Certain X-Men vs. Jedis

[Bombadillo]

During the course of three and a half hours last night, Anglorfin and I argued about who would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi. He thinks that a Jedi would not stand a chance against Charles Xavier, but I maintain that he is nothing compared to a Jedi.

Eventually, we had to ignore a few 'limitations' that were there on either side, including X's being a nice guy, and the Jedi's cherishing balance in the Force. We also debated what power they had behind them; Professor X is powerful enough to find and track every human and/or mutant on Earth, but Jedi's are weilders of the Force which binds all things together in the entire universe.

Eventually we also figurted that the fight could not ever take place as they are two different fictions, with two different sets of 'laws' applying to the use of their abilities.

During this argument, we made no progress toward a solution, but I more or less concluded Anglorfin is wrong in one sense at least: He certainly can't kick him to death.


So, I'll have to ask the mooters. Who do you think would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi?
Please explain your decision and give the best argument you can, based on the SW movies and the X-Men comic books.

[mithrand1r]

Originally posted by Bombadillo
During the course of three and a half hours last night, Anglorfin and I argued about who would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi. He thinks that a Jedi would not stand a chance against Charles Xavier, but I maintain that he is nothing compared to a Jedi.

Eventually, we had to ignore a few 'limitations' that were there on either side, including X's being a nice guy, and the Jedi's cherishing balance in the Force. We also debated what power they had behind them; Professor X is powerful enough to find and track every human and/or mutant on Earth, but Jedi's are weilders of the Force which binds all things together in the entire universe.

Eventually we also figurted that the fight could not ever take place as they are two different fictions, with two different sets of 'laws' applying to the use of their abilities.

During this argument, we made no progress toward a solution, but I more or less concluded Anglorfin is wrong in one sense at least: He certainly can't kick him to death.


So, I'll have to ask the mooters. Who do you think would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi?
Please explain your decision and give the best argument you can, based on the SW movies and the X-Men comic books.

Which jedi?

Some jedi are more "powerful" in the force than others. I think that someone of Vader's or Yoda's level could at least give X a good run for money in not win.

If someone was of Luke's level in SW:ANH then X would easily be able to win. (with or without kicking )

Another question: Are you permiting any weapons they may bring or just "man on man" with no weapons. This may have some bearing on who could theoretically win.

[Jonathan]

The world's most powerful practician of telepathy and psychokinesis, Professor X, got to win a fight against a Jedi. It might be a close one, but chances that Xavier will win are quite big IMO.

[Sheeana]

What about Dark Phoenix? She certainly didn't have any qualms about being evil, and I can certainly see her kicking serious butt against the jedi.

[Sheeana]

Originally posted by Jonathan
The world's most powerful practician of telepathy and psychokinesis, Professor X, got to win a fight against a Jedi. It might be a close one, but chances that Xavier will win are quite big IMO.

Why? Charles powers are limited to certain contraints, whereas the jedi are tapping into something that exists everywhere. Dark Phoenix, OTOH, has at least a running chance against some of the weaker jedi because her powers don't share the same limitations as Xavier.

[Jonathan]

Originally posted by Sheeana
Why? Charles powers are limited to certain contraints

True. But I'd root for the professor anyway

[Bombadillo]

In response to just about all:

Which Jedi? I brought that up later on. I think there is a definate difference in the fighting style and power of a Dark Jedi and a Light. So Vader, in RotJ. He's the most well-rounded.

About limits of Charles Xavier: Sheeana, I'm not sure which limits you refer to. But some are barred so it would be possible for them to unleash all hell upon each other without restraint. If it limits him from doing so, we barred it.

Also, I'd like to point out that Charles Xavier is the most powerful telepathic and pshycokinetic mind in the /world/, but Jedis exist throughout all the /universe/.

[Sheeana]

Originally posted by Bombadillo
About limits of Charles Xavier: Sheeana, I'm not sure which limits you refer to.

I refer to his being only the most powerful mind on Earth, AND that his powers are limited to psychokinesis and other such psychic realms. The jedi do not have this limit as the force binds everything, and exists everywhere in the universe.

[Anglorfin]

To the best of my knownledge, NO Jedi has ever been capable of the mental control that Charles Xavier is capable of. he can walk through public places going unnoticed by anyone if he so desired, and he could kill in an instant if he also desired it. And just because he's a nice guy doesn't mean that he wouldn't unleash hell. I'm a nice guy too but if I knew someone was going for the kill I'd do my very best to get there first.

Bombadillo, you are too confused with the Jedi's notion of their power levels. It is their innate capacity to handle a particular amount of the Force. That never changes, although their control over what was given to them does. Whatever the case, every known Jedi's abilities fall way short of what professor X is capable of.

Eventually we also figurted that the fight could not ever take place as they are two different fictions, with two different sets of 'laws' applying to the use of their abilities.

Well duh they couldn't take place, but you can't dismiss the concept as being theoretical when you KNEW it was just that in the first place. So we take Prof. X from his fiction where his laws apply to him, and we take a Jedi from his fiction where his laws apply to him, wheighing the scales would show us that X comes out on top because whether or not whatever "restrictions" you THINK a Jedi suffers from are in fact what distinguishes him as a Jedi. And among those would be the control over their "powers" that is far inferior to Professor X's control over his.

[Sheeana]

Originally posted by Anglorfin
To the best of my knownledge, NO Jedi has ever been capable of the mental control that Charles Xavier is capable of.

What about Obi-Wan's mind fuzzling in A New Hope? If he can control what they (the stormtroopers) think and say, I don't think it's much of a stretch to think that he could convince them he was a pink fluffy elephant, or to follow your example, be completely invisible.

Another thing: Charles seems to be limited strictly to this physical realm (as far as I've read so far anyway), whereas since the force is EVERYWHERE, it stands to reason that a Jedi's abilities would be able to take him beyond the physical realm, and possibly into other dimensions that don't follow our conceived notions of physics.

Edit: the serials themselves state that Xavier is the most powerful mind on EARTH. Not the universe. That is telling in itself. (again, this is only as far as I've read.)

[Anglorfin]

Originally posted by Sheeana
What about Obi-Wan's mind fuzzling in A New Hope? If he can control what they (the stormtroopers) think and say, I don't think it's much of a stretch to think that he could convince them he was a pink fluffy elephant, or to follow your example, be completely invisible.

Another thing: Charles seems to be limited strictly to this physical realm (as far as I've read so far anyway), whereas since the force is EVERYWHERE, it stands to reason that a Jedi's abilities would be able to take him beyond the physical realm, and possibly into other dimensions that don't follow our conceived notions of physics.

Edit: the serials themselves state that Xavier is the most powerful mind on EARTH. Not the universe. That is telling in itself. (again, this is only as far as I've read.)

Because becoming "invisible" would have been the more practical thing to do, and Obi-wan didn't do it. Plus I have not known jedis to communicate with each other or anybody else telepathically (while still living at least). They are good at sensing things, but it's just that, sensing. Not the actual dialogue that Xavier is capable of.

Plus, there is something else Obi-wan said in that scene too. "The Force can have a considerable influence on the weak minded." I would not classify Professor X as "weak minded". Whereas Xavier is dealing directly with the physical and chemical compositions of what makes the brain function as an entity. He was capable of upholding mental blocks on Magneto and as a result was not able to just simply control his actions, but alter his personality, so even without direct control of his actions Xavier could be certain of what Magneto would do.

[HOBBIT]

We do not know all that much on what the jedi can do...

they are both different fiction worlds, so this is a very silly discussion.

But from what we do know about the jedi, probably they would win. They can effect all that is around them.... etc etc etc Jedis have that extreme concentration and strength too.........

"Plus I have not known jedis to communicate with each other or anybody else telepathically "

Um, not true. What about obi talking to luke after he died?? Luke and Leia talking to eachother telepathically - sending messages bakc and forth through their minds. Etc, etc. There is even more of this in EU books I believe.


And it would seem that dark jedi are very good at "going invisible." Senator Palpatine *cough*

Also...since you seem content on combining universes........what about Mutant Jedi? Why not??

Certainly a lot of jedi would be more powerful than a non-mind type - like more power over wolverine and such.

[mithrand1r]

Originally posted by Anglorfin
Because becoming "invisible" would have been the more practical thing to do, . . .

Not necessarily. It would have been , IMHO, more economical of Obi-wan's jedi abilities to fool/mislead the 1-3 stormtroopers involved directly in checking the speeder & passengers than to fool/mislead everyone in the area that they did not exist ("are invisible") and were not there.

[Anglorfin]

I said nothing of combining universes. Consider each intheir own respective fantasies, but given those specific parameters to REMAIN in their own fantasies, Professor Xavier has the more directly lethal power. Jedi's can't stop themselves from getting killed either. All X has to do is flip a chemical switch in their brain to make them crumble, while at the same time defending himself against whatever mind attacks a Jedi can think of.


And Obi could only talk to Luke while dead. It seems that there is some type of spiritual transition there that cannot be accomplished while the Jedi is alive.

And Palpatine is "hiding" behind nothing but politics. He is a clever diplomat, and Yoda couldn't touch him now even if he wanted to. At least we know that Yoda already suspects.

[littleCat]

Actually, if you think about it, if we put the jedi as a futureistic race, mutants could be their forefathers, and teh Jedi could be a strain of mutants that did not die off from hunting, generic problems, etc.
And I think ANY X-man could beat Luke. But Yoda could give Xavier a run for his money.

[The Ben]

Originally posted by Bombadillo
During the course of three and a half hours last night, Anglorfin and I argued about who would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi. He thinks that a Jedi would not stand a chance against Charles Xavier, but I maintain that he is nothing compared to a Jedi.

Eventually, we had to ignore a few 'limitations' that were there on either side, including X's being a nice guy, and the Jedi's cherishing balance in the Force. We also debated what power they had behind them; Professor X is powerful enough to find and track every human and/or mutant on Earth, but Jedi's are weilders of the Force which binds all things together in the entire universe.

Eventually we also figurted that the fight could not ever take place as they are two different fictions, with two different sets of 'laws' applying to the use of their abilities.

During this argument, we made no progress toward a solution, but I more or less concluded Anglorfin is wrong in one sense at least: He certainly can't kick him to death.


So, I'll have to ask the mooters. Who do you think would win in a fight: Professor X or a Jedi?
Please explain your decision and give the best argument you can, based on the SW movies and the X-Men comic books.

Well, can't compare the two. I mean, its like comparing apples and oranges!!

[Wayfarer]

Fruity.

My conclusion on these sorts of comparisons are that it's always situational.

If you want to say that, for the sake of this thought experiment, Professor X can control, alter, or otherwise influence minds, and that there isn't any appreciable limit on his power. He's not omnipotent, but he can influence an entire planet at once in certain circumstances.

Jedi seem to be able to do pretty much anything they want. For the purposes of comparison, most jedi have telepethy, and psychokinesis. There is theoretically no limit on how much they can do, but I notice that there are practical limits that vary for individual jedi.

I think mentally, Professor Xavier would have the upper hand over most jedi. After all, he seems to effortlessly control almost any mind he wants to, and any number of them at once. On the other hand, jedi powers only work on the 'weak minded'. They're rather easily countered, it seems.

On the other hand, professor Xavier can't throw things around with his mind or shoot lightning out of his fingertips, and he most likely couldn't defend against those sort of attacks anyway. In a physical confrontation, a jedi would probably win.

So the outcome would be determined by such factors as 'why are they fighting?', 'what does each of them know about the other?', and 'who gets the first attack?'

[The Ben]

At least you get my point

[hectorberlioz]

i think it evens out between pro.x and a jedi(a powerful one). unfortunately i cant say why since i've only seen the x-men movies and read like two comic books.
i think that wayfarer has a point too. its situatianal.

[elendili]

X wouldn't stand a chance against a lightning weilding jedi he'd fry in his chair but he'd definately win against the weaker ones like Luke.

Nightcrawler vs jedi would definately be interesting coz everytime a jedi goes near him he can just go *poof* but he'd have to fight using kicking so maybe it's not very fair.

This cud be a bit off topic but who's ur fav X-men? i'm torn between nightcrawler and rogue

does anyone actually respect luke? i think he's a useless crybaby personally