? - Page 2

***Sister Golden Hair*** · 06-12-2003, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Artanis
Hm - I doubt his title is meant as an honour. Pardon me if I'm wrong.

You are absolutely right Artanis, and Meadhros, if you ever read the FAQ, you would know that. His title is diciplinary action that I gave him. Now, would you like that title?

Elf Girl · 06-13-2003, 02:11 PM

What did he do that is so dire? He seems just a little clueless to me.

***Sister Golden Hair*** · 06-13-2003, 02:19 PM

Well, go to the FAQ and read it. It will tell you what the "Smelly Orc" title is given for.

Back on topic.

Maedhros · 06-13-2003, 03:07 PM

From the Faq

Quote:

The default titles for moderators and administrators are "Huorn" and "Ent," respectively. Staff members and certain users may have their own custom titles. In some situations, the title "Smelly Orc" is given to spammers.

Now on topic.
From the Book of Lost Tales I: Prologue

Quote:

One quality which [The Lord of the Rings] has in abundance is the Beowulfian 'impression of depth', created just as in the old epic by songs and digressions like Aragorn's lay of Tinúviel, Sam Gamgee's allusions to the Silmaril and the Iron Crown, Elrond's account of Celebrimbor, and dozens more. This, however, is a quality of The Lord of the Rings, not of the inset stories. To tell these in their own right and expect them to retain the charm they got from their larger setting would be a terrible error, an error to which Tolkien would be more sensitive than any man alive. As he wrote in a revealing letter dated 20 September 1963:

I am doubtful myself about the undertaking [to write The Silmarillion]. Part of the attraction of The L.R. is, I think, due to the glimpses of a large history in the background: an attraction like that of viewing far off an unvisited island, or seeing the towers of a distant city gleaming in a sunlit mist. To go them is to destroy the magic, unless new unattainable vistas are again revealed. (Letters, p. 333)

To go there is to destroy the magic. As for the revealing of 'new unattainable vistas', the problem there -- as Tolkien must have thought many times -- was that in The Lord of the Rings Middle-earth was already old, with a vast weight of history behind it. The Silmarillion, though, in its longer form, was bound to begin at the beginning. How could 'depth' be created when you had nothing to reach further back to?

Attalus · 06-13-2003, 06:45 PM

Well, we have this whole Forum, among others, to prove that JRRT's fears were groundless. Too bad Tollers didn't live long enough to publish the Silmarillion that he wanted to: equal in size to LotR.

Ruinel · 06-13-2003, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Attalus
Well, we have this whole Forum, among others, to prove that JRRT's fears were groundless. Too bad Tollers didn't live long enough to publish the Silmarillion that he wanted to: equal in size to LotR.

*drools* That would have been GREAT!

Maedhros · 06-14-2003, 10:17 AM

One interesting thing to point out is that, in the Tales, it is very interesting that they were told to Eriol in Tol Eresëa by either Lindo, Vairë, Rúmil, etc and he wrote them down in the Golden Book of Tavrobel, just like the Qenta, that is in Home 4: The Shaping of Middle-Earth, which is the only complete Silmarillion that JRRT ever wrote. It seems that JRRT abandoned the idea of the narrator Eriol/Ælfwine and the ones who wrote the stories and the how they came to us, unlike in the Lord of the Rings, where the concept of the Red Book still remained.

Attalus · 06-14-2003, 04:35 PM

Yes, I prefer to do without the narrator-device and have it written like a third-person history of the Elves. Of course, then, we get problems like Gurthang's speech, which no one can figure how anyone knew that, since the only ones present were Turin and the sword.

Blue Scout · 06-14-2003, 05:40 PM

quote:
Yes, I prefer to do without the narrator-device and have it written like a third-person history of the Elves. Of course, then, we get problems like Gurthang's speech, which no one can figure how anyone knew that, since the only ones present were Turin and the sword (end of quote)

That's not really a problem, if you can, for example, imagine a schizophrenic archaeologist digging up Turin at some point in the Fourth Age, perhaps, and being just mad enough to try and talk to the sword for no particular reason. It makes sense to me. There's so no reason Gurthang should lose its powers of speech when it was broken

Blue Scout · 06-14-2003, 05:44 PM

Hi, by the way. I'm new here. I guess.

***Sister Golden Hair*** · 06-14-2003, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Blue Scout
Hi, by the way. I'm new here. I guess.

Welcome to Entmoot Blue Scout. Be sure to drop by the General Messages forum and introduce yourself in the "Welcome" thread. Enjoy your stay.

Gwaimir Windgem · 06-14-2003, 05:57 PM

Mae govannen, and welcome to our humble abode.

06-13-2003, 02:11 PM	#22
Elf Girl Lurker Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Lothlórien Posts: 3,419	What did he do that is so dire? He seems just a little clueless to me. __________________ There's antimony, arsenic, aluminum, selenium...

06-13-2003, 02:19 PM	#23
*Sister Golden Hair* Queen of Nargothrond Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Akron, Ohio - USA Posts: 7,121	Well, go to the FAQ and read it. It will tell you what the "Smelly Orc" title is given for. Back on topic. __________________ "Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide

06-13-2003, 06:45 PM	#25
Attalus Swan-Knight of Dol Amroth Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: On the Bay of Belfalas Posts: 1,125	Well, we have this whole Forum, among others, to prove that JRRT's fears were groundless. Too bad Tollers didn't live long enough to publish the Silmarillion that he wanted to: equal in size to LotR. __________________ "What song the Sirens sang, or what name Achilles assumed when he hid himself among women, though puzzling questions are not beyond conjecture." - Sir Thomas Browne, Urn Burial.

06-14-2003, 10:17 AM	#27
Maedhros The Tall Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Formenos Posts: 578	One interesting thing to point out is that, in the Tales, it is very interesting that they were told to Eriol in Tol Eresëa by either Lindo, Vairë, Rúmil, etc and he wrote them down in the Golden Book of Tavrobel, just like the Qenta, that is in Home 4: The Shaping of Middle-Earth, which is the only complete Silmarillion that JRRT ever wrote. It seems that JRRT abandoned the idea of the narrator Eriol/Ælfwine and the ones who wrote the stories and the how they came to us, unlike in the Lord of the Rings, where the concept of the Red Book still remained. __________________ “What does the term american refers to” asked the boy, and the wise man answered: “Lets look at the dictionary then.” As an adjective American is: 1. Of or relating to the United States of America or its people, language, or culture. 2. Of or relating to North or South America, the West Indies, or the Western Hemisphere. As a noun American is: A native or inhabitant of America. A citizen of the United States. Then the boy asked, “What is America then?”, and the wise man looked at the dictionary again: 1. The United States. 2. also the A·mer·i·cas. The landmasses and islands of North America, Central America, and South America. Confused, the boy asked, “Does the term american refers solely to a us citizen or to any person in North, Central or South America?” The wise man replied: “What do you think?”, and the boy answered: “It is clear to me that while the term american is used to refers to us citizens, one can also use it to refer to any person who is from that continent too,” the boy thought for a while and asked the wise man, “Am I right?”, and he replied: “But of course.” The boy wondered, why is it that some people refuse to acknowledge the fact that the term american refers not only to US citizens but to anyone of the American continent?, but then sadly, the boy understood, that it is the calamity of ignorance.

06-14-2003, 04:35 PM	#28
Attalus Swan-Knight of Dol Amroth Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: On the Bay of Belfalas Posts: 1,125	Yes, I prefer to do without the narrator-device and have it written like a third-person history of the Elves. Of course, then, we get problems like Gurthang's speech, which no one can figure how anyone knew that, since the only ones present were Turin and the sword. __________________ "What song the Sirens sang, or what name Achilles assumed when he hid himself among women, though puzzling questions are not beyond conjecture." - Sir Thomas Browne, Urn Burial.

06-14-2003, 05:40 PM	#29
Blue Scout Sapling Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Madly running through the fields Posts: 5	On Gurt quote: Yes, I prefer to do without the narrator-device and have it written like a third-person history of the Elves. Of course, then, we get problems like Gurthang's speech, which no one can figure how anyone knew that, since the only ones present were Turin and the sword (end of quote) That's not really a problem, if you can, for example, imagine a schizophrenic archaeologist digging up Turin at some point in the Fourth Age, perhaps, and being just mad enough to try and talk to the sword for no particular reason. It makes sense to me. There's so no reason Gurthang should lose its powers of speech when it was broken

06-14-2003, 05:44 PM	#30
Blue Scout Sapling Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Madly running through the fields Posts: 5	Hi, by the way. I'm new here. I guess.

06-14-2003, 05:57 PM	#32
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Mae govannen, and welcome to our humble abode. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle