the waters of cuivienen

carlrodd · 02-13-2007, 01:40 PM

this portion of tolkien's history is quite possibly my favorite; i suppose since so little is known of it, but it was presumably a long period of time that the elves resided here. i have been reading through 'the shaping of middle earth', and i still cannot place where the inland sea of helcar would have been. i understand that the surface and shape of the world was altered numerous times after the elves awoke, but even tolkien's diagrams seem to conflict. it appears to have occupied a large area just over the blue mountains originally, which would seem to have placed it in the better known NW middle earth of the third age. any ideas, insight? i am also intrigued by how perhaps an oblique reference is made to perhaps the elves longing for their place of awakening, when tolkien says, 'to cuivienen there is no returning'. that statement automatically makes it a place i want to go to.

jammi567 · 02-13-2007, 05:07 PM

try looking here: http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/default.asp Go to 'C', and then it's near the bottom of the last column.

Jon S. · 03-10-2007, 09:29 PM

Isn't this pic wonderful?

http://www.cuivienen.org/images/sil-cuivienen.jpg

Olmer · 03-11-2007, 12:30 AM

Ted Nasmith is a wonderful artist.
All his paintings are so detailed, taking a broader view of vicinities.
Here is another version of the lake.
Lake Cuivienen

elven dragonrider · 03-11-2007, 02:37 AM

Not trying to bust your bubble, but the link Jon S put on there looks to me like a pack of confused ancient Egyptians picked up and set down in the Great Lakes. I do agree that his sky is beautifully done and he is a very capable artist, and I do grant that different people percieve things in their imaginations differently, but his subject materiel is odd. I do not know how much physical description is givven in the books, so I may not be a fair judge. (<:What book is that in anyway?:>) Do they ever mention Gimli again at the end of the 3rd book? Do all the hobbits die? Don't answer the second question, but I think Pippin already has. He doesn't make it completely clear though, he doesn't just come out and say like the boring history teachers at school that I sleep through (not really, but once) Peregrin Took died at the battle of

forgot... the one at Sauron's gate. (EXcept the teachers know the name of the battle because they have the book sitting in front of them.)

Jon S. · 03-11-2007, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elven dragonrider

Not trying to bust your bubble, but the link Jon S put on there looks to me like a pack of confused ancient Egyptians picked up and set down in the Great Lakes.

Not to worry, my bubbles are not easily burst.

02-13-2007, 01:40 PM	#1
carlrodd Sapling Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: delaware Posts: 14	the waters of cuivienen this portion of tolkien's history is quite possibly my favorite; i suppose since so little is known of it, but it was presumably a long period of time that the elves resided here. i have been reading through 'the shaping of middle earth', and i still cannot place where the inland sea of helcar would have been. i understand that the surface and shape of the world was altered numerous times after the elves awoke, but even tolkien's diagrams seem to conflict. it appears to have occupied a large area just over the blue mountains originally, which would seem to have placed it in the better known NW middle earth of the third age. any ideas, insight? i am also intrigued by how perhaps an oblique reference is made to perhaps the elves longing for their place of awakening, when tolkien says, 'to cuivienen there is no returning'. that statement automatically makes it a place i want to go to.

02-13-2007, 05:07 PM	#2
jammi567 I'm Eru, and lord of Arda. Join Date: May 2006 Location: southampton, hampshire Posts: 2,609	try looking here: http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/default.asp Go to 'C', and then it's near the bottom of the last column. __________________ Vote for me, Jammi567, in the 2008 Entmoot elections, and you will get many of the things we need: free, unbiased, newspapers; a strong alliance with many countries, so that war doesn't start over someone breaking their nose on a doorframe; etc, etc This forum is lonely. It's new and confused, and doesn't have many friends yet. Help today by joining for free, posting, and posting this message and link in your sig. So please, join and help make it feel welcomed and loved. Last edited by jammi567 : 02-13-2007 at 05:08 PM.

03-11-2007, 12:30 AM	#4
Olmer Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: LI-woods, NY Posts: 653	Ted Nasmith is a wonderful artist. All his paintings are so detailed, taking a broader view of vicinities. Here is another version of the lake. Lake Cuivienen __________________ Uruk-hai, or the journey to there.

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03-10-2007, 09:29 PM	#3
Jon S. Elven Warrior Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 455	Isn't this pic wonderful? http://www.cuivienen.org/images/sil-cuivienen.jpg

03-11-2007, 02:37 AM	#5
elven dragonrider Elven Warrior Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Confusion Lane, on the back of a dragon, or on horseback. Posts: 186	Not trying to bust your bubble, but the link Jon S put on there looks to me like a pack of confused ancient Egyptians picked up and set down in the Great Lakes. I do agree that his sky is beautifully done and he is a very capable artist, and I do grant that different people percieve things in their imaginations differently, but his subject materiel is odd. I do not know how much physical description is givven in the books, so I may not be a fair judge. (<:What book is that in anyway?:>) Do they ever mention Gimli again at the end of the 3rd book? Do all the hobbits die? Don't answer the second question, but I think Pippin already has. He doesn't make it completely clear though, he doesn't just come out and say like the boring history teachers at school that I sleep through (not really, but once) Peregrin Took died at the battle of forgot... the one at Sauron's gate. (EXcept the teachers know the name of the battle because they have the book sitting in front of them.)