Mistake in FotR

Noble Elf Lord · 08-08-2008, 03:41 PM

Ok. I'm tired, it's 22:36 here and I certainly won't start looking for old similar threads like this. To the point:

In FotR, somewhere during Bilbo's birthday party (don't have the book at hand) it says something like "144 hobbits laughed" (or stared in awe, I can't remember) in the great tent. This tent was for honored guests, right? And Gandalf was there. 144 guests. Gandalf one of them. So 144 hobbits could not do whatever it was they were doing. Sorry if this was done before.

Ye gods, thunder! Have to stop.

The last sane person · 08-08-2008, 03:50 PM

uh...do whatever it was that they were doing?

As in? I dunno, maybe it was not so much of a tent as it was a covered pavillion? Those can get pretty huge.

***Varnafindë*** · 08-08-2008, 05:31 PM

Perhaps Frodo wasn't counted as a guest, but counted as laughing - then you get 144 after all.

sisterandcousinandaunt · 08-09-2008, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noble Elf Lord

In FotR, somewhere during Bilbo's birthday party (don't have the book at hand) it says something like "144 hobbits laughed" (or stared in awe, I can't remember) in the great tent. This tent was for honored guests, right? And Gandalf was there. 144 guests. Gandalf one of them. So 144 hobbits could not do whatever it was they were doing. Sorry if this was done before.

Ye gods, thunder! Have to stop.

Well, the short answer is, it doesn't say that. It says, "One hundred and fourty four flabbergasted hobbits sat back speechless." Right after Gandalf put in a flash to cover his disappearance. He'd already offended them by saying their numbers had been chosen to total the birthdays and they felt they'd only been asked to make up the total.

Why can't this happen, and what does Gandalf have to do with it?

***Varnafindë*** · 08-09-2008, 07:54 AM

Nel means that it should say '143 hobbits and a wizard'.

Noble Elf Lord · 08-09-2008, 08:42 AM

Yep. Varnafindë is right.

***Valandil*** · 08-09-2008, 09:14 AM

I don't think Gandalf had to be among the 144 guests to be present for the activities under the pavillion. He was a special case.

Or else... he just crashed the party!

***Varnafindë*** · 08-09-2008, 10:33 AM

Or else, he was one of the guests, and Frodo was the special case, so that there would be 144 hobbits after all.

sisterandcousinandaunt · 08-09-2008, 11:58 AM

No. It says 144 hobbits sat back speechless. It doesn't happen to mention"but the waiters continued pouring drinks, Frodo sat quietly (although it mentioned that later) and Gandalf was keeping his own counsel, as usual." And it doesn't mention the dwarves, at all, although we know they were there. I'm not even sure the 144 included the young hobbits... we're told that acceptances to the invitation had "hundreds of polite variations on "thank you, I shall certainly come" and the difficulty that "bringing up young hobbits took a lot of provender" so when he says "the invitations were limited to 12 dozen ...with the addition of a few special unrelated friends (such as Gandalf)" I think there's room to figure there were more people than that in the tent, as well as the hordes in the field. Frodo, of course, as a birthday boy himself, wouldn't be counted against the guest total.

Attalus · 08-09-2008, 02:41 PM

Well, to pick at this nit, I doubt seriously whether Gandalf or Frodo would have ben flabbergasted: they were "in the know." Bilbo wouldn't have counted Frodo or Gandalf as invited guests, because Frodo was one of the hosts, and Gandalf providing entertainment. There were servants, too, as mentioned in the quote, and they would not have counted as invitees.

BTW, if Gandalf was ever flabbergasted once in his life, I'd like to hear about it.

Jon S. · 08-13-2008, 10:08 PM

Even so, it's only a mistake if meant literally.

Amael · 08-28-2008, 09:29 AM

90% of the errors in the movie had something to do with Gandalf, and why not? Gandalf and Sauron competed for Time Magazine's most popular celebrities of the Third Age, and Gandalf was everywhere!

08-08-2008, 03:41 PM	#1
Noble Elf Lord Leaf-Crowned Lord Of Elvenpath Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Heaven by the looks of it. Hell by the feel of it. Posts: 1,052	Mistake in FotR Ok. I'm tired, it's 22:36 here and I certainly won't start looking for old similar threads like this. To the point: In FotR, somewhere during Bilbo's birthday party (don't have the book at hand) it says something like "144 hobbits laughed" (or stared in awe, I can't remember) in the great tent. This tent was for honored guests, right? And Gandalf was there. 144 guests. Gandalf one of them. So 144 hobbits could not do whatever it was they were doing. Sorry if this was done before. Ye gods, thunder! Have to stop. __________________ Hers.

08-08-2008, 03:50 PM	#2
The last sane person The Black Númenórean Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 6,773	uh...do whatever it was that they were doing? As in? I dunno, maybe it was not so much of a tent as it was a covered pavillion? Those can get pretty huge. __________________ Your children are not your children. They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself. They come through you but not from you, And though they are with you yet they belong not to you. You may give them your love but not your thoughts, For they have their own thoughts. You may house their bodies but not their souls, For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow, which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.

08-08-2008, 05:31 PM	#3
*Varnafindë* Princess of the Noldor (and Administrative Empress of the Lone Islands) Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Imladris (and sometimes Norway) Posts: 3,304	Perhaps Frodo wasn't counted as a guest, but counted as laughing - then you get 144 after all. __________________ Signature picture art - Bard the Bowman - by vigshane Avatar art - Footsteps of Spring (a young Luthien) - by Henning Janssen

08-09-2008, 07:54 AM	#5
*Varnafindë* Princess of the Noldor (and Administrative Empress of the Lone Islands) Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Imladris (and sometimes Norway) Posts: 3,304	Nel means that it should say '143 hobbits and a wizard'. __________________ Signature picture art - Bard the Bowman - by vigshane Avatar art - Footsteps of Spring (a young Luthien) - by Henning Janssen

08-09-2008, 08:42 AM	#6
Noble Elf Lord Leaf-Crowned Lord Of Elvenpath Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Heaven by the looks of it. Hell by the feel of it. Posts: 1,052	Yep. Varnafindë is right. __________________ Hers.

08-09-2008, 09:14 AM	#7
*Valandil* High King at Annuminas Administrator Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Wyoming - USA Posts: 10,752	I don't think Gandalf had to be among the 144 guests to be present for the activities under the pavillion. He was a special case. Or else... he just crashed the party! __________________ My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!!

08-09-2008, 10:33 AM	#8
*Varnafindë* Princess of the Noldor (and Administrative Empress of the Lone Islands) Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Imladris (and sometimes Norway) Posts: 3,304	Or else, he was one of the guests, and Frodo was the special case, so that there would be 144 hobbits after all. __________________ Signature picture art - Bard the Bowman - by vigshane Avatar art - Footsteps of Spring (a young Luthien) - by Henning Janssen

08-09-2008, 11:58 AM	#9
sisterandcousinandaunt Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 4,535	No. It says 144 hobbits sat back speechless. It doesn't happen to mention"but the waiters continued pouring drinks, Frodo sat quietly (although it mentioned that later) and Gandalf was keeping his own counsel, as usual." And it doesn't mention the dwarves, at all, although we know they were there. I'm not even sure the 144 included the young hobbits... we're told that acceptances to the invitation had "hundreds of polite variations on "thank you, I shall certainly come" and the difficulty that "bringing up young hobbits took a lot of provender" so when he says "the invitations were limited to 12 dozen ...with the addition of a few special unrelated friends (such as Gandalf)" I think there's room to figure there were more people than that in the tent, as well as the hordes in the field. Frodo, of course, as a birthday boy himself, wouldn't be counted against the guest total. __________________ That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May

08-09-2008, 02:41 PM	#10
Attalus Swan-Knight of Dol Amroth Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: On the Bay of Belfalas Posts: 1,125	Well, to pick at this nit, I doubt seriously whether Gandalf or Frodo would have ben flabbergasted: they were "in the know." Bilbo wouldn't have counted Frodo or Gandalf as invited guests, because Frodo was one of the hosts, and Gandalf providing entertainment. There were servants, too, as mentioned in the quote, and they would not have counted as invitees. BTW, if Gandalf was ever flabbergasted once in his life, I'd like to hear about it. __________________ "What song the Sirens sang, or what name Achilles assumed when he hid himself among women, though puzzling questions are not beyond conjecture." - Sir Thomas Browne, Urn Burial.

08-13-2008, 10:08 PM	#11
Jon S. Elven Warrior Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 455	Even so, it's only a mistake if meant literally. __________________ Don't curse the darkness - light a candle.

08-28-2008, 09:29 AM	#12
Amael Elven Warrior Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Somewhere Between Here and There Posts: 237	90% of the errors in the movie had something to do with Gandalf, and why not? Gandalf and Sauron competed for Time Magazine's most popular celebrities of the Third Age, and Gandalf was everywhere!

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