Teen Abstinence

Sminty_Smeagol · 03-12-2004, 08:57 PM

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.j...toryID=4538056

http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/newssentinel/7172851.htm

Abstinence- what do you think?

**Nurvingiel** · 03-12-2004, 09:19 PM

I think abstinence is a good idea, if you're doing it for the right reasons, and truly feel it's the best thing for you. Having sex is also a good idea if it's the right thing for you to do, and you're doing it for the right reasons. (What those reasons are vary from person to person, but should involve intimacy with a comitted partner IMO.)

I personally am not planning on having sex anytime soon. When I'm ready and mature enough I will have sex. I will use protection, and make sure I'm healthy. I'm abstinent until I've paid attention to the necessary details, and am mentally and emotionally ready.

I haven't taken a written pledge, and see that as not being effective for most people, especially after having read the articles you linked to. Comitment doesn't come from a pledge; I think the people involved in the survey viewed the pledge almost like protection. (If I could spell "comittment" that would help.

) A pledge has to come from comittment.

BeardofPants · 03-13-2004, 02:16 AM

Abstinence is a GREAT idea if that's what you want. However, I feel that if you are practicing abstinence, then you should still educate yourself on having responsible sex, because studies have shown that the rate of STDs and pregnancies is pretty damned high among those who practice abstinence, i.e., some end up in trouble anyway because it backfired on them.

Arien the Maia · 03-13-2004, 03:09 AM

Hey! I'm from Fort Wayne! anywho, yeah I pledged to myself that I would wait till I got married....kinda failed at that

but it was only with my husband (it was the first for both of us so the whole STD thing was really of no concequence) and I wasn't a teen then anyways.

I agree that abstinence is the best way to go...unfortuantely it requires an AMAZING amount of control! (and I have NO patience!)(most people fail at it as far as I know

)

Starr Polish · 03-13-2004, 03:24 AM

I pledged abstinence, but I didn't make a signed comittment or anything like that. I just told myself that I would save myself for my husband...of course, there is a problem of leeway. What I consider sex others may not, and what others consider sex I may not (ie: The argument of "Is oral sex really 'sex'" and so on). I have a "chastity ring" that I now prefer to call my "virginity ring"...since I was not exactly CHASTE in my last relationship. We didn't have sex, but the physical relationship got a little too far, I believe.

I'm doing it mostly for religious reasons, but also the entire thought of how sex puts you in an extremely vulnerable position, emotionally and literally. I don't want to show that most secret side of myself to someone only to lose them. To me marriage is permanence. I put myself in emotionally vulnerable positions with my ex-boyfriend, and am now suffering the guilt and extra hurt from this during the breakup. I'll know better next time.

Arien the Maia · 03-13-2004, 03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Starr Polish
I'm doing it mostly for religious reasons, but also the entire thought of how sex puts you in an extremely vulnerable position, emotionally and literally. I don't want to show that most secret side of myself to someone only to lose them. To me marriage is permanence. I put myself in emotionally vulnerable positions with my ex-boyfriend, and am now suffering the guilt and extra hurt from this during the breakup. I'll know better next time.

I agree...if I'm correct, I think that when I woman has sex for the first time, there is some kind of hormone that she makes that makes her feel physically bounded to this person. (I heard that from one of my friends who is a psych major) Which, IMO, logically would mean that waiting for marriage (since it is supposed to be permanent) would be the best solution. I think this even goes so far as when people "mess around" too far.

***azalea*** · 03-13-2004, 03:21 PM

I think teenage abstinence is a good thing. Just because something isn't always successful doesn't mean it shouldn't be attempted (re: formal commitment to abstinence).
Also, some girls end up thinking that because they've gone so far (either "all the way" or not) with one guy means that they might as well go that far with the next guy. Like you said, Starr, that's what learning is all about, learning what you're willing to do in a relationship that doesn't have that permanent level of commitment. I like the way they put it -- "born-again virgin," which basically means that although they had sex, they realize that for them it was a mistake, and that they've decided to recommit to remaining chaste until they're married (or decide as an adult that they're ready to take that step in a relationship).
Although I did hear about a woman who had kids who was calling herself a born-again virgin, and I thought that was a little stupid.

I mean, at that age, you can just call yourself celibate or something.
Also, I think that if young adults decide to remain chaste, they should still have an open dialogue with their partner about sex, if the relationship looks like it's heading toward marriage. It's important that couples be able to be open with one another about EVERYTHING, and sexual compatibility is important in a marriage.

Janny · 03-13-2004, 04:43 PM

I agree with it wholeheartedly. I'm a Catholic (sorry) and intend to have sex with one person only.
However, I feel that the abstention should be only from sexual acts. I believe there is a clear distinction between the joining of two people in sexual intercourse and... um... kissing and fun and intimacies which stop short of sex.
My area has the highest teen pregnacy rate in Europe and I believe that well it really screws up the lives of some people.
Also how many times do you hear people say they regret losing their virginity.

I broke up with a relatively long term gf, and she now (lol, through no damn fault of mine!) has problems. Without going into what a b***h it transpired she was and how insecure she now is, had she lost her virginity doubt she would have ever have been able to wash herself clean.

**Nurvingiel** · 03-13-2004, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by azalea
I think teenage abstinence is a good thing. Just because something isn't always successful doesn't mean it shouldn't be attempted (re: formal commitment to abstinence).

I agree Azalea, anyone who feels it's the right thing to do should do it.

Don't apologize for being Catholic Janny, I know lots of lovely Catholic people - I hope to count you among them.

Janny · 03-13-2004, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel

Don't apologize for being Catholic Janny, I know lots of lovely Catholic people - I hope to count you among them.

Thanx for faith, Nurv! I've just learnt to pre-empt stuff and maintain a healthy religious self-deprication. Don't get me started on my 'not allowed to hold anything dear' spiel....

**Nurvingiel** · 03-13-2004, 05:35 PM

Okay, I won't.

(I actually don't know what that spiel might be about anyway so no worries. Maybe you should start a thread on it.

)

Starr Polish · 03-13-2004, 07:33 PM

I agree, Azalea. Just because one chooses to abstain from sex doesn't mean you can't talk about it with your romantic partner. In fact, you should talk about it, and set down boundaries in the relationship...not that they're always completely honored when things get a little "intense".

I agree with Janny as well. Kissing and hugging and being close aren't things I'm against doing in a relationship, but it gets harder to draw the line as you get more physically intimate.

And Arien, I've heard that, too, but I think it's also when she orgasms, so the whole bonding thing occuring without actually having sex is definitely possible.

**Nurvingiel** · 03-13-2004, 07:38 PM

This post rated PG-13.

I think you actually have to have penetration for it to be sex. That's how I think about it anyway. I don't personally count oral sex as sex, if you know what I mean. Not to say that people have to have oral sex in an intimite relationship, people should just go as far as they feel comfortable.

Sminty_Smeagol · 03-13-2004, 08:32 PM

Well I don't think oral sex would be chaste...

Starr Polish · 03-14-2004, 02:05 AM

I classify oral sex as sex...and to me it's just as if not MORE intimate than "intercourse". By my standards, I have not had sex...but I definitely went farther than I ever thought I would, and I'm feeling rather guilty about some things. But...the guilt will go away, and now I know better.

Janny · 03-14-2004, 07:34 AM

I work from the priciple that stuff with 'sex' in the title is sex. That's good for me.
But I think the reason it's hard is because of the constant selling of dreams through films, music etc. I'm not against this, as a songwriter I believe that it's an important elevation of the soul to be able to aspire to greater things (but ultimatly something in the human mind enjoys it being beyond them, to an extent).
This is why it's hard to draw the line. What's fantasy and reality kinda merge into one.

***azalea*** · 03-14-2004, 03:43 PM

This is getting explicit, so I'm going to spoiler it. Don't read it if you know you shouldn't.

If a person has had an orgasm through touching by someone else, it's sex.
If oral is given, it's sex even if there's no "o."
If manual stimulation of the genitals is given, but no o, it's heavy petting. Those are my arbitrary guidelines. Sex isn't just intercourse.
IMO, if your goal is chastity (and IMO, it should be, esp. if you're under 18), don't engage in any of them (with another person, that is.

).

Starr Polish · 03-14-2004, 06:34 PM

I'm going to spoiler my reply as well, because it's along the same lines of...explicit-ness.

To me that is kind of flawed logic...because, what if one party reached orgasm through manual stimulation, but the other didn't (assuming that it was occuring at the same time)? I don't think reaching orgasm should qualify something as "sex" or "not sex". Some people can reach orgasm without any kind of physical contact at all, and some women never, ever orgasm.

Insidious Rex · 03-14-2004, 08:17 PM

didnt we already have this argument a few months ago about the definition of sex? sex is intercourse. anything else is a sex ACT or sex PLAY. you cant lose your virginity giving a blow job. no matter how many times you do it. now that being said if you are trying to save yourself for marriage and you use the definition of sex as a kind of loop hole then yer basically being disingenuous because doing everything BUT penetration is not celibacy. theres plenty of whores (female and male) who have never had intercourse and are nice and smug because technically they feel they havent done anything wrong. so they get to have their cake and eat it to (um.. so to speak...). of course most of these people fail in their goal to avoid sex before marriage. usually long before.

**Nurvingiel** · 03-14-2004, 11:04 PM

Ah, but that depends what you are abstaining from before marriage. If you define sex as intercourse, and you do non-intercourse things before marriage, then you're not breaking any goal not to have sex before marriage. I'm not saying you can call yourself chaste and do that, just that you're still achieving your goal. After all, it is entirely personal.

03-12-2004, 08:57 PM	#1
Sminty_Smeagol Manic Cardboard-Box Dweller Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In a house Posts: 1,071	Teen Abstinence http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.j...toryID=4538056 http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/newssentinel/7172851.htm Abstinence- what do you think? __________________ I love the fishes.

03-13-2004, 02:16 AM	#3
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Abstinence is a GREAT idea if that's what you want. However, I feel that if you are practicing abstinence, then you should still educate yourself on having responsible sex, because studies have shown that the rate of STDs and pregnancies is pretty damned high among those who practice abstinence, i.e., some end up in trouble anyway because it backfired on them. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

03-13-2004, 03:24 AM	#5
Starr Polish Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill Posts: 2,389	I pledged abstinence, but I didn't make a signed comittment or anything like that. I just told myself that I would save myself for my husband...of course, there is a problem of leeway. What I consider sex others may not, and what others consider sex I may not (ie: The argument of "Is oral sex really 'sex'" and so on). I have a "chastity ring" that I now prefer to call my "virginity ring"...since I was not exactly CHASTE in my last relationship. We didn't have sex, but the physical relationship got a little too far, I believe. I'm doing it mostly for religious reasons, but also the entire thought of how sex puts you in an extremely vulnerable position, emotionally and literally. I don't want to show that most secret side of myself to someone only to lose them. To me marriage is permanence. I put myself in emotionally vulnerable positions with my ex-boyfriend, and am now suffering the guilt and extra hurt from this during the breakup. I'll know better next time. __________________ “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell

03-13-2004, 04:43 PM	#8
Janny The Blobbit Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Kent, England (Not Oxford! ... yet...) Posts: 1,596	I agree with it wholeheartedly. I'm a Catholic (sorry) and intend to have sex with one person only. However, I feel that the abstention should be only from sexual acts. I believe there is a clear distinction between the joining of two people in sexual intercourse and... um... kissing and fun and intimacies which stop short of sex. My area has the highest teen pregnacy rate in Europe and I believe that well it really screws up the lives of some people. Also how many times do you hear people say they regret losing their virginity. I broke up with a relatively long term gf, and she now (lol, through no damn fault of mine!) has problems. Without going into what a b***h it transpired she was and how insecure she now is, had she lost her virginity doubt she would have ever have been able to wash herself clean. __________________ Janny's Songs Janny's lyrics and random photographs Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who happen to be walking about. ~ Mercutio... erm, GK Chesterton.

03-13-2004, 07:33 PM	#12
Starr Polish Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill Posts: 2,389	I agree, Azalea. Just because one chooses to abstain from sex doesn't mean you can't talk about it with your romantic partner. In fact, you should talk about it, and set down boundaries in the relationship...not that they're always completely honored when things get a little "intense". I agree with Janny as well. Kissing and hugging and being close aren't things I'm against doing in a relationship, but it gets harder to draw the line as you get more physically intimate. And Arien, I've heard that, too, but I think it's also when she orgasms, so the whole bonding thing occuring without actually having sex is definitely possible. __________________ “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell

03-13-2004, 03:09 AM	#4
Arien the Maia Fëanáro's Fire Mistress Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Indiana, USA Posts: 1,423	Hey! I'm from Fort Wayne! anywho, yeah I pledged to myself that I would wait till I got married....kinda failed at that but it was only with my husband (it was the first for both of us so the whole STD thing was really of no concequence) and I wasn't a teen then anyways. I agree that abstinence is the best way to go...unfortuantely it requires an AMAZING amount of control! (and I have NO patience!)(most people fail at it as far as I know )

03-13-2004, 03:21 PM	#7
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	I think teenage abstinence is a good thing. Just because something isn't always successful doesn't mean it shouldn't be attempted (re: formal commitment to abstinence). Also, some girls end up thinking that because they've gone so far (either "all the way" or not) with one guy means that they might as well go that far with the next guy. Like you said, Starr, that's what learning is all about, learning what you're willing to do in a relationship that doesn't have that permanent level of commitment. I like the way they put it -- "born-again virgin," which basically means that although they had sex, they realize that for them it was a mistake, and that they've decided to recommit to remaining chaste until they're married (or decide as an adult that they're ready to take that step in a relationship). Although I did hear about a woman who had kids who was calling herself a born-again virgin, and I thought that was a little stupid. I mean, at that age, you can just call yourself celibate or something. Also, I think that if young adults decide to remain chaste, they should still have an open dialogue with their partner about sex, if the relationship looks like it's heading toward marriage. It's important that couples be able to be open with one another about EVERYTHING, and sexual compatibility is important in a marriage.

03-13-2004, 08:32 PM	#14
Sminty_Smeagol Manic Cardboard-Box Dweller Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In a house Posts: 1,071	Well I don't think oral sex would be chaste... __________________ I love the fishes.

03-14-2004, 02:05 AM	#15
Starr Polish Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill Posts: 2,389	I classify oral sex as sex...and to me it's just as if not MORE intimate than "intercourse". By my standards, I have not had sex...but I definitely went farther than I ever thought I would, and I'm feeling rather guilty about some things. But...the guilt will go away, and now I know better. __________________ “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell

03-14-2004, 07:34 AM	#16
Janny The Blobbit Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Kent, England (Not Oxford! ... yet...) Posts: 1,596	I work from the priciple that stuff with 'sex' in the title is sex. That's good for me. But I think the reason it's hard is because of the constant selling of dreams through films, music etc. I'm not against this, as a songwriter I believe that it's an important elevation of the soul to be able to aspire to greater things (but ultimatly something in the human mind enjoys it being beyond them, to an extent). This is why it's hard to draw the line. What's fantasy and reality kinda merge into one. __________________ Janny's Songs Janny's lyrics and random photographs Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who happen to be walking about. ~ Mercutio... erm, GK Chesterton.

03-14-2004, 08:17 PM	#19
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	didnt we already have this argument a few months ago about the definition of sex? sex is intercourse. anything else is a sex ACT or sex PLAY. you cant lose your virginity giving a blow job. no matter how many times you do it. now that being said if you are trying to save yourself for marriage and you use the definition of sex as a kind of loop hole then yer basically being disingenuous because doing everything BUT penetration is not celibacy. theres plenty of whores (female and male) who have never had intercourse and are nice and smug because technically they feel they havent done anything wrong. so they get to have their cake and eat it to (um.. so to speak...). of course most of these people fail in their goal to avoid sex before marriage. usually long before. __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Last edited by Insidious Rex : 03-14-2004 at 08:18 PM.

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