How were Gandalf and Frodo going to enter Mordor?

good question.....I don't get it?

Explanation, anyone?

Elenna ~

~Forgive the meek, find peace with those who ask too many questions, for only knowledge can destroy evil. ~

Well.. definetly NOT in the good thread....

The Balrog is clearly stronger than Shelob.

Did someone hit the "New Topic" button instead of the "Add Reply" button??

maybe... that would make more sence......maybe...

Elenna ~ lady of the Stars

Do any of the other admin. know how to put topics inside another one? This obviously wasn't meant to stand on it's own.

Flame of Anor (or Anar) were his words. I don't think anyone has any clear idea what exactly he meant, but 'anor' was a name for the Sun. Definitely not anything having to do with Narya. I think it has some connexion with Arien, the Sun-maiden. The Silmarillion says she was of old one of the spirits of fire whom Melkor had not corrupted to his service. This seems to me to imply she is what the other Valaraucar would have been, had they never gone over to Melkor. It may be that Arien was a Maia of Varda (as Gandalf was), and so Gandalf's power of fire was unsullied and in opposition to that of the Balrog.

In December of last year I said to Michael Martinez:

There is a part of the Silmarillion that indicates Arien is what Balrogs would have been had they never fallen to Melkor in the beginning. Is this passage to be trusted?

He answered:

I think so, but everything in Tolkien can be questioned for one reason or another. I think Tolkien was playing with the Greek idea of primal elements at one point: fire, water, air, earth, and void. Melkor would have been the fire deity, as Manwe was for air, Ulmo was for water, and Aule was for earth. The void would have been their
origin. But if that was ever what he had in mind, he dropped it quick.

I definitely feel the Balrog of Moria and Gandalf The Grey were peers in power, they both died in their battle. If he hadn't fallen? He didn't fall out of exhaustion, the Balrog brought him down with his whip. Even if he hadn't, I would sooner call it a narrow escape than proof he was the better of the two.

I might say again here that there is no indication I know of (as always I could be wrong) that the Ring of Fire had anything to do with actual, elemental fire.

My memory's a bit hazy, I think I decided it's possible, but not for certain. Even so I don't understand how Narya is supposed to come into play with a battle between Gandalf and Shelob (which quite probably would have never happened).

Concerning Arien.

She was to the best of my memory, A tender in the gardens of Yavanna. The tree of light, The Laurelin, I believe is what she tended, because she was not fearful of the fire and it did not harm her. So, when the Vala put the sun in the sky they chose Arien to guide the sun. Tilion is the mia chosen to guide the moon. This part of the Sil. captivated me! I loved it, soo cool.

Yes, I do believe that Anor is mentioned in reference to the sun. I would feel free to say I agree with you.

Elenna ~ Lady of the Stars

Maybe..... Arien is Gandalf's (Olorin's) sweetheart? His "old flame"?




Gandalf: "I wield my girlfriend's flame...."

I don't recall that! Are you serious?

Either way, Funny :lol:

Gandalf's old flame : Arien

Elenna ~ Lady of the Stars

Hello. Im new to this place. This is a test post.

Elenna, small niggle, she tended the golden flowers in Vána's garden.

lol easterlinge!

Welcome Imrahil! Post looks okay ( ), hope you stay and enjoy the Moot.

Oopps, Vana's, Yavanna'a ? ::shrug:: 8o

So many names, as I have said before, It can be difficult to keep track of them all. I am still in my first year of Tolkien as wel, so maybe time will help.

;0 ~ Thanks for the niggle

Welcome Imrahil! Are you really a prince?!

Elenna ~ Lady of the Stars

I have returned!

Were you lost in Mordor or perhaps the Old forest then...?


WB ~ I think?

Elenna ~ Lady of the Stars

No, I don't think you were here when I used to be here. I used to be called Mandos, but I forgot my password. (Sigh)

Ah, so sad. Back to a sapling then..rh? Sorry.

Yes, I am new here. But I really like it here. Lots of fun things to talk about and lots to learn.

Elenna ~ Lady of the Stars

How then has the message from the mighty Melko becom diluted, here we are the creatures of the night, the true inheritors, skulking around the boards with names such as, Barrow Downs The prancing Pony!!!!! Death to the enemies of the darkness, visit them with Havoc and Fire, or number yourselves among the elves and Men The thieves of the world and stealers of our gift.

"Best wishes from Minas Morgul. THE only place to Holiday.."

How disturbing.

(inoldonil, it can't be done)

Thanks for letting me know