High Kings of the Noldor

[Rían]

I really like the Sil, and was just thinking the other day when I came across the phrase "High King of the Noldor" - which of Finwe's sons and grandsons and great-grandsons were actually High King? This is what I came up with - anyone who knows better, please correct me! Thanks!

Finwë, then (moving to next generation) Fingolfin, then Fingon, then Turgon, then (moving to Finarfin's line, and down 2 generations) Gil-Galad. (I think Fëanor was never High King).

(note - I'm working with the Gil-Galad, son of Orodreth, son of Angrod, son of Finarfin theory, the latest-known Tolkien geneology, which is not quite what Christopher has in the Sil, but which he later said was correct, if I remember correctly.)

[Gilrond]

Yeah, I think that's right.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Finwe was the first and then Feanor. Feanor's rein was short lived because it was at the time of the Exile, and then he was killed shortly after his arrival to Beleriand. Maedhros at that point turned the High Kingship over to Fingolfin. Upon Fingolfin's death the High Kingship came to Fingon who died in the Nirneath. Then it went to Turgon. Had Finrod lived, he would have been next and then his brothers had they lived. Orodreth would have been after that, but did not survive the Battle of Tumladen. Next was his son Gil-galad, who was the last High King of the Noldor.

[Rían]

But was Feanor ever acknowledged High King? When they were setting out,

"by no means all were of a mind to take Feanor as King. Greater love was given to Fingolfin and his sons, and his household and the most part of the dwellers in Tirion refused to renounce him if he would go with them".

(Fingolfin was "acting king" of the Noldor in Tirion while Feanor was exiled, and Finwe joined Feanor in exile.)

So I don't know about Feanor ... but Fingolfin, Fingon and Gil-Galad definitely were High Kings of the Noldor. Turgon I think would be considered a High King, too, although it just says "Turgon of the mighty house of Fingolfin was now by right King of all the Noldor".

BTW, I like that part where Maedros "waived his claim to kingship over all the Noldor", because of Fingon's amazing act of saving him. It seems like finally one of Feanor's sons was a little humble!

[Tar-Elenion]

Technically Finwe was not High King of the Noldor. He was just Noldoran, King of the Noldor.
After the death of Finwe both Feanor and Fingolfin claimed the Kingship. The dispute was not resolved until after Feanor's death when Fingolfin became the ruler.

[Dain]

This information was taken from The Encyclopedia of Arda, hope it helps

Dates: Pre-First Age to II 3441
Race: Elves
Division: Noldor


The title of six Elf-lords of the Noldor. They held titular rulership over all the Noldor of Middle-earth, though in practice circumstances prevented the effective use of this power until the time of the Last Alliance. The Sons of Fëanor, in particular, while they acknowledged the Kingship, paid its bearer little heed; they preferred to follow their own policies under the general leadership of Maedhros.

I Finwë (ruled c.9,000 years before the beginning of the First Age)
The first lord of the Noldor awoke at Cuiviénen and led his people into the West to dwell in Valinor. He was slain by Morgoth at Formenos, and succeeded by his eldest son.

II Fëanor (ruled briefly during I 1)
He led the host of the Noldor back to Middle-earth1 to avenge his father's death and recover the Silmarils from Morgoth. He was slain in his assault on Angband. After his death, the Kingship by right belonged to his eldest son Maedhros, but he refused it and the succession passed instead to Fëanor's half-brother2.

III Fingolfin (ruled 454 years to I 455)
He dwelt to the northwest of Beleriand with his sons, and ruled the Noldor during the Siege of Angband. When Morgoth broke the leaguer in the Dagor Bragollach, he rode in anger to the gates of Angband and died in single combat with Morgoth. He was succeeded by his eldest son.

IV Fingon (ruled 16 years to I 471)
His short reign was one of endless war with the forces of Morgoth. With Maedhros, he prepared a final assault on Morgoth, the Nirnaeth Arnoediad, which ended in disaster for the Noldor and Fingon's own death. He was succeeded by his brother3.

V Turgon (ruled 39 years to I 510)
Turgon's kingship was titular indeed, for even his own kin did not know the location of his Hidden City of Gondolin. Gondolin's location was discovered by Morgoth through the treachery of Maeglin, and Turgon died in its Fall. After his death, the Kingship passed back to Fingon's line, to his only son.

VI Ereinion Gil-galad (ruled 3,514 years to II 3441)
The last High King, Gil-galad held the Kingship longer than any of his forebears since Finwë. He formed the Last Alliance with Elendil, and died during the Siege of Barad-dûr at the end of the Second Age.


Gil-galad was the last High King; after his time the title is never used. In order of succession, the Kingship would presumably have fallen on Turgon's descendants; Eärendil (who was in the West and could not exercise it) or his eldest son Elrond (who never made claim to the Kingship).

Notes
1 The succession of Fëanor was not acknowledged by all the Noldor; many took Fingolfin as their lord immediately after the loss of Finwë. Nonetheless, as natural heir to Finwë and lord of a part of the Noldor, Fëanor is included in this list.
2 Some few of the Noldor remained in Valinor when Fëanor returned to Middle-earth; they took Fingolfin's brother Finarfin as their King.
3 It is nowhere explained why the succession should have fallen on Turgon at this point, rather than passing directly to Fingon's son Gil-galad.

[The Lady of Ithilien]

Maybe Elrond didn't claim the kingship, though there were still Noldor in Middle-Earth and he had been Gil-Galad's squire and had been given Gil-Galad's ring of power, because his descent was partly mortal. And Gil-Galad's only other relative, though more distant, Galadriel, was married to a Sindarin Elf.

[markedel]

And most of all there was simply no nolodorin kingdom left just a mixed remnant in Lindon and Rivendell.

[Ñólendil]

The Encyclopedia of Arda would seem to be listing Kings, not High-Kings, and I don't like their version of Gil-galad's genealogy (which is what it is of course because they don't have all the sources). The High-Kings were Fingolfin, Fingon, Turgon and Gil-galad. In other words: RÃ*an's list with Tar-Elenion's correction.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Tar-Elenion
Technically Finwe was not High King of the Noldor. He was just Noldoran, King of the Noldor.

OK, I agree with that - the "Index of Names" in the Sil just calls him "King of the Noldor in Aman", and I don't see him called High King anywhere in the texts that I have. So far, it looks like no other Tolkien writings call him High King.

After the death of Finwe both Feanor and Fingolfin claimed the Kingship. The dispute was not resolved until after Feanor's death when Fingolfin became the ruler.

Poor Feanor! What a sad end to such a great potential. However, his death certainly resolved the dispute! And Fingolfin is referred to as "High King of the Noldor in Beleriand" in the index, so he's certainly one. Same for Fingon, also referred to as HKotN in the index, and same for Gil-Galad.

Turgon is not referred to as HKotN in the index, yet in the "Of the Fifth Battle" chapter, he is called "King of all the Noldor", so I would probably say that is the same as High King. Any other references around call him High King?

And Feanor - rather unclear, but not referred to as HKotN anywhere, so I think probably not - it was just in dispute, then he died, as Tar-Elenion said.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Dain
This information was taken from The Encyclopedia of Arda, hope it helps

Thanks, Dain, for including that. It was a nice summary, and the dates helped - I'm terrible with dates.

However, it looks like they were not familiar with the great "parentage of Gil-Galad" controversy.

Note 3 -It is nowhere explained why the succession should have fallen on Turgon at this point, rather than passing directly to Fingon's son Gil-galad.

Michael Martinez has a good discussion on this in the first part of the article here: http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/tolkien/44954 .
It seems Tolkien's final word was what I said in my first post at the bottom, which also explains why the kingship went the way it did and removes the problem in Note 3. This is also mentioned in Unfinished Tales and Morgoth's Ring, if you have those (let me know if you would like chapter #'s to look it up, if you have those books )

This whole thread started when I reread the thrilling and tragic account of Fingolfin's fight with Morgoth before the gates of Angband, and Tolkien's beautifully written sentences:

"Thus died Fingolfin, High King of the Noldor, most proud and valiant of the Elven-kings of old. The Orcs made no boast of that duel at the gate; neither do the Elves sing of it, for their sorrow is too deep."

It just kind of made me wonder which ones were accounted High Kings, and the exact order of the High Kings, etc. Thanks everyone for their help. Any more comments, questions, corrections, etc.? Anyone else especially like those 2 sentences?

[Sister Golden Hair]

What is the difference between "King of all the Noldor, " and "High King of the Noldor."?

Also, after the Exile, Finarfin was given the kingship in Aman over the Noldor. What do you think happens to that when the others come back from Mandos that would have been kings had they not left Valinor? Does Finarfin remain king over the Noldor in Valinor? Even though Ingwe is King of all Elves.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
What is the difference between "King of all the Noldor, " and "High King of the Noldor."?

I don't know ...... probably no difference! It's just that those two sentences that I quoted earlier about the death of Fingolfin had triggered the thought "now where else had I seen the phrase 'High Kings' mentioned?" (and there's something just more noble-sounding to 'High King' than 'King') and I just decided to try and track the whole 'High King' thing.

Also, after the Exile, Finarfin was given the kingship in Aman over the Noldor. What do you think happens to that when the others come back from Mandos that would have been kings had they not left Valinor? Does Finarfin remain king over the Noldor in Valinor? Even though Ingwe is King of all Elves.

I don't know - very interesting thought! Good thing that they all conveniently died (although some met up back in Aman) (Where was that quote - something about Fingolfin walking with his father Finwe?) And I totally forgot about poor Ingwe (missed all the action). But what a cool guy.

[Sister Golden Hair]

(Where was that quote - something about Fingolfin walking with his father Finwe?) And I totally forgot about poor Ingwe (missed all the action). But what a cool guy.

I think you are thinking of Finrod walking with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.

[Finrod Felagund]

The whole thing about Galadriel has been discussed before.
She probably could have taken the kingship but chose not to. She was Finwe's grandaughter.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
I think you are thinking of Finrod walking with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.

whoops! off by one generation and one son thanks for the correction.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
whoops! off by one generation and one son thanks for the correction.

Sure thing.

[Curufinwe]

Technically speaking wouldn't Finarfin be the "High King" of the Nolder after the passing of his brother Fingolfin?

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by Curufinwe
Technically speaking wouldn't Finarfin be the "High King" of the Nolder after the passing of his brother Fingolfin?

That would have been the case but for Finarfin not going into exile. Although he started to, he chose to turn back and return to Aman, and there he was given the rule of the remaining Noldor.

[Ñólendil]

What is the difference between "King of all the Noldor, " and "High King of the Noldor."?

Ideally, the High King holds authority over all other Kings. Say there is at one time four Ñoldorin Kings of Beleriand, only one would be High King. Of course, in their situation, mostly each King kept to himself at his own Realm.

There were in all recorded history only ten Ñoldorin Kings (those marked with *s were High-kings):
1. Finwë
2. Curufinwë Fëanáro ("Fëanor")
3. *Nolofinwë Aracano ("Fingolfin")
4. Arafinwë Ingoldo ("Finarfin")
5. *Findecáno ("Fingon")
6. Nelyafinwë Maitimo Russandol ("Maedhros")
7. Findaráto Ingoldo ("Finrod")
8. *Turucáno ("Turgon")
9. Artaher ("Orodreth") and
10. *Rodnor Gil-galad Ereinion

You, SGH, and others here, know that several of these persons were Kings at the same time. Yet only one could ever be High-king.

Finwe was not a High-king. There was no need of a High-king in his time, for he was the only one.

After the death of Finwë Ñoldoran ("King of the Ñoldor"), the Kingship was in dispute. Following the Rebellion of the Ñoldor, there were two Kings among the Exiles: Fingolfin and Feanor. Feanor claimed the Kingship as eldest of the children of Finwe. According to the earlier version that appears in the Silmarillion, Fingolfin accepted this, but many were not willing to follow Feanor anyway. According to the later version, which so far as I know appears only in "The Shibboleth of Feanor", Fingolfin disputed this claim, recalling the judgement of the Valar that he be banished from Tirion and Fingolfin take up rule, because Feanor had drawn sword on his half-brother and caused strife. Feanor pointed out to his half-brother ("with some justice" according to Tolkien) that it was a bit absurd to accept this Valarin judgement, yet defy them completely and march into Exile.

Finarfin also was a King. He returned to Tirion and ruled there, and in one passage in the Silmarillion he is indeed named "king". Finarfin of all the Kings I deem the luckiest and with the fate most kindly. He is at any rate the only one who never died.

After Feanor was slain by Balrogs and the rescue of Maedhros by Fingon, the Kingship passed to Fingolfin, or at any rate, the High Kingship was begun. Fingolfin was King of Hithlum and High King of the Exiled Ñoldor, but there were other Kings. Maedhros was King of his own land about the Hill of Himring and I believe by this time Turgon also called himself a King at Vinyamar ("Newhome"), and anyway he would certainly be King in Gondolin, and Finrod became King of Nargothrond. After Fingolfin was crushed by the foot of Morgoth and split in half, the High-kingship passed to his eldest son Fingon, who presided in Hithlum like his father.

Fingon thus theoretically ruled over all the other Ñoldor, including his younger brother Turgon of Gondolin, Maedhros of the March of Maedhros, and Finrod of Nargothrond.

After Gothmog cleaved Fingon's head in two with an axe, the Hidden King Turgon was accounted High-king of the Ñoldor (as is said by Tuor's foster-father in Unfinished Tales {and of course also in The Silmarillion}). By this time Finrod had been slain by a Werewolf and his steward and nephew Arothir (better known as Orodreth) claimed the Kingship of Nargothrond. So the "under-kings" of Turgon were now Arothir and Maedhros.

Well, our list getting shorter, Arothir decided to be et by Glaurung the Dragon and Turgon reportedly died when his tower fell to the ground in The Fall of Gondolin. That left Maedhros, and he didn't bother to call himself High-king, as he was the only one.

But, of course, young Gil-galad, son of Arothir, escaped the Sack of Nargothrond and met with the other Elves defeated by Morgoth at the Havens by the Sea. Eventually he became King, and he was taken as High-king, rather than Maedhros. Then the Third-Kinslaying happened, and the sailing of Eärendil to Valinor, and the War of Wrath, and eventually our King Maedhros, bereaved of any people to govern, recovered a Silmaril before casting himself into a fiery chasm of the earth.

That leaves our Gil-galad, the Last High-elven King east of the Sea (who in the Second Age was burned and slain by Sauron on the slopes of Mount Doom).

So of the ten Kings of the Ñoldor, only Fingolfin, Fingon, Turgon and Gil-galad were hailed as High-kings.

Another example of a High-king in Beleriand was your pal, Elu Thingol. He claimed to be High King of Beleriand, even over those Elves and Elven-kings not of the Sindar. Yet Finrod, Thingol's grand-nephew, was the only Ñoldorin King who heeded this.