steady bf right now. She does, however, shave under her arms.

As for me, I shave my legs and my underarms. It is a cultural thing. Who makes me do it? I don't know if I can blame other women, but I know I do it because it is attractive to men.

Because in summer I wear bikinis I've had my bikini line lasered (yes, it hurts like a mother f**ker, don't let anyone fool you) because shaving caused rashes on occasion which looked horrible and ruined my plans to go swimming.

Why did I start? Hell, I don't know. But like BoP, I felt very conscious of my body at the time and worried how it looked.

Originally posted by HOBBIT
Maybe you think there should be no guys so you women can not worry about impressing us and go hairy and without makeup and all that junk.

Are you kidding me?

BTW: AE, I think your shaved head looks cute. Maybe that's part of my instincts for less hair kicking in. LOL!