Religon/Christinanity

No. They did not.

Hmmmm... proper spelling, capitalization, punctuation, etc... would probably have helped your point, quam. Aside from that...

About Genesis 1 and Genesis 2, it seems to me that on first glance, Genesis 1 is God telling things to happen, and Genesis 2 is the description of what happened - beyond "And it was so."

Also, Genesis 1 is explicitly linear, but Genesis 2 is not - it starts at the end - "Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array." Now, if you choose to come back and debate about "a lot of contradictions", I hope you aren't just going to quote the Skeptic's Annotated...

"'God' creating man 'in his image'"

Men are not simply flesh and bones as far as the Bible's concerned, and thus our flesh and our bones aren't the only thing that can be created "in the image of God".

"About creationists"... There was another thread on this subject. I believe it was "Creation Science" or something. Interesting reading... I was never fully involved in it, though.

"and falling for a trick of the Divine(as an evolutionist) would make you go to hell?"

This is referred to as "begging the question".

And, Gilthalion, I am of the opinion that everything in Scripture has to be interpreted in the light of Christ's death and resurrection - look at it all in terms of "The crucial (literally) issue".

I have constructed a message board for the use of debates upon Religion. It is at pub26.ezboard.com/bmithlond

with all this talk about beign created in God's image, i'm reminded of the Ainulindale - where the Valar could choose whatever outward form they took but underneath it they were still Valar -

i believe that humans (& all creatures) have the influence/spirit of the gods within them. this makes us all children of God, literally. i also believe that it doesn't matter all that much which gods you worship or which religion's name you use - as long as you live a good life & don't disrupt the Balance (basically, don't destroy & live in harmony with your surroundings) then you'll be OK metaphysically. faith & beliefs are very personal things, & what's right for me at this point in my life will not be right for everyone. a lot of people in this thread seem to have found what's right for them, and congradulations if your'e one of those people.

on reincarnation - if you look at christianity a certain way, they too believe in a reincarnation: we all die, but after the final judgement (assuming we all behave) we'll be resurrected & live in bliss for eternity. after death, we regain bodies & live again. that too is a reincarnation, just one that's not usually thought of as such.

Elanor & Tater -
thanks for those descriptions - Greek Orthodox & Mormonism were 2 groups that i'd heard of but never knew much about.

You're posting like demons! Well, I don't have the time to read that stuff now... next time: this evening at about 10h30PM

Mwahahahahahahaha!

...another demonic post!

"if you look at christianity a certain way, they too believe in a reincarnation"

Not quite.

The important thing to note is that according to all but the most idiotic interpretations of Scripture, there is only ONE resurrection, into a significantly different universe.

Read Hebrews 9:27 if you don't believe me.

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but the idea of multiple reincarnations, or being resurrected into a still-fallen earth as another person, is simply not compatible with any basic form of Christianity.

Damn, Johnny, you're not really comprehensive. The man's native language is not english, and that is obvious (Asking what's the word in english is obviously a sign of english being a second language), and still, he makes effort to communicate with you in YOUR native language. And the first thing you say is a reformulation of "You should be better in english". I don't see YOU trying to speak french, norvegian, espagnol or whatever with us...

So stop coming back with spelling, we try our best, and sorry if it's not up to Mister Johnny's standards.

"comprehensive" can be translated into French as "compréhensif", which has two meanings. One is to "cover all the bases" - to deal with everything. Another one, if I'm not mistaken, is to be "sympathetic, understanding", or something to that effect.

However, in English, "comprehensive" only has the first meaning, not the second.

So, no, I'm not sympathetic. I am, however, comprehensive.

...forgive us our typos and poor grammar
as we forgive those whose letters we read.

Lead us not into flaming,
and deliver us from grammarians... :lol:


Just kidding, but seriously, let's be slow to take offense and slow to criticize...

I would rather look for each letter as an opportunity to interact, rather than to instruct.

"The important thing to note is that according to all but the most idiotic interpretations of Scripture, there is only ONE resurrection, into a significantly different universe. I'm sorry to disappoint you, but the idea of multiple reincarnations, or being resurrected into a still-fallen earth as another person, is simply not compatible with any basic form of Christianity"

i can't argue this without offending someone, so i'm going to drop it.

aryne *

Oh, and go ahead and talk about how I like to nitpick, how I'm an evil troll, etc., etc... but...

Feel free to edit your post to add the italics in EzCode, rather than in HTML, which isn't supported here.

it wouldn't be about how YOU'RE an evil troll...

& thanks for reminding me about EZcode - i keep forgetting. converted too many pages to HTML lately...

aryne *

Oh, I don't think anyone here is an evil troll!

But I'm pretty sure no one here is a reincarnated evil troll! :lol:

When I first came over here from IronParrot's board (shameless plug), I was so used to using HTML, I must have had at least fifteen posts where I either used HTML tags by accident, or forgot to click on EzCodes.

Ah, well...

(Edit: ARGH! IT HAPPENED AGAIN!)

Je suis vraiment tanné de me faire remarquer toutes mes petites erreurs par Johnny, j'ai donc décidé de poster dans ma langue maternelle. Je pense que finalement, comme on a dit un peu plus haut, c'est pas vraiment important en quoi tu crois (où en qui). Que quelqu'un l'appelle Le Créateur, Dieu, Allah, Yahve, Buddha, Krishna ou whatever... Qu'on croit au paradis et Ã* l'enfer, ou bien seulement Ã* la réincarnation. L'important c'est d'avoir un code de valeurs et de toujours s'efforcer de faire le bien dans toutes les situations. Si Ã* la fin de notre vie on peut dire qu'on a mené une bonne vie, je pense que peut importe nos croyances, on va être admis au paradis.

Ça me rappelle un de mes professeurs qui nous disait: "L'enfer et le paradis, c'est exactement la même chose... C'est le même endroit. La différence c'est que l'enfer, c'est de vivre au paradis et de savoir qu'on ne mérite pas tout ça. C'est Ã* dire, de vivre toute l'éternité avec un sentiment de culpabilité pour toutes les mauvaises actions commises."

Pis du côté des valeurs, je pense qu'une valeur en perdition est très certainement celle d'aider son prochain. Je veux parler du bénévolat entre autres. Maintenant plus personne n'est intéressé Ã* aider son prochain! Je prend mon exemple: Je suis un jeune de 20 ans, avec plusieurs occupation: je vais Ã* l'université Ã* plein temps, je suis éditeur en chef du journal étudiant de mon programme, j'ai une blonde, plusieurs amis que j'essaie de voir régulièrement, et en plus de tout ça je trouve le temps d'animer aux scouts. Je N'ai PAS d'enfants, mais j'anime ceux des autres. Des jeunes dont les parents ne s'impliquent pas plus qu'en aller porter leur enfants aux réunions. Et n'allez surtout pas leur demander de vous aider Ã* monter un projet pour LEURS jeunes... ça ne les intéresse pas...

Je trouve que ça s'approche beaucoup du genre d'attitude que Johnnyadopte... Détruire ce que les autres créent au lieux de créer soit-même...ça m'écoeure.

That's all for now. If you want a translation, ask me, I'll email it to you (Or give it with ICQ). Johnny, you can always try the alta vista translator or be kind with Eruve or Juntel.

EDIT: Corrected the bold

Si Ã* la fin de notre vie on peut dire qu'on a mené une bonne vie, je pense que peut importe nos croyances, on va être admis au paradis.

This is one of the areas that Jesus has changed! Upon learning the Gospel, and largely in response to the prayers of the saints, a person who has been living by the light of such Truth as they knew, if seeking to know God better, will eventually have their own encounter with Christ!

The other side of this is that this encounter means a choice, like Frodo's on Amon Hen, to go with the Eye or with the Voice! Neutrality will, at that time no longer be an option!

We hold that, and I think I am right in saying especially after being presented with the Choice, while even a wicked man may be good to his own children, no one is good enough to earn heaven. Eternal life is a gift granted by the grace of God and purchased by the sacrifice of his Son.

There is disagreement about how those who have not met Jesus through the Gospel are judged. I do not recall the pertaining Scripture (ahh, shame!), but I believe that folks who seek God, find Him, and if they hear the Gospel, and seek, they will find Him in a very transcendent way indeed! If they have NOT been introduced to Christ through the Gospel, then God judges them I think much in the way that Shanamir describes, and folk are known to Him to be seekers of Truth and lovers of Righteousness will be granted Grace.

This would mean that the folk most in danger of an Eternity separated from God, are the hard-hearted folk in the pews every Sunday, who have heard "the still small voice," and have yet closed their hearts, and who only play a selfish hypocritical game!

Don't get me started on THEM!

"Johnny, you can always try the alta vista translator or be kind with Eruve or Juntel."

Be kind with THEM? You gotta be kidding!

Actually, being nice to them is fine. However, I do not require their translation services.

And I also will not reply in French.

"Je suis vraiment tanné de me faire remarquer toutes mes petites erreurs par Johnny"... "tanné"... hmmm... *pulls out his Bescherelle*

Well, you just taught me a new word, and so I'll reciprocate.

HYPERBOLE.

It pisses me off. In words you can understand, "Il me fâche."

"Si Ã* la fin de notre vie on peut dire qu'on a mené une bonne vie, je pense que peut importe nos croyances, on va être admis au paradis."

Sounds great... where do I sign up? If that was an option, I'd sure take it... it beats the heck out of having my Christ flogged, beaten, speared, and crucified.

Why don't I ever get to take the easy way?

"L'enfer et le paradis, c'est exactement la même chose..."

Again, I'll say... where do I sign up?

One more bit of French for you, Duntak (it's the same as calling me Johnny).

"Ta mere était un hampster, et ton pere puait des baies de sureau."

Hyperbole is not a new word for me. Maybe it is for you, but I've known this word for years.

Secundo...

"Ta mere était un hampster, et ton pere puait des baies de sureau"

What the..? I guess it was a joke since it's not really an "insult". At least, I'm sure that if I'd say that to anybody, he'd laugh for about half an hour.

And if you wanted to translate "It pisses me off", you should have write "Ça me fâche" or "Ça me fait chier"

Finally, Sign up where you want, it won't change a thing cause I think your one of THEM...

*Shan tired of thread, walks away from it.*

"I guess it was a joke since it's not really an "insult"."

Actually, it was a (rather rough) translation of a remark made by a (French) character in a Monty Python movie.

"Your mother was a hampster and your father smelled (smelt?) of elderberries" was the original text.

"you should have write "Ça me fâche""

Incorrect. That would translate as "That angers me.", not "It angers me."