bball

[Lizra]

Gosh, I'm so proud of the Pacers I could burst! They've really worked hard this season, and have earned a great spot at #2 for quite some time. I am excited about this week's game against Detroit. The Pacers have a game the night before, I hope Detroit plays the previous night also, so the are both "equal".
Reggie Miller makes the fans so happy when he makes those killer 3 pointers at the end of the fourth quarters! And just think...Brad Miller was a Pacer last year! Gosh, thats rough ...but I'm not complaining, just.... he's from Indiana! A Hoosier! And Pollard hasn't amounted to anything yet! maybe he'll step up here soon!
Today my son and husband are at a Harlem Globetrotters show at Consenco Fieldhouse. I hope some Pacers are there! I'm going to take my daughter to the Hobby Lobby and buy art supplies.

[Valandil]

Lizra - I'm sure you're quite excited about the Pacers beating the Pistons (to stop their team-record win-streak at 13!).

I for one am excited that the Pacers and Pistons both give the east a chance to be competitive with the west in this year's final.

That Midwest division is still oh-so-tight! If the season ended today, the west teams in the playoffs would be 2 from the Pacific (Sacramento and LA Lakers) and 6 (out of 7) from the Midwest!!

Bulls... starting a trend of giving up double-digit leads on their way to double-digit losses. If your favorite team is playing them and gets way behind, there's not a whole lot to worry about.

[Lizra]

The Bulls coach has some work to do!! How frustrating! Need more defense?

Oh, It was so nice last night! After the Colts loss, it was good to see Tony Dungee (Colts coach) there (and Helio Castraneves, the Indy 500 champ also) enjoying the win. Jermain O'neal...too sweet! Reggie...."oh what a thrill" BOOM Baby! Rick Carlisle always looks miserable! I hope the Pacers dont "melt down" after the All-Star break, like last year.

The coach thing was weird! There was Larry Brown ( who will always be a great Pacer's coach IMO, he struggled with us through all the Jordon/Bulls years) and Rick Carlisle, the Pistons old coach...incestuous! Glad the players were different! Yeah....East is cool!

Oooh! I just checked the ratings! Numero 1, at .750! Wow, wow, wowee!

[jerseydevil]

Well New Jersey gets the shaft again. After losing for decades in NJ - the now winning Nets were sold today and are moving to Brooklyn. I think I will have to get my voodoo dolls out for them too. Make the team worthless to brooklyn. [edit] Crooklyn.

Brooklyn Developer Reaches Deal to Buy Nets
(Trenton-AP, January 21, 2004) — Brooklyn developer Bruce Ratner has reached an agreement to buy the New Jersey Nets, a team official said Wednesday night.

Edwin Stier, president of Community Youth Organization, which owns the Nets, said the contract was finalized Wednesday afternoon. He said the board of YankeeNets, the holding company of the Nets and New York Yankees, must now approve the contract at a meeting Friday morning. The holding company is on the verge of being dissolved.

"I'm very pleased that the process worked and was very successful and I'm very glad it's over. It was a very intense process of negotiation," Stier said.

Ratner's bid was accepted over an offer from a group led by real estate developer Charles Kushner and Sen. Jon S. Corzine of New Jersey. Ratner's bid was reportedly $300 million, a price Stier did not confirm Wednesday.

Ratner, the developer of Brooklyn's 16-acre MetroTech Center, plans to move the Nets to a new arena at the center of a $2.5 billion office, residential and shopping complex in Brooklyn.

Kushner and Corzine had sought to keep the team in New Jersey.

Bids were also made by New York Islanders owner Charles Wang and New York financier Stuart D. Feldman. Neither was in contention by the end of the process.

Stier said he informed Kushner of the board's decision late Wednesday afternoon.

"He wasn't shocked," Stier said. "He told me he appreciated the way the process was run. All the parties who participated expressed that to me."

Ratner's proposed Brooklyn Arena and Brooklyn Atlantic Yards are a combined residential, retail and commercial space with 7.7 million square feet of space. The arena would seat 19,000 for basketball, and include 4,500 units of residential housing and 2.1 million square feet of commercial office space.

Under the plan, development of the arena would begin next year and it would be ready in time for the 2006 season.

The entire development would take 10 years, according to a release from Ratner. The arena would be located at the intersection of Flatbush and Atlantic avenues in downtown Brooklyn, near a major Long Island Rail Road terminal and a number of city subway lines, as well as commercial outlets in the area.

[jerseydevil]

This is a letter I sent to the governor, NJ senators and several newspapers around New Jersey regarding the Nets moving to Brooklyn.

Dear Governor McGreevey,

Well - New Jersey gets the shaft again. First the Giants and Jets decide to put NY on their uniforms, now the Nets are leaving New Jersey for Brooklyn. Does this state have any self respect and identity? We are losing a key advertising vehicle for this state, and partially it's no thanks to you. The Nets could have been moved to Newark - which I supported, but no - that wasn't going to happen. Now, we have had a losing basketball team here and within two years of starting to win - they decide they're leaving.

So now I want to know - what are the great plans for Sports in NJ now? Besides the huge mall that is called Xanadu that is. What is New Jersey going to do to bring high profile things to this state and bring some self respect.

I worked on New Jersey Liberty Tower - http://www.NJLibertyTower.com , something that would have brought tourism and would have brought a world renown symbol to NJ. Instead, that wasn't fully pursued by the state and that opportunity seems to have been squandered and lost by the state.

We are the only state in the country which doesn't have welcome signs prominently displayed and the few we do have are these small things a mile within our border, mostly telling people to turn their lights on if it's raining. I shouldn't be surprised that most people I talk to outside NJ think we are just part of NY. It's no wonder everyone outside this state thinks so lowly of us. Most New Jerseyans don't even care - not even our politicians. All our politicians do is bend over to New York, and frankly I'm tired of it.

I will from now on vote for who I see fighting for New JERSEY - and frankly you are NOT one of those politicians. Senator Corzine on the other hand seems to be one of these few NJ politicians who actually tries to bring self respect to the state.

I suppose the New Jersey Devils will be next to give us the shaft while our politicians look on. Strange - I thought the Meadowlands was supposed to be built into this huge sports complex to advertise New Jersey. Instead it looks like it's going no where other than being turned into a glorified mall with sports related activities.

As a demonstration of our lack of identity, I have actually seen concert shirts that say "Meadowlands, New York New York" and yesterday I had to e-mail Icelandair because on their site they listed Newark Liberty International Airport as being "Newark Int'l, New York, New York". Now we are losing the Nets to NY, the Devils are probably soon to follow and our two NFL teams are so ashamed of New Jersey - they put NY on their uniforms. All this while our wonderful politicians look on and residents of this state are so brainwashed by the ridiculous stereotypes about our state - they say nothing and accept it. Maybe we should just offer the whole state of New Jersey for sale to New York, I'm sure some of our politicians would actually go for it.

New Jersey and the residents of this state need to start doing something to bring self respect to this state. I have called up the Director of Tourism several times about my New Jersey tourism website and the most I have gotten is, "why are you reinventing the wheel - we have VisitNJ.org already". I don't know of any state that would refuse free advertising or shows such disinterest in talking to someone who loves their state and wants to change people's attitudes toward it. In my small way - I am trying to make a difference in this state, but I am finding it more and more of an uphill battle.

Thank you,

Robert P Rosetta
WebMaster@AboutNewJersey.com
http://www.AboutNewJersey.com

[Lizra]

So it's the Brooklyn Nets or something now? I wonder if the name will change? Sorry JD....

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Lizra
So it's the Brooklyn Nets or something now? I wonder if the name will change? Sorry JD....

Of course they will change the name - only NJ is stupid enough to allow teams to come to our state and keep their old name, ie, Jets and Giants using NY. They will be known as the Brooklyn Nets.

The Nets won't be moving until 2006 though supposedly. It still also has to get approved - but the generally feeling is that it will just be rubber stamped and they are out of her come 2006.

Thanks for the condolences. It's just another stab in the back to NJ.

[gollum9630]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
Of course they will change the name - only NJ is stupid enough to allow teams to come to our state and keep their old name, ie, Jets and Giants using NY. They will be known as the Brooklyn Nets.

The Nets won't be moving until 2006 though supposedly. It still also has to get approved - but the generally feeling is that it will just be rubber stamped and they are out of her come 2006.

Thanks for the condolences. It's just another stab in the back to NJ.

what about memphis. i dont think they have ever seen grizzlies there except in zoo's. they should of changed there name when they moved from vancouver. looks nike NJ isnt the dumbest state when it comes to sports

[Insidious Rex]

Well ever notice any lakes in Los Angeles? And do they play a lot of Jazz in Utah? Generally teams avoid changing their names even when they move because the name has some mass appeal and therefor financial worth. Thats why that baseball team in LA is still known as the Dodgers even after like 50 years.

[Valandil]

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
Well ever notice any lakes in Los Angeles? And do they play a lot of Jazz in Utah? Generally teams avoid changing their names even when they move because the name has some mass appeal and therefor financial worth. Thats why that baseball team in LA is still known as the Dodgers even after like 50 years.

Plus the FOOTBALL Cardinals are in their THIRD location! They were Chicago's 'other' football team before moving to St. Louis - and then on to Arizona. I don't think there are any Cardinals in Arizona anyway... at least St. Louis has a good deal more of them than Chicago.

Would the Nets be the Brooklyn Nets though? Or just the New York Nets?

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by gollum9630
what about memphis. i dont think they have ever seen grizzlies there except in zoo's. they should of changed there name when they moved from vancouver. looks nike NJ isnt the dumbest state when it comes to sports

I'm NOT talking about THAT name - I'm talking about the Giants and Jets playing in New Jersey and being allowed to keep wearing NY (which is only recent in the last 3 years). The Nets aren't going to move to NY and keep NJ.

I thought I made this clear enough by saying...

ie, Jets and Giants using NY

When the Colts moved from Baltimore to Indianapolis - did they keep Baltimore in their name?

[edit] Having now clarified Gollum - how many states/cities have allowed a team to move and keep their old location's name? The Nets will be moving less distance than the Giants and Jets did when they moved to NJ.

Valandil - they will be the Brooklyn Nets.

[Sister Golden Hair]

they will be the Brooklyn Nets.

For some reason, I always thought they were the NY Nets.

[Insidious Rex]

Originally posted by Valandil
I don't think there are any Cardinals in Arizona anyway... at least St. Louis has a good deal more of them than Chicago.

Im guessing you dont see a lot of bears strolling down Michigan avenue either.

[jerseydevil]

By the way - I just got a phone call from the Home News Tribune and they are considering publishing my letter to the Governor. All the times I have gotten a phone call, my letter has been published, even though they always say it's "for consideration" and they're just checking to make sure I am the author and that it is acceptable for publication. So chances are - it will be and hopefully it will appear in the Sunday edition. If the Star Ledger published it - it would be great. It's a much larger newspaper.

I sent a letter complaining about the Plainsboro police and they got off my back. Maybe this will have an affect too.

Also - According to a Home News Article - the NJ Sports Authority is trying to keep the Nets moniker. They feel another pro Basketball team may move here. I don't know why they think that when they also complain that NJ loses $2 million a year on the lease to the Nets.

N.J. leaders adamant on no-subsidy stance

Published in the Home News Tribune 1/23/04
By GEOFF MOSHER
GANNETT NEW JERSEY

EAST RUTHERFORD -- The Meadowlands Sports Complex will be "vibrant" and "profitable" if the New Jersey Nets move to Brooklyn, N.Y., a state official said yesterday.

Though he lamented Bruce Ratner's plan to transport the Nets from their current home, Continental Airlines Arena, into a proposed new arena in downtown Brooklyn, George R. Zoffinger, president of the New Jersey Sports & Exposition Authority, insisted the Meadowlands would flourish nonetheless.

Citing the Xanadu project, a $1.4 billion sports-and-entertainment facility to be built on the Meadowlands site, and a new railroad line to support mass transportation, Zoffinger said losing the Nets could boost the state's economy.

"Despite this being a sad day for Nets fans, we definitely feel strongly that we represent the Nets' fans in this project," said Zoffinger, who said the state loses $2 million to $2.5 million annually from its lease with the Nets. "We did everything we could, short of giving the owners a public subsidy, to keep the team. We're comfortable with the no-subsidy position we took. We think it's the right decision."

"We had a choice to make in New Jersey," Gov. James E. McGreevey added in a written a statement. "A choice between the people who work hard every day to earn a living and pay their bills and the owners of sports teams worth hundreds of millions of dollars."

The Nets' lease doesn't expire until 2006, but Zoffinger said the state remains hopeful another professional franchise will seek residence in New Jersey.

The New Jersey Devils of the National Hockey League, also housed by the arena, have contemplated a move to Newark when their lease expires. The New York Giants and New York Jets of the National Football League each play at the Meadowlands, which also fields a horse-racing track.

Part of the Xanadu project includes a minor-league baseball stadium to house the Bergen Cliffhawks of the Atlantic League.

The Cliffhawks' rights belong to Flemington-based automobile mogul Steve Kalafer, who also owns the Atlantic League's Somerset Patriots and Newark Bears.

Kalafer, who said he anticipated both the Nets' and Devils' move out of the arena when he involved himself with Xanadu, praised the state for its stance.

"They said we're not going to subsidize and they stuck to their guns," Kalafer said. "They said they would help the Nets stay, they offered incentives that were taxpayer-neutral, but at the end of the day they made a business decision. Xanadu is going ahead full-steam, and the Cliffhawks are going full-steam ahead."

Ratner, whose $300 million bid beat out a group headed by real estate developer Charles Kushner and U.S. Sen. Jon Corzine, D-N.J., seeks to construct a $435 million sports arena to bolster its $2.5 billion residential and office complex at the intersection of Flatbush and Atlantic avenues.

He first must sign an agreement with the Community Youth Organization, which owns the Nets, and meet the approval of NBA owners and the board of YankeeNets, the holding company of the Nets and New York Yankees.

Ratner also needs to meet state and city requirements before construction can begin.

Zoffinger said the Authority is asking the NBA to keep the "Nets" moniker in case another professional franchise seeks housing in the Meadowlands.

"We're confident some team will want to be here," he said. "There is a fan base here. There is a demographic of prosperity here that makes this place attractive for professional sports franchises."

© 2004 Gannett New Jersey Group

What they are doing in Brooklyn could have been done in Newark and SHOULD have been done in Newark.

As for there being a fan base - the only way to develop a fan base is when there is a sense of self for the city or state. New Jersey does not have this, nor do they attempt to develop it.

It's funny how they claim that the reason was subsidies, but the owner didn't get subsidies for the Nets in Brooklyn. He is a developer though and will be developing the arena and the business complex there.

Sometimes a state has to spend some money to generate tourism dollars and nothing gets the exposure around the country and world like sports franchises. Also - New Jersey needs to do things that change it's image. While I was in Tennessee - I was surprised at the number of people I saw wearing New Jersey Nets shirts, and how all the stores sold New Jersey Nets items. We did not have that when we were losing.

In addition, once Xanadu is finished and the Nets and Devils are playing in the center of it, people would see a great place to visit.

For those who don't know what Xanadu is - it is this...

Meadowlands NEW JERSEY SPORTS AND EXPOSITION AUTHORITY APPROVES MEADOWLANDS XANADU DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT

The Mills Corporation/Mack-Cali Realty Corporation project will transform the Meadowlands into the country’s foremost destination for sports, entertainment, recreation and office facilities

East Rutherford, N.J., December 3, 2003 – A joint venture between affiliates of The Mills Corporation (NYSE: MLS) and Mack-Cali Realty Corporation (NYSE: CLI) today signed an agreement with the New Jersey Sports and Exposition Authority (NJSEA) for the redevelopment of the Continental Airlines Arena site and the construction of Meadowlands Xanadu, the 4.76 million-square-foot family entertainment, office and hotel complex to be built at the Meadowlands Sports Complex.

You can watch a 10 minute video that shows the indoor skiing/snowboarding and everything else that is planned for the site...Realplayer Video

More Xanadu Information

I think after Xanadu is built - the Nets would have been more than profitable, there would be public transportation, there would be restaurants, there would be tourists who would "catch a game". Right now the Meadowlands is just in the middle of a swamp with no restaurants or anything else around. The area would be a family envronment that would give people something to do, before and after a game.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
For some reason, I always thought they were the NY Nets.

I will have to tell you what I think of your comment offline. There seems to be a rule against flaming and cursing someone out.

[mithrand1r]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
For some reason, I always thought they were the NY Nets.

At one time the Nets used to play somewhere in Long Island (ie Nassau or Suffolk county.)

I remember telling someone from Nassau COunty that Long Island is made up of Brooklyn, Queens, Nassau and Suffolk counties.

She was quick to point out that Brooklyn and Queens are not part of Long Island. Maybe politically that is true but geographically it is not true.

One can look at a map of NY and see Long Island is made up of Brooklyn, Queens, Nassau and Suffolk counties.

========================================
I think that JD is correct, that in New Jersey people, citizens and the politicians that claim to represent them, should take pride in their state.

The Giants and Jets are not the only teams that claim to play in another city, while playing in another.

The Dallas Cowboys play in Irving, TX.
The Washington Redskins play in Landover, MD.
The Buffalo Bills play in Orchard Park, NY.

to name a few teams.

edit: some spelling mistakes

[Lizra]

Originally posted by jerseydevil




When the Colts moved from Baltimore to Indianapolis - did they keep Baltimore in their name?

Of course not! We're not that dumb!

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by mithrand1r
At one time the Nets used to play somewhere in Long Island (ie Nassau or Suffolk county.)

I remember telling someone from Nassau COunty that Long Island is made up of Brooklyn, Queens, Nassau and Suffolk counties.

She was quick to point out that Brooklyn and Queens are not part of Long Island. Maybe politically that is true by geographically it is not true.

One can look at a map of NY and see Long Island is made up of Brooklyn, Queens, Nassau and Suffolk counties.

Yeah - I know. Most people think that Long Island is just the Hamptons. They seem to forget that on the west end of the island is Brooklyn and Queens.

========================================
I think that JD is correct, that in New Jersey people, citizens and the politicians that claim to represent them, should take pride in their state.

But why don't they? Why do we give in and give in to NY. At least Governor Chrstie Whitman took NY to court over Ellis Island and Liberty Island. She used to fight for New Jersey and didn't take crap from NY.

The Giants and Jets are not the only teams that claim to play in another city, while playing in another.

The Dallas Cowboys play in Irving, TX.
The Washington Redskins play in Landover, MD.
The Buffalo Bills play in Orhard Park, NY.

to name a few teams.

All those teams, except for Washington which isn't a state anyway - at least play in the same state, The Giants and Jets don't even play in NY State, let alone the city.

[gollum9630]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
I'm NOT talking about THAT name - I'm talking about the Giants and Jets playing in New Jersey and being allowed to keep wearing NY (which is only recent in the last 3 years). The Nets aren't going to move to NY and keep NJ.

sorry, misread your post

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by gollum9630
sorry, misread your post

No problem. I knew it was going to be misunderstood when I wrote it and I tried to make it understandable that I was talking about the "location name" - not the "team name" by doing the "ie..."