Influence or hoax?

[frodosampippinmerry]

Are there any Christian scholars that could steer me in the right direction? = I've seen websites claiming Tolkien was influenced by lovecraft, but considering that the horror Genre in general, and lovecraft's in particular, focus on out of control evil that would assume squash humans like insects or drive them mad, I doubt internet claims that tolkien (who was a good Catholic and whose beliefs are mirrored in his fantasy) ever knew, read, or commented on lovecraft (who was an athiest and wrote dark demonic tales laced with the occult and an air of despair, hopelessness, and inevitable, unavoidable doom at the hands of hostile gods). Do you know of anyone who can give me a christian perspective on lovecraft and any Christian tolkien scholors who might be able to tell me if Tolkien ever said anything about lovecraft or horror in general?

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I know of no place where Tolkien adverted to any awareness of Lovecraft. The comment at Moria about "older and fouler things than orcs" does have a certain resonance with Lovecraft, though.

To reject an author on the grounds that he was an atheist, or that he was a racist (which Lovecraft also was) is not really reasonable; we should rather judge the work, not the author. As a Catholic, I do not think there is anything wrong with Lovecraft as such. He speaks to a primal sense of the Alien that is hard-wired into the human mindset. If he were the only thing you ever read, I can see that you might get a bit screwed up. But since the time of Augustine, there has in Catholic letters been a sense of the importance and value of the Ugly, which allows the Beautiful to shine forth all the more brightly.

[frodosampippinmerry]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

I know of no place where Tolkien adverted to any awareness of Lovecraft. The comment at Moria about "older and fouler things than orcs" does have a certain resonance with Lovecraft, though.

To reject an author on the grounds that he was an atheist, or that he was a racist (which Lovecraft also was) is not really reasonable; we should rather judge the work, not the author. As a Catholic, I do not think there is anything wrong with Lovecraft as such. He speaks to a primal sense of the Alien that is hard-wired into the human mindset. If he were the only thing you ever read, I can see that you might get a bit screwed up. But since the time of Augustine, there has in Catholic letters been a sense of the importance and value of the Ugly, which allows the Beautiful to shine forth all the more brightly.

I'm not sure if you are criticizing my comment thinking I'm judging Lovecraft or saying that if Tolkien was a good Catholic he would have made this observation about lovecraft. In any case I wasn't rejecting lovecraft for his religious affiliation

[Tessar]

I have moved this thread to the Lord of the Rings forum.

[GrayMouser]

Only info I've seen says that Lovecraft wasn't published in Britain until 1951- but that doesn't mean the whole Weird Tales gang was unknown.

Anyway, there were lots of precedents to Lovecraft in the "unspeakable horror" and Elder Gods vein, going back through Dunsany all the way to back to William Beckford's "Vathek" and other gothic stories.

Here's a review of a book that seems to deal with the subject:

"The Mirror Crack'd: Fear and Horror in JRR Tolkien's Major Works"

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/The+Mi...s.-a0200344639