Do you believe in UFOs: is there sentient life besides our own?!!!

The Telcontarion · 10-14-2006, 01:26 PM

Here is a very convincing link.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...60742580339958

All points of view welcome.

***Jonathan*** · 10-14-2006, 02:16 PM

There are of course Unidentified Flying Objects, which can be unidentified aircraft or optical phenomena or whatever.
You're thinking of UFOs of extraterrestrial origin. Their existance has yet to be proved.

If you count dolphins and whales, then yes - there is sentient life besides our own

. Perhaps there are sentient beings somewhere else in the universe but I don't believe they have ever visited the earth.

That video was 90 minutes long so I haven't watched it yet.

**Nurvingiel** · 10-14-2006, 03:28 PM

I do believe there is extraterrestrial life out there. That does not mean any UFOs seen on Earth, like Jonathan said, are of extraterrestrial origin.

I certainly think it's possible that somewhere in this universe there is other extraterrestrial life.

Spock · 10-14-2006, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Telcontarion

Do you believe in UFOs: is there sentient life besides our own?!!!

SENTIENT=to perceive by the senses or capable of feeling or perception.

There are times I think that many on Terra do not qualify under this definition.

I'm not sure but there must be something out there better than us.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Spock · 10-14-2006, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

I do believe there is extraterrestrial life out there.

OK.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

I certainly think it's possible that somewhere in this universe there is other extraterrestrial life.

You said that already.

**Nurvingiel** · 10-14-2006, 03:46 PM

Oops. I can't read today. I also meant to add sentient extraterrestrial life.

I definitely think there's extraterrestrial life, and I'm open to the possibility that some of it is sentient.

Spock · 10-14-2006, 03:54 PM

...ok, so that's like the line from "Private Benjamin"......."you will be practicing throwing live grenades; some of them are inert and some are ert."

.....I guess bugs are included?.....

Spock · 10-14-2006, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Telcontarion

Do you believe in UFOs: is there sentient life besides our own?!!!

To address the first part of your question. YES!

***Jonathan*** · 10-14-2006, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spock

To address the first part of your question. YES!

So is that extraterrestrial UFOs or just UFOs in general?

The Telcontarion · 10-14-2006, 04:05 PM

I see that people are replying without looking at the video. Let me clarify, I want your responses to the video specifically...how convincing did you find it.

It is a long one so, if you only have 30 minuits or less just watch that much, when you have seen it all, then make a reply. I promise you if you watch just 30 minuits of this video you will not be able to stop.

Spock · 10-14-2006, 04:10 PM

Some of us are on Dial up.....the video is long......the person speaking is well known in UFO circles

...I believe in UFO's. I believe in UFO's from other than earth.

Gwaimir Windgem · 10-14-2006, 04:50 PM

I'm not going to watch a 90-minute video, but here are my answers to your question:

1) I neither believe in nor reject the existence of UFOs. Sorta like the imminent end of the world.
2) Yes. See Spock's definition; "sentient" means having sensation, so any other animal.

***Jonathan*** · 10-14-2006, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

2) Yes. See Spock's definition; "sentient" means having sensation, so any other animal.

I defined "sentient" as being self-aware, something which most animals are not. I'm sure that's the definition Telcontarion had in mind.

Gwaimir Windgem · 10-14-2006, 05:10 PM

Dictionary.com:

sen‧tient /ˈsɛnʃənt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sen-shuhnt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. having the power of perception by the senses; conscious.
2. characterized by sensation and consciousness.

Spock · 10-14-2006, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonathan

I defined "sentient" as being self-aware, something which most animals are not. I'm sure that's the definition Telcontarion had in mind.

Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!"
Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

Words have meaning. You can't choose what a word means and maintain civilizations understanding.

GW & I have it right.

Gwaimir Windgem · 10-14-2006, 06:42 PM

This is true. Language becomes useless if it becomes subjective.

***Jonathan*** · 10-14-2006, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spock

Words have meaning. You can't choose what a word means and maintain civilizations understanding.

GW & I have it right.

Sheesh Spock, what is up with you and your rolleyes smileys?

When The Telcontarion asked whether there is sentient life besides our own, he sure meant life with some kind of intelligence that could be compared to the relative intelligence of humans. He obviously did not have in mind a definition of sentient that would include every animal on earth. Pick on words all you want but only do so only as long as you also contribute to the discussion.

It would be useless to say "no, this word means THIS and not THAT - end of discussion".

Gwaimir Windgem · 10-14-2006, 06:49 PM

I'm wondering what exactly he meant. You took him to mean "self-aware", but I would have imagined "rational".

The Telcontarion · 10-14-2006, 06:57 PM

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...85100897567649

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...26345538570434

***Rían*** · 10-14-2006, 09:28 PM

I took it how Jonathan took it, and how it is normally taken in discussions like this - the #2 definition, where "conscious" is "aware of oneself as a thinking being; knowing what one is doing and why", or "same as self-conscious". (Websters)

Words need to mean something, but I think "dictionary" side-discussions should be with the goal of seeking/clarifying a meaning, and Jonathan's definition is clearly supported by a dictionary definition, and I think is the most reasonable definition to go by, given this topic (but of course, Telcontarion has the final word on what he meant!

) Second, third & etc. dictionary definitions aren't "less good" than the first; they exist because they're valid for certain uses of the word! *shrug* It's like when I use the word "faith", specifically giving the definition of "unquestioning belief that does not require proof or evidence", and people refuse to accept that this includes beliefs that are not accompanied by fancy clothing and smells and rituals.

As far as the original question - I think it is a possibility that a reasonable person cannot exclude. (I'll try to get to the video ... promise!)

10-14-2006, 01:26 PM	#1
The Telcontarion The one true King of the human race, direct descendant of Adam and heir to the kings of old. "You owe me your fealty." The Tar Minyaturion Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: By the shores of cuivinien Posts: 694	Do you believe in UFOs: is there sentient life besides our own?!!! Here is a very convincing link. http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...60742580339958 All points of view welcome. __________________ Proverbs 21:3 To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice. Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5 1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation... ...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity. Romans 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

10-14-2006, 03:54 PM	#7
Spock An enigma in a conundrum Join Date: Oct 1999 Posts: 6,476	...ok, so that's like the line from "Private Benjamin"......."you will be practicing throwing live grenades; some of them are inert and some are ert." .....I guess bugs are included?..... __________________ Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

10-14-2006, 04:05 PM	#10
The Telcontarion The one true King of the human race, direct descendant of Adam and heir to the kings of old. "You owe me your fealty." The Tar Minyaturion Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: By the shores of cuivinien Posts: 694	I see that people are replying without looking at the video. Let me clarify, I want your responses to the video specifically...how convincing did you find it. It is a long one so, if you only have 30 minuits or less just watch that much, when you have seen it all, then make a reply. I promise you if you watch just 30 minuits of this video you will not be able to stop. __________________ Proverbs 21:3 To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice. Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5 1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation... ...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity. Romans 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; Last edited by The Telcontarion : 10-14-2006 at 04:06 PM.

10-14-2006, 04:10 PM	#11
Spock An enigma in a conundrum Join Date: Oct 1999 Posts: 6,476	Some of us are on Dial up.....the video is long......the person speaking is well known in UFO circles ...I believe in UFO's. I believe in UFO's from other than earth. __________________ Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

10-14-2006, 04:50 PM	#12
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	I'm not going to watch a 90-minute video, but here are my answers to your question: 1) I neither believe in nor reject the existence of UFOs. Sorta like the imminent end of the world. 2) Yes. See Spock's definition; "sentient" means having sensation, so any other animal. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

10-14-2006, 02:16 PM	#2
*Jonathan* Entmoot Attorney-General, Equilibrating the Scales of Justice, Administrator ♎ Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 3,891	There are of course Unidentified Flying Objects, which can be unidentified aircraft or optical phenomena or whatever. You're thinking of UFOs of extraterrestrial origin. Their existance has yet to be proved. If you count dolphins and whales, then yes - there is sentient life besides our own . Perhaps there are sentient beings somewhere else in the universe but I don't believe they have ever visited the earth. That video was 90 minutes long so I haven't watched it yet. __________________ An unwritten post is a delightful universe of infinite possibilities. Set down one word, however, and it immediately becomes earthbound. Set down one sentence and it’s halfway to being just like every other bloody entry that’s ever been written. ☻

10-14-2006, 05:10 PM	#14
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Dictionary.com: sen‧tient /ˈsɛnʃənt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sen-shuhnt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –adjective 1. having the power of perception by the senses; conscious. 2. characterized by sensation and consciousness. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

10-14-2006, 06:42 PM	#16
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	This is true. Language becomes useless if it becomes subjective. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

10-14-2006, 06:49 PM	#18
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	I'm wondering what exactly he meant. You took him to mean "self-aware", but I would have imagined "rational". __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

10-14-2006, 06:57 PM	#19
The Telcontarion The one true King of the human race, direct descendant of Adam and heir to the kings of old. "You owe me your fealty." The Tar Minyaturion Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: By the shores of cuivinien Posts: 694	shorter videos http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...85100897567649 http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...26345538570434 __________________ Proverbs 21:3 To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice. Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5 1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation... ...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity. Romans 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

10-14-2006, 09:28 PM	#20
*Rían* Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Not where I want to be ... Posts: 15,254	I took it how Jonathan took it, and how it is normally taken in discussions like this - the #2 definition, where "conscious" is "aware of oneself as a thinking being; knowing what one is doing and why", or "same as self-conscious". (Websters) Words need to mean something, but I think "dictionary" side-discussions should be with the goal of seeking/clarifying a meaning, and Jonathan's definition is clearly supported by a dictionary definition, and I think is the most reasonable definition to go by, given this topic (but of course, Telcontarion has the final word on what he meant! ) Second, third & etc. dictionary definitions aren't "less good" than the first; they exist because they're valid for certain uses of the word! shrug It's like when I use the word "faith", specifically giving the definition of "unquestioning belief that does not require proof or evidence", and people refuse to accept that this includes beliefs that are not accompanied by fancy clothing and smells and rituals. As far as the original question - I think it is a possibility that a reasonable person cannot exclude. (I'll try to get to the video ... promise!) __________________ . I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 10-14-2006 at 09:41 PM.

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