Favorite Fortress

[Haradrim]

also Valinor was a country not a fortress so Valinor doesnt count. That would be like saying ME is my favorite fortress. Also i didnt even know Giants existed in tolkiens works. Huh.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Well they are definitly in the Hobbit.

[Haradrim]

when??

[trolls' bane]

During a storm, when they're in the misty mountains. They went to a cave for refuge, but got taken prisoner by orcs instead.

[BeardofPants]

Yep, from the hobbit POV though, IIRC. IOW, the stone giants causing the storm may not have been stone giants at all... it's a bit contentious.

[Olmer]

Originally Posted by Valandil

General rule of thumb: If Tolkien didn't say it, it's mere speculation.

Sometime Tolkien was giving just a hints, leaving for you to speculate on the giving facts.
Helm's Deep was built by Gondor and later reinforced by Rohan.
But somewhere in the books of ME history I saw the mention of giants in some connection with Rohan. But don't even ask where, because , beats me if I remember in which book to look for.

[Halbarad of the Dunedain]

I think you mean the part where Tolkien speaks in metaphore, saying that Helms deep must have been built by giants of men. Something along those lines. The part in the Hobbit does specificly mention Giants, people seem to read this wrong every time its mentioned, the storm is real and so are the giants, the thingsi s they are both used metephoricly to describe eachother. Anyhow back on the thread subject, My favorite fortress isn't exactlly a fortress but isnt as huge as Valinor either. My favorite... fortress, Haven, city was Andúnië of Númenor. If that doesn't work then I would have to say my second favorite is Minas Ithil, or Minas Morgul.

[Draken]

Giants of men who couldn't manage to build a drawbridge, is my point.

I'll shut up now...

[Valandil]

Originally Posted by Halbarad of the Dunedain

I think you mean the part where Tolkien speaks in metaphore, saying that Helms deep must have been built by giants of men. Something along those lines. The part in the Hobbit does specificly mention Giants, people seem to read this wrong every time its mentioned, the storm is real and so are the giants, the thingsi s they are both used metephoricly to describe eachother...

Not necessarily... remember that Gandalf also mentions finding some more or less decent giant to plug up the cave the orcs captured them in. I think JRRT intended there to be giants in Middle-earth when he wrote 'The Hobbit'... when he wrote LOTR, he either found no role for them, or discarded the notion.

I think we could satisfy almost everyone (well... maybe THAT's a stretch) to say that there WERE giants in the Misty Mountains - and maybe a few other places, but that they were few in number and rather reclusive. I doubt they could have been coaxed into helping the Numenoreans build Helm's Deep.

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla...

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by Valandil

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla...

Or the walls of the ancient greek city of Mycene. That type of wall is named 'cyclopean wall' IIRC because the stone blocks are so large that they seemed to be put together by giants. I wonder which of these mythological connections Tolkien used.

[Haradrim]

Andunie is allowed. Just about everything except for countriesd or regions are allowed. Like No ME and No Gondor.

[The Gaffer]

Originally Posted by Valandil

I think JRRT intended there to be giants in Middle-earth when he wrote 'The Hobbit'... when he wrote LOTR, he either found no role for them, or discarded the notion.

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla...

Exactly. It seems much of his world was influenced by Norse mythology.

Beorn seems like another such "mathom" in the LOTR bestiary.

Anyway, mine would be Henneth Annun and Minas Morgul because of how they are described in the text and their roles in the story.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Would Henneth Annun be regarded as a fortress?

[Haradrim]

yes it would be. Just no countries or continents.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

What about Moria. That was a country and a fortress.

[Haradrim]

was Moria a country I always thought of it as something between a country and a fortress. A lot of the dwarf kingdoms are like that. Erebor and Moria are relatively similar to that aspect. ALso I meant something like Gondor doesnt count. ANything that has cities towns and/ or multiple lords.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally Posted by Haradrim

was Moria a country I always thought of it as something between a country and a fortress. A lot of the dwarf kingdoms are like that. Erebor and Moria are relatively similar to that aspect. ALso I meant something like Gondor doesnt count. ANything that has cities towns and/ or multiple lords.

Moria was Khazad-dum, but was later called Moria after the Balrog was freed.

[Haradrim]

was khazud-dum a country. i always thought it was just that area surrounding the bridge.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally Posted by Haradrim

was khazud-dum a country. i always thought it was just that area surrounding the bridge.

It was not a country but a great mansion and home of Durin's folk. It was expanded many times.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Did the dwarves have their own name for it because Moria was elvish.