Did Luke kill the guards in RotJ?

hectorberlioz · 07-15-2006, 01:55 PM

Alright, here's what I'm talking about: When Luke opens the doors to Jabba's palace, there are two Piggy guards. They stop Luke, then Luke chokes them...to death? Or did he just knock em out?

I guess what I'm wondering is: Is this the Jedi way? I can imagine Maul, Dooku, and certainly Vader doing that, but not Yoda or Mace etc...

JTB · 07-15-2006, 03:26 PM

He just stopped them from stopping him...

...

Yeah.

me9996 · 07-15-2006, 04:44 PM

I guess it must run in the family... But that is a good point, did he choke them? If he did is it the Jedi way?

I guess if he did (I haven't seen it in a while) that it would be a dark side thing, he is wereing black there.

rohirrim TR · 07-15-2006, 04:48 PM

he chokes them? geez, huh? well I'll have to watch it again, I had it my mind that he simply used a mind trick on them, but he hadn't passed all of his trials at that time so 'technically' he wasn't a jedi yet. I don't know i'll have to watch it again,...in fact I think I should watch all 4 good SW movies while i'm at it.

ayra · 07-15-2006, 09:50 PM

He chokes them a little. They fall on the steps and decide that they don't want to mess with him.

hectorberlioz · 07-18-2006, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayra

He chokes them a little. They fall on the steps and decide that they don't want to mess with him.

I guess that would work...but why didn't he just use the mind trick?

me9996 · 07-18-2006, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

I guess that would work...but why didn't he just use the mind trick?

To little to work with

Or maybe he was? Maybe he was tricking them into thinking they were being choked!

hectorberlioz · 07-19-2006, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by me9996

To little to work with

Or maybe he was? Maybe he was tricking them into thinking they were being choked!

You're probably right, but I have another idea...

Return of the Jedi used to be called "Revenge" of the Jedi. What if George Lucas was going to make Luke bad at the beginning of the movie, then changed his mind (and diaper) and forgot to change the scene?

ayra · 07-20-2006, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

You're probably right, but I have another idea...

Return of the Jedi used to be called "Revenge" of the Jedi. What if George Lucas was going to make Luke bad at the beginning of the movie, then changed his mind (and diaper) and forgot to change the scene?

I don't know... But Luke could have used a mind trick on them that way...Either way, whether George Lucas changed his mind or what, I know I like it the way it is. I wonder what the book says. I have not read it in awhile. It might say what happend.

hectorberlioz · 07-22-2006, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayra

I don't know... But Luke could have used a mind trick on them that way...Either way, whether George Lucas changed his mind or what, I know I like it the way it is. I wonder what the book says. I have not read it in awhile. It might say what happend.

I hadn't thought about doing that myself...thanks for the reminder

Wasn't the Star Wars novelization ghostwritten by Alan Dean Foster?

durinsbane2244 · 07-22-2006, 11:59 AM

well, luke kills plenty o' guards in battle, so maybe, but this does seem a tad different...dunno...maybe he knocked 'em out..."force sleep"?

hectorberlioz · 07-22-2006, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by durinsbane2244

well, luke kills plenty o' guards in battle, so maybe, but this does seem a tad different...dunno...maybe he knocked 'em out..."force sleep"?

See, that was the problem, spontaneous battle-killing is one thing, but to just...you know, it just doesn't seem like a Luke thing to do.

durinsbane2244 · 07-22-2006, 12:13 PM

yeah, that's why i said he probably knocked em out...good call, hector...

Orchunter X · 07-30-2006, 11:31 AM

Naw, he killed them. I'd say though that he was justified: if he'd drawn his 'saber against them, he'd have created much more bloodshed then necessary for infiltrating the palace.

durinsbane2244 · 07-31-2006, 12:24 AM

why would it have been justified? they, as guards, were doing their jobs. how would killing them be justified, when he could just as easily knock them out?

Orchunter X · 07-31-2006, 11:50 AM

Whether they were doing their jobs or not, it doesn't matter, they were a deadly threat to our unarmed hero. Knocking some one unconcious is unreliable as they can wake up, a dangerous thing at times such as these.
Sure, with a blaster Luke could have taken them out just as quickly (let alone his lightsaber), but choking them was by far the most efficient way since he didn't want to have to fight at all if he didn't have to.

tolkienfan · 08-06-2006, 01:51 AM

I never noticed that! I just watched that part looking for it specifically. I don't think he killed them. I think he just started to choke them so they would be scared and leave him alone. Maybe the mind trick wouldn't have worked as well because if he stopped concentrating or something they would have realized it was a trick and stopped him. Maybe he knocked them out or scared them.

ayra · 08-06-2006, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tolkienfan

I never noticed that! I just watched that part looking for it specifically. I don't think he killed them. I think he just started to choke them so they would be scared and leave him alone. Maybe the mind trick wouldn't have worked as well because if he stopped concentrating or something they would have realized it was a trick and stopped him. Maybe he knocked them out or scared them.

That would work... If he had killed them he might of gotten into bigger trouble with Jabba and his helpers.

XRogue · 08-07-2006, 12:27 PM

I watched ROTJ again a couple of days ago...yes, he just choked them a bit and they collapse and leave Luke alone. Suspect he just didn't want them tailing around after him.

I also figure it was meant to subtly imply Luke was already having a little trouble with the Dark Side. Go figure, given whose kid he was, and the fact he had already run off from Dagobah and interrupted training to save his buds. Yes, I know he had a good intention, but then so did Vader, in some respects, and look where it got him. Yoda told Luke if he left then, he would become an agent of evil.

hectorberlioz · 08-07-2006, 06:25 PM

Good ideas here...just what I wanted. XRogue, excellent points about Luke's dark side potential, which had been on my mind.

Also, Orchunter X has reminded us that Luke did not have his lightsaber (remember, Artoo shoots it out to him in the Barge scene). I don't think he would have used it though, since he was keen on noisemaking just then. Perhaps it was a combination of wanting to instil fear in Jabba's court and a tad of dark side-ness.

07-15-2006, 01:55 PM	#1
hectorberlioz Master of Orchestration President Emeritus of Entmoot 2004-2008 Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Lost in the Opera House Posts: 9,328	Did Luke kill the guards in RotJ? Alright, here's what I'm talking about: When Luke opens the doors to Jabba's palace, there are two Piggy guards. They stop Luke, then Luke chokes them...to death? Or did he just knock em out? I guess what I'm wondering is: Is this the Jedi way? I can imagine Maul, Dooku, and certainly Vader doing that, but not Yoda or Mace etc... __________________ ACALEWIA- President of Entmoot hectorberlioz- Vice President of Entmoot Acaly und Hektor fur Presidants fur EntMut fur life! Join the discussion at Entmoot Election 2010. "Stupidissimo!"~Toscanini The Da CINDY Code The Epic Poem Of The Balrog of Entmoot: Here ~NEW! ~ Thinking of summer vacation? AboutNewJersey.com - NJ Travel & Tourism Guide

07-15-2006, 03:26 PM	#2
JTB Enting Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: TITANIC! Posts: 64	He just stopped them from stopping him... ... Yeah. __________________ A Wizard is never late, nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to.

07-15-2006, 09:50 PM	#5
ayra Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2006 Location: Kalia. YOU HUMANS CAN'T GO THERE! Also land of boredom Posts: 230	He chokes them a little. They fall on the steps and decide that they don't want to mess with him. __________________ I am Queen Tallie Falcon. Do not mess with me. US KALIANS WILL RULE THOSE FROM THE REPUBLIC! Kalia rocks!

07-22-2006, 11:59 AM	#11
durinsbane2244 Dreamweaver Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: The Misty Mountains, where the spirits go... Posts: 3,560	well, luke kills plenty o' guards in battle, so maybe, but this does seem a tad different...dunno...maybe he knocked 'em out..."force sleep"? __________________ Lord, what fools these mortals be! ---------------- We are the music-makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams, Wandering by lone sea-breakers, And sitting by desolate streams; World-losers and world-forsakers, On whom the pale moon gleams: Yet we are the movers and shakers Of the world for ever, it seems. ---------------- Shanti, shanti, shantih...

07-22-2006, 12:13 PM	#13
durinsbane2244 Dreamweaver Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: The Misty Mountains, where the spirits go... Posts: 3,560	yeah, that's why i said he probably knocked em out...good call, hector... __________________ Lord, what fools these mortals be! ---------------- We are the music-makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams, Wandering by lone sea-breakers, And sitting by desolate streams; World-losers and world-forsakers, On whom the pale moon gleams: Yet we are the movers and shakers Of the world for ever, it seems. ---------------- Shanti, shanti, shantih...

07-30-2006, 11:31 AM	#14
Orchunter X Sapling Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 5	Naw, he killed them. I'd say though that he was justified: if he'd drawn his 'saber against them, he'd have created much more bloodshed then necessary for infiltrating the palace.

07-31-2006, 12:24 AM	#15
durinsbane2244 Dreamweaver Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: The Misty Mountains, where the spirits go... Posts: 3,560	why would it have been justified? they, as guards, were doing their jobs. how would killing them be justified, when he could just as easily knock them out? __________________ Lord, what fools these mortals be! ---------------- We are the music-makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams, Wandering by lone sea-breakers, And sitting by desolate streams; World-losers and world-forsakers, On whom the pale moon gleams: Yet we are the movers and shakers Of the world for ever, it seems. ---------------- Shanti, shanti, shantih...

07-31-2006, 11:50 AM	#16
Orchunter X Sapling Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 5	Whether they were doing their jobs or not, it doesn't matter, they were a deadly threat to our unarmed hero. Knocking some one unconcious is unreliable as they can wake up, a dangerous thing at times such as these. Sure, with a blaster Luke could have taken them out just as quickly (let alone his lightsaber), but choking them was by far the most efficient way since he didn't want to have to fight at all if he didn't have to.

08-06-2006, 01:51 AM	#17
tolkienfan Elf Lord Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: The Internet Posts: 803	I never noticed that! I just watched that part looking for it specifically. I don't think he killed them. I think he just started to choke them so they would be scared and leave him alone. Maybe the mind trick wouldn't have worked as well because if he stopped concentrating or something they would have realized it was a trick and stopped him. Maybe he knocked them out or scared them. __________________ Don't be hasty! Thanks so much to Last Child of Ungoliant, Twista, and BeardofPants for my avatar!

08-07-2006, 12:27 PM	#19
XRogue Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2000 Location: D/FW Texas, USA Posts: 345	I watched ROTJ again a couple of days ago...yes, he just choked them a bit and they collapse and leave Luke alone. Suspect he just didn't want them tailing around after him. I also figure it was meant to subtly imply Luke was already having a little trouble with the Dark Side. Go figure, given whose kid he was, and the fact he had already run off from Dagobah and interrupted training to save his buds. Yes, I know he had a good intention, but then so did Vader, in some respects, and look where it got him. Yoda told Luke if he left then, he would become an agent of evil. __________________ Farewell wherever you fare, till your Eyries recieve you at the journey's end.

08-07-2006, 06:25 PM	#20
hectorberlioz Master of Orchestration President Emeritus of Entmoot 2004-2008 Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Lost in the Opera House Posts: 9,328	Good ideas here...just what I wanted. XRogue, excellent points about Luke's dark side potential, which had been on my mind. Also, Orchunter X has reminded us that Luke did not have his lightsaber (remember, Artoo shoots it out to him in the Barge scene). I don't think he would have used it though, since he was keen on noisemaking just then. Perhaps it was a combination of wanting to instil fear in Jabba's court and a tad of dark side-ness. __________________ ACALEWIA- President of Entmoot hectorberlioz- Vice President of Entmoot Acaly und Hektor fur Presidants fur EntMut fur life! Join the discussion at Entmoot Election 2010. "Stupidissimo!"~Toscanini The Da CINDY Code The Epic Poem Of The Balrog of Entmoot: Here ~NEW! ~ Thinking of summer vacation? AboutNewJersey.com - NJ Travel & Tourism Guide

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