Who do you think should be elected in 2008?

[faerie_child]

I'm just looking for some informed opinions here. I admit I don't know a whole lot about the Republican candidates for 2008.
Right now, I like Hilary Clinton. She knows what she's doing, she's got the experience and the know-how. Not to mention I think she's the only one who has a decent and resolute plan for Iraq.
I'd like to hear some other opinions.

[hectorberlioz]

Maybe I should do one of my unbiased series of (you heard right, BJ!) profiles of these guys (Giuliani, Biden, Richardson, McCain) and gals (Hillary, Edwards)...

[Lief Erikson]

It's good to meet you, faerie child . Never encountered your posts before, and it's good to meet you.

My preferred candidate is Mccain. Fred Thomson and Mitt Romney also look good to me, but from my perspective, Mccain is the best. He's clearly brave and determined to do what he sees as right for the nation. I say this partly because of his stance on the immigration issue, which he knew was unpopular. He chose that stance because he believed it was right even though it lost him votes. He also was a very brave hero in the Vietnam War, one who was tortured by the North Vietnamese. He has been a maverick in the Republican Party, partly over the interrogations bill, among other things, which demonstrates again his willingness to stand up for what he believes is right in the face of politics. Unfortunately, this courage to stand up for what he believes in makes him less likely to come out winner in this race .

I also support most of his positions on the relevant issues.

I think I understand what you mean about Hillary Clinton though, Faerie. She has more of my respect at present than any other Democrat candidate.

[brownjenkins]

I'd be happy with Mccain or Guliani on the Republican side, or Hillary or Obama on the Democratic side. Any of the four would be a good change of pace and seem a lot more pragmatic than we've had in a while, which I think is needed these days.

Romney is the only one I don't particularly like. He was governor of my state for a while and always seemed a lot more concerned with his image than taking any real stances on anything. I don't think he has a strong enough character to do the office justice.

Thompson might be okay, but he hits me as a bit too much pro-corporation when you look at his record. With all the trouble we've had in that area from the savings and loan crisis to the current mortgage company problems, I think we need someone who isn't too big on corporate deregulation.

[inked]

Oh, ho, BJ! All is NOT relative, after all.

Have you heard the one about Chelsea Clinton asking the soldier returning from Iraq if he had been frightened during his tour?

"Not as frightened as I am on returning to the USA," he replied.

"What are you afraid of at home?" she inquired.

He replied, "Osama, Obama, and your mama!"

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by inked

Oh, ho, BJ! All is NOT relative, after all.

Have you heard the one about Chelsea Clinton asking the soldier returning from Iraq if he had been frightened during his tour?

"Not as frightened as I am on returning to the USA," he replied.

"What are you afraid of at home?" she inquired.

He replied, "Osama, Obama, and your mama!"

Bwahahahaha!!!!! Oh, that is good!

[Curubethion]

Has anyone around here heard of this dude named Ron Paul?

[The Telcontarion]

Originally Posted by Curubethion

Has anyone around here heard of this dude named Ron Paul?

Hahahaaa!!!!

Why yes actually, the Tar Palantir of our time. If he doesn't win...it's over.

[hectorberlioz]

Watched the GOP New Hampshire Debates. Most of the candidates did themselves good, except McCain and Huckabee, IMO.

Thompson got into "I know this stuff too" mode, and it was refreshing.

Ron Paul got his message out better than usual, and on some points I really agreed with him.

Giuliani could have done better, and some of his answers seemed incomplete, but on the whole he did alright in reminding people that he still exists as a serious candidate.

Romney was really the best guy, on the whole, from a debating standpoint. He got blasted by everyone (except Paul), deflected the barbs and explained his positions while sticking to his message. A few fumbles---perhaps he could have left out one complaint about "the barbs", which would have made McCain look even worse--as well as the schmoozy "America is a great nation" schtick.

Huckabee did alright, he spoke well, but lacked his own specificity on some issues, and he seemed to borrow from McCain a lot, in addition to looking like McCain's pup.

McCain was snide, bitter, and mind-numbingly self-righteous. I do not want to vote for McCain. Lord help us.

[hectorberlioz]

Watching the Democratic New Hampshire Debate...

Two observations:

1) I'm very surprised (and a little relieved) by the very Bush-Doctrinesque postions on Foreign Policy that Obama and Clinton, Edwards and Richardson are now taking, with a few exceptions.

2) Bill Richardson said he would ask the Soviet Union to---well, I might as well not continue tell you, because the main point is that he called Russian the Soviet Union! Even Democrats are freaked out by Russia...this Freudian slip is forgivable for any politician because Russia is very much exuding the aura of the SU.


Performances so far:

Obama is doing very good with being more specific, but he is stumbling a little under Hillary's Iron Gaze.

Hillary is doing very well, projecting far better than usual. Good in highlighting differences with Obama.

Edwards is doing OK. He was doing the "I can protect America too" stuff, but then he sorta reversed his eloquence with the "but let's not be George Bush while doing the same thing he did" nonsense.

Richardson is...clearly not taking the pragmatic position with regard to his "diplomacy". It seems like even the other three Democrats answered the question of Pakistan while putting the "of course diplomacy first" behind them. Richardson seems to be pandering to the "Disaster at any cost/Diplomacy only" crowd. Or he just didn't formulate a comprehensible position to go from.

Second Part of Performances

A funky question about Hillary's "like-ability" leads to a weird flirty Hillary mood, and then springs her inner Feminist by saying that a "woman is a big change".

Obama gets better at being specific.

Richardson makes a good case with his FP experience/executive experience.

You know, one thing about Edwards, he's way more radical than Kerry, and he's better with his message.

UPDATE: WOW! Edwards go right-from-the-heart style...

[GrayMouser]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

Watched the GOP New Hampshire Debates. Most of the candidates did themselves good, except McCain and Huckabee, IMO.

Thompson got into "I know this stuff too" mode, and it was refreshing.

Ron Paul got his message out better than usual, and on some points I really agreed with him.

Giuliani could have done better, and some of his answers seemed incomplete, but on the whole he did alright in reminding people that he still exists as a serious candidate.

Romney was really the best guy, on the whole, from a debating standpoint. He got blasted by everyone (except Paul), deflected the barbs and explained his positions while sticking to his message. A few fumbles---perhaps he could have left out one complaint about "the barbs", which would have made McCain look even worse--as well as the schmoozy "America is a great nation" schtick.

Huckabee did alright, he spoke well, but lacked his own specificity on some issues, and he seemed to borrow from McCain a lot, in addition to looking like McCain's pup.

McCain was snide, bitter, and mind-numbingly self-righteous. I do not want to vote for McCain. Lord help us.

Totally unbiased, opinion, hmmm?
I didn't see them , except for bits on YouTube, but the general consensus (which is often wrong, of course) is that Romney got smacked.

OTOH, it didn't seem to hit his poll numbers, and the same general opinion was that he did really well on the (Ron Paulless) Fox debate on Sunday.

In 2000 Independents came out for McCain and gave him the win over Bush; if Obama draws them this time, it's bad news for Saint John.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by GrayMouser

Totally unbiased, opinion, hmmm?
.

Now wait a minute, I never claimed to be unbiased.

Romney got smacked by the other candidates (namely the Huckabee/McCain smooch fest), but it's also generally agreed (start with DIck Morris who hates Mitt) that Romney prevailed in the overall scheme. He's now back up in the polling and nearly tied with 'Saint John.

The exclusion of Ron Paul was sad because I always like what he has to say. But maybe they didn't have enough room at that tiny desk? Seriously, if you watch the debate, all the candidates are crammed together at a tiny desk, and SOMEONE put Romney between Huckabee and McCain.

And Curu,

It is frightening. Very.

[Curubethion]

A weird flirty Hillary mood? Now that's scary.

[Curubethion]

Ron Paul has no desk; Ron Paul needs no desk!

[hectorberlioz]

*swoons* Alaska is VERY important

[hectorberlioz]

This is great

[hectorberlioz]

Hmm. So far things aren't looking good for my candidate. If he is ruined in NH, I think I'm going to have to support Fred Thompson.

[Curubethion]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

*swoons* Alaska is VERY important

Hey, now, I know somebody from Alaska...

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

This is great

ROFL! Brilliant, Sir Hector.

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

Hmm. So far things aren't looking good for my candidate. If he is ruined in NH, I think I'm going to have to support Fred Thompson.

Wow. That's desperate.

[Mari]

There is a lot of media attention for the elections in the Netherlands as well. Personally I favor Obama, but actually I think a combination of the keypoints together would work best for me. This is why I never get into politics.

Thank you for the summary/recap/whatever Hector! It's interesting to compare them to the recaps in the Dutch news, where they focus mainly on what would be best for us.
Hilary and Obama are the favorites here.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Mari

There is a lot of media attention for the elections in the Netherlands as well. Personally I favor Obama, but actually I think a combination of the keypoints together would work best for me. This is why I never get into politics.

Thank you for the summary/recap/whatever Hector! It's interesting to compare them to the recaps in the Dutch news, where they focus mainly on what would be best for us.
Hilary and Obama are the favorites here.

Thanks Mari. I read all the "main guys" on politics, and pull together what I think is sensible from them, with just a tad of intuition.