Do you actually think there'll be any ep 7-9 - Page 2

tuthezeng · 10-10-2002, 04:33 PM

i agree.

webwizard333 · 10-12-2002, 11:18 PM

I think he's (Lucas) said somewhere that there are are no more Star Wars movies after number 3 comes out. Of course, he still could, the cloning thing sounds intrgueing, but he's said the actors are all too old.

Btw, I never did get the big deal with the Tomothy Zahn trilogy. Just because they were written better than the rest of the EU novels, doesn't make up for the laugable premise. Art trumps Force.

Misty Mountain Goat · 10-15-2002, 08:36 AM

To you people who bad mouth the recent expanded univerce novles are doing Georgie Boy a great disgrace. These new novels are fantastic and G/L himself loves the series. So how bout you keep your ill-founded "firm stands to your self"

Slop, hah, quite the opposite my good freinds.

A little harsh i know for a new comer, sorroy but thats my firm stance, and of course you can express what ever you want it is a post site aint it.

***IronParrot*** · 10-15-2002, 08:09 PM

Quote:

"These new novels are fantastic and G/L himself loves the series"

Post proof or retract, please. There's no evidence he even reads the books, aside from a few of the comics here and there.

I have no problem with you liking the books, mind you... it's just that whether anyone likes it or not doesn't change the fact that they have absolutely no pertinence to the films. (By the way, just because you're new to the boards doesn't mean you can't be harsh and firm about your opinions... it's okay, as long as you don't offend anyone personally.)

But getting back on topic, while on the subject of Episodes 7-9... it doesn't matter how it's done, it would still suck. Why? Because the very concept of Episodes 7-9 directly contradicts the structure of the Star Wars saga as it stands, as a unified saga outside of which everything remains ambiguous, as everything outside is irrelevant and extraneous material that actually adds to the saga because of the unsolved mystery surrounding it.

Unsolved, that is, unless you read the books.

Misty Mountain Goat · 10-15-2002, 09:23 PM

Well Iron Parrot,
You do have a good point, i can not prove this staement, yet, il have a go for you , not to prove you wrong, just for a bit of info.

By the by are you a huge star wars fan? Some of these people (not naming any names) dont know what they are talking about. Star Wars is my forte. Even tho many people would know more tha me, im only 15. Also What is your bif with expanded universe, just wanted to know.

***IronParrot*** · 10-17-2002, 12:38 PM

I'm a huge fan of George Lucas' film saga Star Wars, yes. You know, the kind that absolutely has to be at the opening show, perhaps even first in line and all (which I was for Phantom). But I don't concern myself with trivial knowledge... I find that just because someone "knows" how many windows there are on a Star Destroyer or what company manufactured the T-47 snowspeeders, it doesn't make him a bigger fan than me. I just concern myself with the mythical story aspect, mostly.

As for the Expanded Universe, I find that it is just extraneous material that doesn't mesh with the films, and in fact takes many elements of the films and renders them comparably insignificant. What's the point of Boba Fett dying if he's just going to be barfed back to life again? What's the point of the Empire being defeated if it's, well, not really defeated? What's the point of the Emperor perishing if he's cloned back to life? What's the point of the Force being created by all living things if some things are immune to it? What's so scary about the Death Star if there are so many other world-destroying superweapons? I think it's all just a bit silly, and that's not even going into things like Palpatine having a three-eyed son who's not actually his son but the clone of some other guy...

Another big problem with it, when you look at all the "Essential Guides" and such and not just the Expanded Universe fiction, is that the fantasy element takes a backseat to mock sci-fi, which I find directly contradictory to how I see Star Wars, as mytho-fantasy and not science fiction. That's a separate debate entirely.

My biggest problem with the Expanded Universe - a problem that will go away in another three years, thank goodness - is that suddenly, some people expect EU elements like Jaster Mareel and Sienar and everything in the Prequel Trilogy, when of course, we now know that Boba's just a clone of Jango, and Geonosians designed the Death Star. There are still some people who think Aurra Sing is going to be some super anti-Jedi bounty hunter in Episode III like she is in the comics, when really, all she is and ever was is an extra on a cliff who's in Phantom for two seconds. Proof that the books and comics have no weight in terms of the movies.

I'm not going to bother with minor grievances like the second-rate prose, especially the inability of the movie novelizations in particular to capture the visual emotional power of the original work.

I do own some Star Wars books, but they are only the type that look at the films as films, such as screenplays, "making-of" guides, and McQuarrie/Chiang concept artwork.

But as far as the Expanded Universe "literature" goes, well, my time is very valuable to me and I'd rather be spending it on something worthwhile. Maybe even another run through The Lord of the Rings... that never seems to get old.

Misty Mountain Goat · 10-18-2002, 07:48 AM

wow long post

Misty Mountain Goat · 10-18-2002, 07:58 AM

Sorry, i must be talking to some type of expert if you can use bold font and insert inverted commers like that. I guess im out of my leage down here, up against the elders with upwards of 100000000 posts. Just because you think expanded universe is crap doesnt mean you can invert commers around the word literature. It still is literature.

I thikn expanded universe gives people the feeling that the saga lives on after the second death star blows up. Its not the end and shouldnt be. Its not like anything hasnt happend since the Nazis were defeated, new threats etc have popped up eg. terrorists, eg the vong.

Get off your high horse son and pull your head in. use your full page posts for more worthy apponants. Dont worry im sure all the other mooters will still think your cool.:

No offence y'all

Catch ya cobbers

Ma Uai: Ua Nemti · 10-18-2002, 11:22 PM

Oh Lord! I hope not. GL should just quietly back down and die in some nice house on the beach, after ep. 3 of course (I gotta see how he is gonna pull this all together.)

***IronParrot*** · 10-18-2002, 11:23 PM

First of all, I don't actually have that many posts... the extra 50000 was added to a bunch of people a while ago, and I never bothered taking it off.

Anyway, I find your justification behind the EU to be quite interesting, specifically this part:

Quote:

"I thikn expanded universe gives people the feeling that the saga lives on after the second death star blows up. Its not the end and shouldnt be. Its not like anything hasnt happend since the Nazis were defeated, new threats etc have popped up eg. terrorists, eg the vong."

Well, I guess I've found the fundamental source of our disagreement here.

You see, I find the Star Wars film saga to be a unified fantasy story with a clear focus and a beginning, middle and end. As far as plot goes, I think that EU's attempt to talk about what happens after Return of the Jedi is not in any way more legitimate than pure fan fiction, in that it bears no relevance to the actual thematic basis behind Star Wars:

- Star Wars is the story of the Force... the Dark Side rises, the Dark Side falls, balance is restored. End of story.
- Star Wars is the story of Anakin Skywalker... he rises, he falls, he redeems himself and dies. End of story.
- Star Wars is the story of the Emipre... the Republic collapses, the Empire is established, the Empire suffers a decisive defeat and itself collapses. End of story.

(Getting back on topic for a second here, this is also why I strongly oppose the idea of Episodes VII-IX, which will thankfully never be made.)

Using your analogy, it's just like how an epic about World War II really has no business "expanding" the same characters to the realm of today's terrorism scare. It's outside the scope of the story.

Quote:

"No offence y'all"

None taken... I'm almost flattered you think that I'm on some kind of pedestal here.

Misty Mountain Goat · 10-20-2002, 03:49 AM

Allright then your justifications seem reasonalble. Plus your luiguistic skills are much too advanced for a fifteen year old im gonna drop this. I admit defeat.

And i allso agree about not making the movies.7,8,9

Beleg Strongbow · 11-04-2002, 02:22 PM

Not all fifteen-year old people speak as you do, Misty Mountain Goat.

Goldberry1 · 11-08-2002, 11:03 PM

I dont think there will be, and I wouldn't have been that heartbroken if they hadn't decided to do 1-3. The original ones were just fine with me!

Ma Uai: Ua Nemti · 11-09-2002, 12:02 AM

Amen Goldberry! Amen!

Nilore · 11-17-2002, 09:25 AM

I've heard he is but it would get boring after that and it would have to be about something different.

Nilore

Lief Erikson · 11-17-2002, 05:20 PM

Well, I tend to think that the first three fit pretty neatly in with Episodes 4-6 because it's the same story. Phantom Menace really seemed pretty far out at first, but Attack of the Clones brought it closer to the story, and Episode 3 will complete the link. My parents also like the original trilogy better, and I don't know which I prefer. But I really like the acting in Episode 2, particularly on the part of Anakin, and I'm looking forward enormously to the next one.

Wayfarer · 11-17-2002, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lief Erikson
But I really like the acting in Episode 2, particularly on the part of Anakin, and I'm looking forward enormously to the next one.

He spends the entire movie ogling padme. There were times when he looked like he wanted to drag her into a back room and... you get the picture.

I hated anakin in episode two.

Lief Erikson · 11-17-2002, 06:07 PM

I see. Well, then we're at a difference of opinion.

Wayfarer · 11-17-2002, 06:26 PM

Right. So you state your case, and I'll state mine, and we'll attempt to resolve opposing viewpoints into truth.

Lief Erikson · 11-18-2002, 01:34 AM

Sometimes for a story there are many intepretations that might be correct, but I'll go ahead and set out my own opinions . . .

Anakin's acting I found brilliant. He had to show that he had a major crush, and he had to portray himself at that unstable stage of rebellious teenager. He does look at Padmé in a manner that he wouldn't look at any other woman with, and that is because of his crush (Which may or may not be love). He is strongly attracted to her, both physically and because of her personality. I personally don't read into it that his looking at her in the caressing way he did revealed lust.

The acting he shows in bringing across the attraction and instability is very good, along with the common teenager attitude of seeking more freedom.

Some other enormously difficult scenes he had to play include the scene where he's confessing to Padmé his murder of the Tusken Raiders. The shifts in emotion and behavior are extremely well acted in that scene. The transition from light to dark was very well played, in the slow turn around he did. Placing himself between the character traits of Episode 1 and the traits of the last three episodes was also, I think, very neat in terms of revealing the transition. In Episode 1 he is a good kid, trying to become a good person and to do the right thing. He reveals self confidence and a touch of the recklessness he also shows in Episode 2, but which also could be tempered to goodness and changed to bravery, given maturity and experience. In Episode 2, he has a firmer knowledge of his own abilities and powers, and knows that he has the ability to go far. He has the same self confidence and recklessness, but these character aspects later on in the film become played up as self confidence becomes arrogance and recklessness becomes disobedience. His seeking to become a good person and to do what is right is always there, but I think it gets buried in the turmoil of the events following his mother's death and the confusion of Episode 3.

His pain at his mother's death was very well acted, as well, as was his relationship with Obi-Wan.

10-10-2002, 04:33 PM	#21
tuthezeng Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Aboard the U.S.S. Suicidal Insanity Posts: 15	i agree. __________________ Once you head down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. And you get dental. All I see is blackness! Oh, my hood's down. Every man lives. Not every man truly dies. Join the Army, meet interesting people, kill them. Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk? This is not a dress, it's the standard Dread Lord uniform. If you tell a joke in the forest, but nobody laughs, was it a joke?

10-12-2002, 11:18 PM	#22
webwizard333 Elf Lord Join Date: May 2001 Location: myob Posts: 587	I think he's (Lucas) said somewhere that there are are no more Star Wars movies after number 3 comes out. Of course, he still could, the cloning thing sounds intrgueing, but he's said the actors are all too old. Btw, I never did get the big deal with the Tomothy Zahn trilogy. Just because they were written better than the rest of the EU novels, doesn't make up for the laugable premise. Art trumps Force. __________________ Boo!

10-17-2002, 12:38 PM	#26
*IronParrot* Fowl Administrator Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Calgary or Edmonton, Canada Posts: 53,420	I'm a huge fan of George Lucas' film saga Star Wars, yes. You know, the kind that absolutely has to be at the opening show, perhaps even first in line and all (which I was for Phantom). But I don't concern myself with trivial knowledge... I find that just because someone "knows" how many windows there are on a Star Destroyer or what company manufactured the T-47 snowspeeders, it doesn't make him a bigger fan than me. I just concern myself with the mythical story aspect, mostly. As for the Expanded Universe, I find that it is just extraneous material that doesn't mesh with the films, and in fact takes many elements of the films and renders them comparably insignificant. What's the point of Boba Fett dying if he's just going to be barfed back to life again? What's the point of the Empire being defeated if it's, well, not really defeated? What's the point of the Emperor perishing if he's cloned back to life? What's the point of the Force being created by all living things if some things are immune to it? What's so scary about the Death Star if there are so many other world-destroying superweapons? I think it's all just a bit silly, and that's not even going into things like Palpatine having a three-eyed son who's not actually his son but the clone of some other guy... Another big problem with it, when you look at all the "Essential Guides" and such and not just the Expanded Universe fiction, is that the fantasy element takes a backseat to mock sci-fi, which I find directly contradictory to how I see Star Wars, as mytho-fantasy and not science fiction. That's a separate debate entirely. My biggest problem with the Expanded Universe - a problem that will go away in another three years, thank goodness - is that suddenly, some people expect EU elements like Jaster Mareel and Sienar and everything in the Prequel Trilogy, when of course, we now know that Boba's just a clone of Jango, and Geonosians designed the Death Star. There are still some people who think Aurra Sing is going to be some super anti-Jedi bounty hunter in Episode III like she is in the comics, when really, all she is and ever was is an extra on a cliff who's in Phantom for two seconds. Proof that the books and comics have no weight in terms of the movies. I'm not going to bother with minor grievances like the second-rate prose, especially the inability of the movie novelizations in particular to capture the visual emotional power of the original work. I do own some Star Wars books, but they are only the type that look at the films as films, such as screenplays, "making-of" guides, and McQuarrie/Chiang concept artwork. But as far as the Expanded Universe "literature" goes, well, my time is very valuable to me and I'd rather be spending it on something worthwhile. Maybe even another run through The Lord of the Rings... that never seems to get old. __________________ All of IronParrot's posts are guaranteed to be 100% intelligent and/or sarcastic, comprising no genetically modified content and tested on no cute furry little animals unless the SPCA is looking elsewhere. If you observe a failure to uphold this warranty, please contact a forum administrator immediately to receive a full refund on your Entmoot registration. Blog: Nick's Café Canadien

10-18-2002, 07:48 AM	#27
Misty Mountain Goat Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 19	wow long post Last edited by Misty Mountain Goat : 10-18-2002 at 08:07 AM.

10-18-2002, 11:22 PM	#29
Ma Uai: Ua Nemti Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: We'd tell you but you're all out to get us. Posts: 215	Oh Lord! I hope not. GL should just quietly back down and die in some nice house on the beach, after ep. 3 of course (I gotta see how he is gonna pull this all together.) __________________ Pharoah "Vires decusque."

10-15-2002, 08:36 AM	#23
Misty Mountain Goat Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 19	To you people who bad mouth the recent expanded univerce novles are doing Georgie Boy a great disgrace. These new novels are fantastic and G/L himself loves the series. So how bout you keep your ill-founded "firm stands to your self" Slop, hah, quite the opposite my good freinds. A little harsh i know for a new comer, sorroy but thats my firm stance, and of course you can express what ever you want it is a post site aint it.

10-15-2002, 09:23 PM	#25
Misty Mountain Goat Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 19	Well Iron Parrot, You do have a good point, i can not prove this staement, yet, il have a go for you , not to prove you wrong, just for a bit of info. By the by are you a huge star wars fan? Some of these people (not naming any names) dont know what they are talking about. Star Wars is my forte. Even tho many people would know more tha me, im only 15. Also What is your bif with expanded universe, just wanted to know.

10-18-2002, 07:58 AM	#28
Misty Mountain Goat Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 19	Sorry, i must be talking to some type of expert if you can use bold font and insert inverted commers like that. I guess im out of my leage down here, up against the elders with upwards of 100000000 posts. Just because you think expanded universe is crap doesnt mean you can invert commers around the word literature. It still is literature. I thikn expanded universe gives people the feeling that the saga lives on after the second death star blows up. Its not the end and shouldnt be. Its not like anything hasnt happend since the Nazis were defeated, new threats etc have popped up eg. terrorists, eg the vong. Get off your high horse son and pull your head in. use your full page posts for more worthy apponants. Dont worry im sure all the other mooters will still think your cool.: No offence y'all Catch ya cobbers

10-20-2002, 03:49 AM	#31
Misty Mountain Goat Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 19	Allright then your justifications seem reasonalble. Plus your luiguistic skills are much too advanced for a fifteen year old im gonna drop this. I admit defeat. And i allso agree about not making the movies.7,8,9

11-04-2002, 02:22 PM	#32
Beleg Strongbow Truest of Friends Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Pennsylvania, but I have a vacation home in the Westfarthing. Posts: 520	Not all fifteen-year old people speak as you do, Misty Mountain Goat. __________________ "...Beleg Strongbow, truest of friends, greatest in skill of all that harboured in the woods of Beleriand in the Elder Days..." Aure Entuleva! John Kerry for President!

11-08-2002, 11:03 PM	#33
Goldberry1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: DC or Delaware, depending on the time of year Posts: 244	I dont think there will be, and I wouldn't have been that heartbroken if they hadn't decided to do 1-3. The original ones were just fine with me! __________________ Oh, your collegiate grief has left you dowdy in sweatshirts, absolute horror!

11-09-2002, 12:02 AM	#34
Ma Uai: Ua Nemti Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: We'd tell you but you're all out to get us. Posts: 215	Amen Goldberry! Amen! __________________ Pharoah "Vires decusque."

11-17-2002, 09:25 AM	#35
Nilore Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: I am every where and I am no where, I am everyone and I am no-one! HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Posts: 319	YEP! I've heard he is but it would get boring after that and it would have to be about something different. Nilore __________________ UZG-BURGÛLU-OB GHASHANUM GHASHNUM-OB MOR ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Raise the Phial of Galadriel and let the Star Glass of Lothlorian cast out the Darkness of Shelob's Lair. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Naur an edraith ammen! Naur dan i ngaurholth! There was a roar and a crackle, and the tree above him burst into a leaf and bloom of blinding flame. The whole hill was crowned with a dazzling light! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ bhûl latu dûmp Accept Your DOOM ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ DIE MERE MORTALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh NO I AM A MERE MORTAL AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHH Stop the NUKE Stop the NUKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nilore writes last will and testament. Gets on knees And begs God for Mercy. Realizes He's already dead Flies up to heaven ( By the power of Red Bull) and lives happily ever after. THE END ( It's a MINI adventure) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

11-17-2002, 05:20 PM	#36
Lief Erikson Elf Lord Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Fountain Valley, CA Posts: 6,343	Well, I tend to think that the first three fit pretty neatly in with Episodes 4-6 because it's the same story. Phantom Menace really seemed pretty far out at first, but Attack of the Clones brought it closer to the story, and Episode 3 will complete the link. My parents also like the original trilogy better, and I don't know which I prefer. But I really like the acting in Episode 2, particularly on the part of Anakin, and I'm looking forward enormously to the next one.

11-17-2002, 06:07 PM	#38
Lief Erikson Elf Lord Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Fountain Valley, CA Posts: 6,343	I see. Well, then we're at a difference of opinion.

11-17-2002, 06:26 PM	#39
Wayfarer The Insufferable Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,333	Right. So you state your case, and I'll state mine, and we'll attempt to resolve opposing viewpoints into truth. __________________ Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned

11-18-2002, 01:34 AM	#40
Lief Erikson Elf Lord Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Fountain Valley, CA Posts: 6,343	Sometimes for a story there are many intepretations that might be correct, but I'll go ahead and set out my own opinions . . . Anakin's acting I found brilliant. He had to show that he had a major crush, and he had to portray himself at that unstable stage of rebellious teenager. He does look at Padmé in a manner that he wouldn't look at any other woman with, and that is because of his crush (Which may or may not be love). He is strongly attracted to her, both physically and because of her personality. I personally don't read into it that his looking at her in the caressing way he did revealed lust. The acting he shows in bringing across the attraction and instability is very good, along with the common teenager attitude of seeking more freedom. Some other enormously difficult scenes he had to play include the scene where he's confessing to Padmé his murder of the Tusken Raiders. The shifts in emotion and behavior are extremely well acted in that scene. The transition from light to dark was very well played, in the slow turn around he did. Placing himself between the character traits of Episode 1 and the traits of the last three episodes was also, I think, very neat in terms of revealing the transition. In Episode 1 he is a good kid, trying to become a good person and to do the right thing. He reveals self confidence and a touch of the recklessness he also shows in Episode 2, but which also could be tempered to goodness and changed to bravery, given maturity and experience. In Episode 2, he has a firmer knowledge of his own abilities and powers, and knows that he has the ability to go far. He has the same self confidence and recklessness, but these character aspects later on in the film become played up as self confidence becomes arrogance and recklessness becomes disobedience. His seeking to become a good person and to do what is right is always there, but I think it gets buried in the turmoil of the events following his mother's death and the confusion of Episode 3. His pain at his mother's death was very well acted, as well, as was his relationship with Obi-Wan.

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