In Olmer's Honor: Take Tolkien at Face Value - or is there 'Something Else'

[Valandil]

Olmer, a new member here at Entmoot, has a different slant on Tolkien's work than most of us seem to. This has become apparent in his posts in the first two threads of the LOTR book discussion, and in the 'Why Merry and Pippin' thread. In the latter, we had the following dialogue:

First... when I figured out where he was coming from:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

by Valandil
Olmer, it's become quite apparent (from this thread and the chapter discussion threads underway) that you either have a different take on the story than most of us, or that you have a twisted sense of humor - and just enjoy stringing us along. Either one of those is OK... though you'll certainly find that many will disagree with you. I hope that will never make you feel unwelcome or that any will get overtly hostile in their frustration as they respond to you.

As I see it (assuming the former is true - a 'different take') - correct me if I'm wrong - your 'interpretation' or 'application' of the story is to not take what Tolkien writes at face value. Is that so? So that, for instance - even when he depicts Gandalf and the Elves as benevolent to all... you see them as more self-serving... and just making use of the other 'free peoples' to help them achieve their own ends? That the perceived benevolence was just because the source writings were of hobbit origin and that they 'bought into' what Gandalf and the Elves were selling?

I guess it can come off as a rather 'cynical' view, but it may indeed be an acceptable way to interpret the story. I rather doubt it was what Tolkien had in mind... but hey, to each his own, right? And - I guess the cynicism fits right into our world as it is today. Also - it helps fill in certain parts of the story - to see Gandalf and the Elves as a bit less noble than they might want to appear. Still, as I say, I disagree... but still welcome your opinions and insights - and look forward to further discussion on the various matters that will arise from our differing viewpoints.

So... welcome still, you-with-whom-many-of-us-disagree (there must be an Entish word for that)!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Then... his response:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

by Olmer
No, I'm quite serious.
Of course many will disagree with me and probably will label as "cynic", but I don't care as long as my opponents could express their point of view logically and with quotes to back up. I think this way allowed us to learn more about Tolkien work( not mention to make you read each sentence in the book more carefully and not just once. )
I began just like an ordinary Tolkien's fan (and I still am) till on one forum I read posting which was implying that, as you say, "Gandalf and the Elves as a bit less noble than they might want to appear". It was very logical and seemed to me undermined all my believes. It was so contradictory , so questionable that I wanted to find inconsistency in his postulates... I felt like an advocate who is trying to prove that his client was falsely accused.
Instead I found a new dimension of the book, a new meanings in the very sentences of Professor's work. A whole new world... in which previous J.R.R.T.contradictions seems not so adverse and loose pieces were falling in place.
And this is when I really got hooked on Tolkien .

You got me right to the tee. My point of view is as the whole story seen by dwarf or Gondorian.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So - I thought it would be nice to have this thread to discuss the whole THEORY involved, while we discuss the application, as appropriate to different parts of the story, in the various threads. This thread is intended to give us a basis of understanding of where Olmer - and others who may agree with him - are coming from when they make the statements they make.

Olmer... like to take it away and expound further?

OR

Anyone else... reactions to this way of viewing Tolkien?