Religious Knowledge Thread

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 09:04 PM

I thought about putting this in the offshoot religion thread, but it didn't really seem like it would fit.

Anyway, this is a thread for people to ask questions about other religions (Questions which are NOT meant to be debasing or offensive in any way) or faith/denomination. If I was wrong to create a new thread, then some mod just close this, and I'll bop myself for stupidity and repost in the offshoot discussion.

Anyway, I have questions for Catholics, Jews, and Wiccans.

1.
This one actually originated from my mom; she thought that 'bless me, father, for I have sinned' made little sense. I think that it means that the confessing person needs to be blessed because they have sinned. Catholics, am I right or wrong?

2.
The Jews pretty well consider Jesus to be one of the prophets, right?

3.
Wiccans worship a God and Goddess, right? Do they have names?

Legolaslvr! · 03-07-2003, 09:43 PM

*Cough* *Cough* Padlock!

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 09:44 PM

I thought this might not be the sort of stuff for the religion offshoot thread. We'll have to wait to see with whom the mods agree.

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 09:53 PM

No i think this is a good idea.

I cant really speak for the first two questions and Im not Wiccan but from what I understand Wiccans can focus on "The Goddess" which basically represents the earth or they can also simply focus on nature as a force and an entity. Which is why so many times you hear the term "tree worshipers". But maybe the actual wiccans should come out of the wood work (he he...) and explain a little better.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 09:55 PM

So do I, which is why I started the thread.

Hmm? I thought they worshipped a Goddess and a God?

Coney · 03-07-2003, 09:56 PM

Quote:

No i think this is a good idea.

I agree

It's about time the 'moot had a religion thread that isn't based solely on christianity

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 09:57 PM

Paganism by definition is an open ended spiritual philosophy. One may worship oaks. another may worship a horned god. another may worship nothing at all but just be in touch with nature on a spiritual sense. theres no boundries and rules like there are with the big three.

Elvellyn · 03-07-2003, 10:01 PM

For what its worth, I think this thread is perfectly appropriate.

It's the Offshoot of the Offshoot discussion of the what religion are you thread

I'm not Jewish or Catholic or Wiccan so I can't anwser any of your questions but I have a few of my own. Unfortunatly I'm having a temporary brain freeze and can't think of any of them.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Coney
I agree

It's about time the 'moot had a religion thread that isn't based solely on christianity

Actually, it was intended to ask questions and (hopefully) get answers concerning other religions.

And it's had them before. Naturally, the original one wasn't a solely Christian-based thread, and there was some input on other religions on the offshoot.

Coney · 03-07-2003, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
Paganism by definition is an open ended spiritual philosophy. One may worship oaks. another may worship a horned god. another may worship nothing at all but just be in touch with nature on a spiritual sense. theres no boundries and rules like there are with the big three.

Nope, a Pagan does not worship oaks trees (although they may worship spirits of said trees) or a specific God/Goddess.......

Paganism is not a spriritual philosophy or a nature worship either....

Paganism is an acceptance of every pantheon of diety, many Pagans do celebrate specific day's dedicated to specific dieties but they are free to worship who/what and when they worship them

Followers of the the Wiccan religion often describe themselves as Pagan, when they are in fact Neo-Pagan (i.e. they follow an individual pantheon, and believe in no other

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Coney
Paganism is not a spriritual philosophy or a nature worship either....

Paganism is an acceptance of every pantheon of diety, many Pagans do celebrate specific day's dedicated to specific dieties but they are free to worship who/what and when they worship them

Seems like an inconsistancy to say pagans arent this or that or cant do this or that because they can do whatever they want and believe whatever they want....

I guess my point was that pagans dont follow one specific dogma but are free to follow their own path of spirituality.

jerseydevil · 03-07-2003, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
I thought about putting this in the offshoot religion thread, but it didn't really seem like it would fit.

Anyway, this is a thread for people to ask questions about other religions (Questions which are NOT meant to be debasing or offensive in any way) or faith/denomination. If I was wrong to create a new thread, then some mod just close this, and I'll bop myself for stupidity and repost in the offshoot discussion.

I don't seen anything wrong with this thread.

Quote:

Anyway, I have questions for Catholics, Jews, and Wiccans.

1.
This one actually originated from my mom; she thought that 'bless me, father, for I have sinned' made little sense. I think that it means that the confessing person needs to be blessed because they have sinned. Catholics, am I right or wrong?

You are right. It's generally said when you first go into the confessional. "Bless me father for I have sinned, it's been (so many months/years) since my last confession" Then you start telling the priest your sins. It's acknowledging your sins, stating that you are sorry and asking for absolution. The priest then gives you penance to do - such as so many Hail Marys, Our Fathers and so forth. I guess if you do somethign really bad they'll tell you to do some community service.

Quote:

2.
The Jews pretty well consider Jesus to be one of the prophets, right?

From all my experiences - yes - they just don't consider him the saviour.

Quote:

3.
Wiccans worship a God and Goddess, right? Do they have names?

Can't really answer that one.

Coney · 03-07-2003, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
Seems like an inconsistancy to say pagans arent this or that or cant do this or that because they can do whatever they want and believe whatever they want....

Nope, Pagans believe that that all dieties exist, if one god/goddess exists than why can't they all? And if they all exist then why should we be forced to worship only those that demand it, instead of those that may actually benefit us when we worship them? That is not to say that other religions worship is not of benefit, but Paganism is more leaning towards dieties that focus upon life on earth, rather than an afterlife (please, you've got to look beyond the hebrew/christian dogma to understand this).

Quote:

I guess my point was that pagans dont follow one specific dogma but are free to follow their own path of spirituality.

Paganism is not about spirituality

......certain aspects of shamanism are but Paganism is about worshipping specific dieties, not Spirits that are "connected" to the material world.

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 10:34 PM

Hey I read Drawing Down The Moon ok! *laugh* And Margo Adler says that paganism is anything that isnt covered by the big three religions basically. So i am dubious when people try to define it. And I dont see how you can say its NOT spiritual at all. Are you going to tell those self labled pagans who worship wood and stone "excuse me but you guys arent pagan. sorry." I only speak from the experience of living with half a dozen or so pagans for a while. None of them were alike. They all had their own weird rituals and ideas about their path. some had crystals every where. some painted their faces and wore strange clothes. some used tons of drugs to reach a spiritual place (hey whatever it takes to rationalize a good time I say) and some were hard core business grad students who happened to think they could tap into certain animal totums and spirits to help guide them through their every day life. But they all called themselves pagans and were part of a significant pagan community in their area. so whose to say they are all wrong?

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 10:35 PM

Ah, so you consider atheists to be Pagan?

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
Ah, so you consider atheists to be Pagan?

Well the inquisitioners did.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 10:42 PM

Isn't it 'Inquisitors'?

Anyway, I don't think Pagan; I might say heathen, but more likely heretical.

Coney · 03-07-2003, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
Hey I read Drawing Down The Moon ok! *laugh* And Margo Adler says that paganism is anything that isnt covered by the big three religions basically. So i am dubious when people try to define it. And I dont see how you can say its NOT spiritual at all. Are you going to tell those self labled pagans who worship wood and stone "excuse me but you guys arent pagan. sorry." I only speak from the experience of living with half a dozen or so pagans for a while. None of them were alike. They all had their own weird rituals and ideas about their path. some had crystals every where. some painted their faces and wore strange clothes. some used tons of drugs to reach a spiritual place (hey whatever it takes to rationalize a good time I say) and some were hard core business grad students who happened to think they could tap into certain animal totums and spirits to help guide them through their every day life. But they all called themselves pagans and were part of a significant pagan community in their area. so whose to say they are all wrong?

Insidious, everything you said there relates to the so-called "New Age Pagan" .....it's a common mistake, not your fault

For some stange (or maybe fashionable reason) Paganism and Spirituality became mixed up in the last century (Wiccan was only invented in the last century). Neither worship is wrong IMO (A god/goddess/spirit does not have to be old to be revered)

Basically Spiritualism is the worship of a being (spirit) that is bound to a physical form....be it rock, tree or totem pole (and numerous others).

Paganism is the worship of a being(s) (spirit/god/wotever) that is unbound to the physical realm.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-07-2003, 10:46 PM

And here I was thinking that Paganism was the belief in all pantheons.

So confused...

Insidious Rex · 03-07-2003, 10:48 PM

so whats an example of a true modern pagan then?

03-07-2003, 09:04 PM	#1
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Religious Knowledge Thread I thought about putting this in the offshoot religion thread, but it didn't really seem like it would fit. Anyway, this is a thread for people to ask questions about other religions (Questions which are NOT meant to be debasing or offensive in any way) or faith/denomination. If I was wrong to create a new thread, then some mod just close this, and I'll bop myself for stupidity and repost in the offshoot discussion. Anyway, I have questions for Catholics, Jews, and Wiccans. 1. This one actually originated from my mom; she thought that 'bless me, father, for I have sinned' made little sense. I think that it means that the confessing person needs to be blessed because they have sinned. Catholics, am I right or wrong? 2. The Jews pretty well consider Jesus to be one of the prophets, right? 3. Wiccans worship a God and Goddess, right? Do they have names? __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 09:43 PM	#2
Legolaslvr! Super Smilie Freak Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: In the entmoot army, trying to get rid of black and blue! Posts: 350	Cough Cough Padlock! __________________ MO The fat hobbit hobbit knows!

03-07-2003, 09:44 PM	#3
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	I thought this might not be the sort of stuff for the religion offshoot thread. We'll have to wait to see with whom the mods agree. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 09:53 PM	#4
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	No i think this is a good idea. I cant really speak for the first two questions and Im not Wiccan but from what I understand Wiccans can focus on "The Goddess" which basically represents the earth or they can also simply focus on nature as a force and an entity. Which is why so many times you hear the term "tree worshipers". But maybe the actual wiccans should come out of the wood work (he he...) and explain a little better. __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

03-07-2003, 09:55 PM	#5
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	So do I, which is why I started the thread. Hmm? I thought they worshipped a Goddess and a God? __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 09:57 PM	#7
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	Paganism by definition is an open ended spiritual philosophy. One may worship oaks. another may worship a horned god. another may worship nothing at all but just be in touch with nature on a spiritual sense. theres no boundries and rules like there are with the big three. __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

03-07-2003, 10:01 PM	#8
Elvellyn The Redneck Elf Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: In a house Posts: 539	For what its worth, I think this thread is perfectly appropriate. It's the Offshoot of the Offshoot discussion of the what religion are you thread I'm not Jewish or Catholic or Wiccan so I can't anwser any of your questions but I have a few of my own. Unfortunatly I'm having a temporary brain freeze and can't think of any of them. __________________ Oliphants make great pets.

03-07-2003, 10:34 PM	#14
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	Hey I read Drawing Down The Moon ok! laugh And Margo Adler says that paganism is anything that isnt covered by the big three religions basically. So i am dubious when people try to define it. And I dont see how you can say its NOT spiritual at all. Are you going to tell those self labled pagans who worship wood and stone "excuse me but you guys arent pagan. sorry." I only speak from the experience of living with half a dozen or so pagans for a while. None of them were alike. They all had their own weird rituals and ideas about their path. some had crystals every where. some painted their faces and wore strange clothes. some used tons of drugs to reach a spiritual place (hey whatever it takes to rationalize a good time I say) and some were hard core business grad students who happened to think they could tap into certain animal totums and spirits to help guide them through their every day life. But they all called themselves pagans and were part of a significant pagan community in their area. so whose to say they are all wrong? __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

03-07-2003, 10:35 PM	#15
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Ah, so you consider atheists to be Pagan? __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 10:42 PM	#17
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Isn't it 'Inquisitors'? Anyway, I don't think Pagan; I might say heathen, but more likely heretical. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 10:46 PM	#19
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	And here I was thinking that Paganism was the belief in all pantheons. So confused... __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-07-2003, 10:48 PM	#20
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	so whats an example of a true modern pagan then? __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

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