Why did Glorfindel come back to life?

***Alcuin*** · 11-04-2019, 12:51 AM

This is a good thread that deserves to be reignited. I recommend in particular the discussion between bropous and Ã‘Ã³lendil (beginning toward the end of the first page and moving onto the second).

I think the general consensus is that the spirit (fÃ«a) of Glorfindel of Gondolin who died fighting a balrog that attacked the refugees that included Tuor, Idril, and young EÃ¤rendil in the Crissaegrim above the ruins of Gondolin went to Mandos when Glorfindel was killed. Because of his self-sacrifice in dying to protect others (most notably the seven year old EÃ¤rendil, who later arrived in Valinor bearing the Silmaril as an embassy begging clemency and assistance for Elves and Men in their struggle against Morgoth), his part in the Rebellion of the Noldor, which did not include any part in the Kinslaying at AlqualondÃ«, was set aside. Moreover, Elves are by nature bound to Arda until its end, after which they do not know what is to become of them: this is the subject, in fact, of a beautiful essay by Tolkien published in Morgoth’s Ring, “The Debate of Finrod and Andreth.” Any Elf in the keeping of Mandos that had been purged of his failings (Elves are not without sin, though they seek to avoid it) may eventually be rehoused in a body (hrÃ¶a, not born but prepared for each individual by the Valar) and resume his life as an embodied creature. So it was that Glorfindel also resumed his embodied life.

When and why did Glorfindel return to Middle-earth? At this point the storyline becomes a bit unclear, though the why is clear enough: Glorfindel returned to Middle-earth to fight against Sauron. The when is less clear. It seems to have been Tolkien’s first intention that Glorfindel returned when Gandalf the Grey came to Middle-earth sometime around the end of the first millennium of the Third Age. But there is also a note that suggests that Glorfindel returned in the middle of the Second Age during the War of the Elves and Sauron, when Sauron attacked the Noldor of Eregion and seized the Rings of Power, and then attacked Lindon to wipe out the surviving Eldar of Middle-earth, only to be attacked in turn from behind and utterly defeated by the expeditionary force of NÃºmenor.

All of this is covered in an essay titled “Glorfindel” published in Peoples of Middle-earth. It is not “canon” in that it was written late in Tolkien’s life and not published during his lifetime; however, most readers accept this explanation, with the caveat that no one knows for certain when Glorfindel returned, whether during the Third Age or the Second. (Most people seem to prefer the Third Age; I prefer the Second; but it is of no import either way, unless you’re writing fan-fiction.)

A second issue is covered in this thread: the fÃ«ar (spirits, souls) of FÃ«anor and FinwÃ« his father. Because of his heinous crimes – not so much in leading the Rebellion, but in the horrific and altogether unnecessary Kinslaying at AlqualondÃ« – the spirit (soul) of FÃ«anor was bound in the Halls of Mandos until the End of Time. FinwÃ«, however, was innocent in all this; but as related in this thread, after FÃ«anor’s mother MÃ*riel gave birth to him, she lost heart and laid down her life and went to Mandos; and after an age (during the time of the Two Trees), when she would not return despite the urging of the Maiar and Valar, FinwÃ« was permitted to marry Indis, who gave birth to two sons, Fingolfin and Finarfin. After Morgoth slew FinwÃ« at FÃ«anor’s fortress Formenos and stole the Silmarils, FinwÃ« also went to Mandos. There he agreed to remain so that MÃ*riel might return at last to live as an embodied creature, while his spirit remained unhoused (without a body) in Mandos. That might have been, I think, in part so that FinwÃ« could commune with his beloved son FÃ«anor, whose spirit was confined not only for his actions, which were all but unforgivable, but to reason with him and work toward his redemption; but that’s just my opinion.

A last note on this subject of canonicity: None of this is “canon” because none of it was published during Tolkien’s lifetime. His youngest son and executor Christopher published The Silmarillion in 1977 with the assistance of Canadian author Guy Gavriel Kay. Christopher Tolkien was the child most taken with his father’s stories, and has spent the decades since his father’s death in 1973 going through his father’s writings to preserve and illuminate them as best he can – and he has done a magnificent job! Because The Silmarillion was published four years after JRR Tolkien’s death, it cannot be considered canon, either; besides Christopher Tolkien himself remarks in places that he wishes he had included some things in The Silmarillion that he did not, while excluding others: there are many variants on most of the stories.

Bottom line: Glorfindel came back to life because Elves are bound to Arda as long as it exists. Unless they are barred from returning to an embodied existence, the Valar return them to bodies when they deem them ready, and Glorfindel was returned to a body. Glorfindel returned to Middle-earth to fight against Sauron.

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11-04-2019, 12:51 AM	#1
*Alcuin* Salt Miner Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: gone to Far Harad Posts: 987	This is a good thread that deserves to be reignited. I recommend in particular the discussion between bropous and Ã‘Ã³lendil (beginning toward the end of the first page and moving onto the second). I think the general consensus is that the spirit (fÃ«a) of Glorfindel of Gondolin who died fighting a balrog that attacked the refugees that included Tuor, Idril, and young EÃ¤rendil in the Crissaegrim above the ruins of Gondolin went to Mandos when Glorfindel was killed. Because of his self-sacrifice in dying to protect others (most notably the seven year old EÃ¤rendil, who later arrived in Valinor bearing the Silmaril as an embassy begging clemency and assistance for Elves and Men in their struggle against Morgoth), his part in the Rebellion of the Noldor, which did not include any part in the Kinslaying at AlqualondÃ«, was set aside. Moreover, Elves are by nature bound to Arda until its end, after which they do not know what is to become of them: this is the subject, in fact, of a beautiful essay by Tolkien published in Morgoth’s Ring, “The Debate of Finrod and Andreth.” Any Elf in the keeping of Mandos that had been purged of his failings (Elves are not without sin, though they seek to avoid it) may eventually be rehoused in a body (hrÃ¶a, not born but prepared for each individual by the Valar) and resume his life as an embodied creature. So it was that Glorfindel also resumed his embodied life. When and why did Glorfindel return to Middle-earth? At this point the storyline becomes a bit unclear, though the why is clear enough: Glorfindel returned to Middle-earth to fight against Sauron. The when is less clear. It seems to have been Tolkien’s first intention that Glorfindel returned when Gandalf the Grey came to Middle-earth sometime around the end of the first millennium of the Third Age. But there is also a note that suggests that Glorfindel returned in the middle of the Second Age during the War of the Elves and Sauron, when Sauron attacked the Noldor of Eregion and seized the Rings of Power, and then attacked Lindon to wipe out the surviving Eldar of Middle-earth, only to be attacked in turn from behind and utterly defeated by the expeditionary force of NÃºmenor. All of this is covered in an essay titled “Glorfindel” published in Peoples of Middle-earth. It is not “canon” in that it was written late in Tolkien’s life and not published during his lifetime; however, most readers accept this explanation, with the caveat that no one knows for certain when Glorfindel returned, whether during the Third Age or the Second. (Most people seem to prefer the Third Age; I prefer the Second; but it is of no import either way, unless you’re writing fan-fiction.) A second issue is covered in this thread: the fÃ«ar (spirits, souls) of FÃ«anor and FinwÃ« his father. Because of his heinous crimes – not so much in leading the Rebellion, but in the horrific and altogether unnecessary Kinslaying at AlqualondÃ« – the spirit (soul) of FÃ«anor was bound in the Halls of Mandos until the End of Time. FinwÃ«, however, was innocent in all this; but as related in this thread, after FÃ«anor’s mother MÃriel gave birth to him, she lost heart and laid down her life and went to Mandos; and after an age (during the time of the Two Trees), when she would not return despite the urging of the Maiar and Valar, FinwÃ« was permitted to marry Indis, who gave birth to two sons, Fingolfin and Finarfin. After Morgoth slew FinwÃ« at FÃ«anor’s fortress Formenos and stole the Silmarils, FinwÃ« also went to Mandos. There he agreed to remain so that MÃriel might return at last to live as an embodied creature, while his spirit remained unhoused (without a body) in Mandos. That might have been, I think, in part so that FinwÃ« could commune with his beloved son FÃ«anor, whose spirit was confined not only for his actions, which were all but unforgivable, but to reason with him and work toward his redemption; but that’s just my opinion. A last note on this subject of canonicity: None of this is “canon” because none of it was published during Tolkien’s lifetime. His youngest son and executor Christopher published The Silmarillion in 1977 with the assistance of Canadian author Guy Gavriel Kay. Christopher Tolkien was the child most taken with his father’s stories, and has spent the decades since his father’s death in 1973 going through his father’s writings to preserve and illuminate them as best he can – and he has done a magnificent job! Because The Silmarillion was published four years after JRR Tolkien’s death, it cannot be considered canon, either; besides Christopher Tolkien himself remarks in places that he wishes he had included some things in The Silmarillion that he did not, while excluding others: there are many variants on most of the stories. Bottom line: Glorfindel came back to life because Elves are bound to Arda as long as it exists. Unless they are barred from returning to an embodied existence, the Valar return them to bodies when they deem them ready, and Glorfindel was returned to a body. Glorfindel returned to Middle-earth to fight against Sauron.