Balrog Parts

[Wayfarer]

How come, in the movie and most other representations I've seen, the balrog has horns? I mean, if I was a Maian spirit and a being of Fire and Power, I could do a bit better than Rams horn.

Another common idea that's just taken hold, you think?

[Ñólendil]

Probably just John Howe's animalic interpretation. In all his Balrog-illustrations you can see a very physical dark-skinned creature with large wings, fiery whips and nostril spouts -- and horns. Other artists have it too, you're right. Maybe it's because of it's demonic associations; people think of a devil.

[Wayfarer]

I suppose.

[Darkside Spirit]

There is no answer to any of these questions about Balrog parts IMHO because I'm sure that the Balrog was meant to be mysterious and difficult to make out. It's an "ancient evil from an earlier age" and a terrible secret awoken by the dwarves. It's something horrible and hidden, sheathed in fire, not some bug-eyed ugly monster.

Supposing the Balrog can grow body parts at will? It grows wings when it needs to fly or something? Whether or not it did have wings, they didn't do it much good when it fell down the chasm.

[mike]

Personally, I thought that the balrog was wolf-like and fiery and stuff in the movie he really just looked like a devil.

I guess that Moria could be orcish for hell?
nah.

[Ñólendil]

Welcome mike! 'Mória' is Grey-elven for 'Black Pit', which is close enough.

[Michael Martinez]

I suppose one could always ask him why his Balrogs have horns, but John Howe loves medieval motifs and his Middle-earth almost always looks like medieval Europe. And medieval artwork made extensive use of horns on depictions of Satan, as horns were a Biblical symbol of authority. I think Howe's Balrog is intended to reflect his medieval preferences. I don't suppose he has ever explained the horns, but that is my guess on why he prefers them.

In the movie, they appear to have attempted a compromise on the Balrog wings. As best I could determine, after only two viewings (so far -- I will see it again), the wings are not there to begin with, but they do appear briefly as the Balrog approaches the bridge and its flame and smoke (I guess that was the best they could do for "shadow stuff") billow out. The wings have a very shadowy appearance, in my opinion, and whatever else people may think of the Balrog, I think the wings were about as well done as one could hope for -- although it would have been nice to see them stretch from wall to wall.

The book, obviously, can afford to wallow in moments of time, drawing them out with splendid descriptions. The movie had to get on with the story, and like Tolkien said of the book, the chief flaw of the movie is that it is too short.

[Kevin McIntyre]

couldn't agree more Michael.

[FrodoFriend]

I can't say I ever pictured the Balrog with horns. The whole description in the book is extremely vague; it's just described as a "man-shape." I always pictured it as a huge humanoid figure with so much shadow and fire around it that you couldn't make out anything for certain. But I though the way it looked in the movie was very good, especially the whip. The shadow wings were nice too, although I'm pretty sure they're not real wings, just shadows that look like them.

[Wayfarer]

At first, I pictured the balrog as a shadow-within-shadow

Sort of like a black humanoid, surrounded by lesser darkness.

And then... When i realized it was supposed to be a demon of fire... I changed that picture. I still think it was more of a Dark and Flame creature than the Crusty Lava Monster that the movie Balrog seemed to be.

[Kwijibo]

I reckon SOME Balrogs had wings. I read at www.myprecious.co.uk that the Balrog which Glorfindel fought had real wings, while Gandalf's Balrog only had shadows that took the form of wings. But if Balrogs have wings, y don't they fly 2 safety after they fall off underground bridges/mountain tops/tower tops (since that's how most of them die). If i was a Balrog i'd probably fly away rather than just fall.

And what if the firey whips they had got tangled up in their wings?!?!?! They wouldn't be able 2 fly anywhere then! I reckon giving a Balrog something that could tangle up his wings is a pretty stupid idea HAHA

[Michael Martinez]

Originally posted by Kwijibo
I reckon SOME Balrogs had wings. I read at www.myprecious.co.uk that the Balrog which Glorfindel fought had real wings, while Gandalf's Balrog only had shadows that took the form of wings. But if Balrogs have wings, y don't they fly 2 safety after they fall off underground bridges/mountain tops/tower tops (since that's how most of them die). If i was a Balrog i'd probably fly away rather than just fall.

That site is apparently run by the highly disreputable Encyclopedia of Arda, which misrepresents the Balrog debate and slants their explanation of the Balrog wings in favor of the Moria Balrog not having wings.

In fact, it did, and they were not metaphorical, and they were not ambiguous, and it's a shame so many people have been deceived by such a dishonest site. I asked them twice to revise their erroneous statements about the pro-wing arguments and they refused.

The Encyclopedia of Arda also misrepresents other matters in Middle-earth. It brings about as much value to Tolkien readers as a David Day book.

I suggest you read this explanation of the Balrog Wings controversy which I wrote. Some people have accused me of bias, so I'll acknowledge the accusations up front. But the only bias I have is one for truth, not for promoting preconceived notions as if they were fact.

http://www.xenite.org/tolkien/do-bal...ave-wings.html

[markedel]

THe FELLOWSHIP HAS WINGS

Thus Gandalf says "Fly you fools"

If they didn't have wings-they couldn't fly!

[Wayfarer]

...late in his life Tolkien decided many of the fallen Maiar probably became trapped in their bodies due to engaging in biological activities.

That raises a whole other question-see thread title. ]: )

[Michael Martinez]

Originally posted by markedel
THe FELLOWSHIP HAS WINGS

Thus Gandalf says "Fly you fools"

If they didn't have wings-they couldn't fly!

But they are fools, so obviously they only THINK they have wings. After all, no one would deliberately misread or misinterpret what Gandalf says, now, would they? Hence, the Fellowship are all fools and that is why they run instead of fly away.

Not that Gandalfs remark has ever had anything to do with the fact that Balrogs have wings, but obviously people like to go off on tangents when they get bored with the wings debate.

[aldesign]

I agree with what Wayfarer beleived Balrogs to look like

because, ive seen one of Tolkiens original drawings, in which there is a general man type shape, which is all blacked out, kinda like its got a black sheet over it,
this is then engulfed in flames, and all u can see are some red-eyes


no horns - no wings, - no bull - no devil,


more like a ghostly-shadow on fire

[Comic Book Guy]

Aldesign, do you really think that such a big piece of evidence would go unnoticed with such a debated issue within a large community?. Anyway, your description of this picture is exactly like the one John Howe or Alan Lee drew for the movie.

[Michael Martinez]

Tolkien never drew any Balrogs.

John Howe's Balrog has wings. I don't recall if Alan Lee ever drew a Balrog.

[orald]

I thought the movie Balrog,looked identical to Blizzard entertainment's, Diablo. I'm sure there version is from an older adaption of the Demon.But seeing them both,you can't help but notice the extreme simularities.

[Agburanar]

I didn't 'like' the Balrog, but it was alright. It was a nice moment when Gandalf and the Balrog were on the bridge and you could see for a split second one of John Howe's well-known paintings. That was a nice touch.

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