Eol - Page 4

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf
Evil nah! Just a selfish !@#$%^&*.

Yeah, I'd agree with that.

Hey A-E, I've never tried that.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-17-2002, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeardofPants

Yeah, I'd agree with that.

What, for Melian?

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 09:34 PM

Of course, Melian.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-17-2002, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeardofPants
Of course, Melian.

Sorry, I wasn't sure...

I would agree to that assesment too, A-E. Of Melian..er.

Christiana · 08-18-2002, 12:11 PM

sheesh,u guys are bigger spammers than i am!

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-18-2002, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Christiana
sheesh,u guys are bigger spammers than i am!

No we aren't. We were actually saying something.

Christiana · 08-18-2002, 01:58 PM

hahaha.ur sig.says otherwise!

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-18-2002, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Christiana
hahaha.ur sig.says otherwise!

Does it? What does it say that would say otherwise? By the way, we are way off topic. Please stay on topic!

BeardofPants · 08-18-2002, 06:43 PM

As has been said Christiana, we were on topic, which is more than I can say for you.

So, now that we've agreed that Melian was selfish, can we not apply that to Eol as well? I mean, his actions were that of a selfish git, rather than a wholly evil one.

Mirahzi · 08-18-2002, 07:55 PM

Actually I disagree..

Quote:

Elwe, lord of the Teleri, went often through the great woods to seek out Finwe his friend in the dwellings of the Noldor; and it chanced on a time that he came alone to the starlit wood of Nan Elmoth, and there suddenely he heard the song of nightingales. Then an enchantment fell on him, and he stood still; and afar off beyond the voices of the lomelindi he heard the voice of Melian, and it filled all his heart with wonder and desire. He forgot then utterly all his people and all the purposes of his mind, and following the birds under the shadow of the trees he passed deep into Nan Elmoth and was lost. But he came at last to a glade open to the stars, and there Melian stood; and out of the darkness he looked at her, and the light of Aman was in her face.
She spoke no word; but being filled with love Elwe came to her and took her hand, and straightway a spell was laid on him, so that they stood thus while long years were measured by the wheeling stars above them; and the tress of Nan Elmoth grew tall and dark before they spoke any word.

Melian did enchant Elwe, but that was because of mere chance. She did not do so with the intent of luring him to her.

***Khamûl*** · 08-18-2002, 10:35 PM

Eruviel Greenleaf and BeardofPants telling someone to stay on topic?

I'm at a loss for words.

I've just finished this part of the book and from my impressions, Eol was pretty bad. Not fully bad, but maybe just lonely. Now maybe if I went back and read it again, I might see differently. I can understand where you're coming from with Melian, Mirahzi.

BeardofPants · 08-18-2002, 11:15 PM

Yeah, lookit for the flying pigs Khamul.

Good to see another one in the He's not wholly evil camp.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-19-2002, 12:31 AM

Okay, so he's not wholly evil. But what virtues does he have? How is he at all good?

Oh, right (answering my own questions...) he did befriend the dwarves and was a skilled swordsmith. But other than that?

Mirahzi · 08-19-2002, 01:27 AM

Well, he certainly loved Aredhel. That is undeniably a good thing.

Artanis · 08-19-2002, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mirahzi
Well, he certainly loved Aredhel. That is undeniably a good thing.

I'm not so sure. My impression is he wanted to possess her. Not quite the same as love.

Mirahzi · 08-19-2002, 03:47 AM

I disagree. If she were truly his captive, then I doubt he would've let her roam as much as she did. Also, she bore him a son.

Artanis · 08-19-2002, 06:50 AM

She may have loved him, at least in the beginning, and so bore him a son. This does not imply that he loved her. The Sil uses the word 'desire', not 'love', to describe Eol's feelings. And even if she was allowed to wander, he commanded her to avoid the sunlight, and to stay away from her kin.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-19-2002, 11:19 AM

I agree with Artanis--I don't think Eol actually loved her. Wanted her, yes. Loved her? No. Had he truly loved her I don't think he would have kept her captive the way he did, forbidding her to see her kin and avoiding sunlight (by the way...was there a reason for this? I don't really understand this command...). I don't think love was ever mentioned, especially on Eol's part. And I would even doubt that Aredhel actually loved him.

***Sister Golden Hair*** · 08-19-2002, 12:14 PM

Eol forbade Aredhel from seeing her kin, because he utterly hated the Noldor for the Kinslaying. I can't be sure about all this love stuff, but he (Eol) I think certianly had a lust for her, and I believe she cared for him, because when the guards of Gondolin captured him and told Turgon, Aredhel told them that he was indeed her husband and not to slay him. Also, when Eol defied Turgon's law and threw the spear striking Aredhel, he was to come before the kings judgement the next day, and it says that Aredhel and Idril moved Turgon to pity, and to be merciful to Eol. It wasn't until Aredhel sickened in the night and died that Turgon decided to have him killed.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-19-2002, 01:35 PM

Right...I guess Aredhel did love him, or at least care about him. A little. I personally don't see why, but oh well that's not me...er...Anyway. Point being, Aredhel cared about Eol to some extent, but still Eol didn't seem to love Aredhel and merely wanted her. I don't have the book with me now, but as I recall he didn't seem to be all that remorseful when she was hit by the javelin. Of course, please tell me if I'm wrong!

08-17-2002, 09:34 PM	#3
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Of course, Melian. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-18-2002, 12:11 PM	#5
Christiana Elf Lord Join Date: May 2002 Location: Searching desperately for a swan boat to take to Valinor Posts: 1,231	sheesh,u guys are bigger spammers than i am! __________________ I take full responsibility for my actions, except for those that are somebody else's fault Having someone to blame is nearly as good as having a solution to the problem Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you are a mile away from them, and you habe their shoes. ~Frieda Norris

08-18-2002, 01:58 PM	#7
Christiana Elf Lord Join Date: May 2002 Location: Searching desperately for a swan boat to take to Valinor Posts: 1,231	hahaha.ur sig.says otherwise! __________________ I take full responsibility for my actions, except for those that are somebody else's fault Having someone to blame is nearly as good as having a solution to the problem Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you are a mile away from them, and you habe their shoes. ~Frieda Norris

08-18-2002, 06:43 PM	#9
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	As has been said Christiana, we were on topic, which is more than I can say for you. So, now that we've agreed that Melian was selfish, can we not apply that to Eol as well? I mean, his actions were that of a selfish git, rather than a wholly evil one. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-18-2002, 10:35 PM	#11
*Khamûl* Slacker Warrior Admin Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,759	Eruviel Greenleaf and BeardofPants telling someone to stay on topic? I'm at a loss for words. I've just finished this part of the book and from my impressions, Eol was pretty bad. Not fully bad, but maybe just lonely. Now maybe if I went back and read it again, I might see differently. I can understand where you're coming from with Melian, Mirahzi. __________________ "If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you." Gandalf to Pippin Psalm 107:31

08-18-2002, 11:15 PM	#12
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Yeah, lookit for the flying pigs Khamul. Good to see another one in the He's not wholly evil camp. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-19-2002, 12:31 AM	#13
Eruviel Greenleaf Alcoholic Villain-Fancying Elf Pirate Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lyonesse Posts: 4,547	Okay, so he's not wholly evil. But what virtues does he have? How is he at all good? Oh, right (answering my own questions...) he did befriend the dwarves and was a skilled swordsmith. But other than that? __________________ Eruviel Greenleaf in a past life. "Whoever has come to understand the world has found only a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." -The Gospel of Thomas SQUAWK!

08-19-2002, 01:27 AM	#14
Mirahzi Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,286	Well, he certainly loved Aredhel. That is undeniably a good thing. __________________ "For the less even as for the greater there is some deed that he may accomplish but once only; and in that deed his heart shall rest." - Fëanor

08-19-2002, 03:47 AM	#16
Mirahzi Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,286	I disagree. If she were truly his captive, then I doubt he would've let her roam as much as she did. Also, she bore him a son. __________________ "For the less even as for the greater there is some deed that he may accomplish but once only; and in that deed his heart shall rest." - Fëanor

08-19-2002, 06:50 AM	#17
Artanis Greatest Elven woman of Aman Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7 Posts: 4,285	She may have loved him, at least in the beginning, and so bore him a son. This does not imply that he loved her. The Sil uses the word 'desire', not 'love', to describe Eol's feelings. And even if she was allowed to wander, he commanded her to avoid the sunlight, and to stay away from her kin. __________________ --Life is hard, and then we die.

08-19-2002, 11:19 AM	#18
Eruviel Greenleaf Alcoholic Villain-Fancying Elf Pirate Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lyonesse Posts: 4,547	I agree with Artanis--I don't think Eol actually loved her. Wanted her, yes. Loved her? No. Had he truly loved her I don't think he would have kept her captive the way he did, forbidding her to see her kin and avoiding sunlight (by the way...was there a reason for this? I don't really understand this command...). I don't think love was ever mentioned, especially on Eol's part. And I would even doubt that Aredhel actually loved him. __________________ Eruviel Greenleaf in a past life. "Whoever has come to understand the world has found only a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." -The Gospel of Thomas SQUAWK!

08-19-2002, 12:14 PM	#19
*Sister Golden Hair* Queen of Nargothrond Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Akron, Ohio - USA Posts: 7,121	Eol forbade Aredhel from seeing her kin, because he utterly hated the Noldor for the Kinslaying. I can't be sure about all this love stuff, but he (Eol) I think certianly had a lust for her, and I believe she cared for him, because when the guards of Gondolin captured him and told Turgon, Aredhel told them that he was indeed her husband and not to slay him. Also, when Eol defied Turgon's law and threw the spear striking Aredhel, he was to come before the kings judgement the next day, and it says that Aredhel and Idril moved Turgon to pity, and to be merciful to Eol. It wasn't until Aredhel sickened in the night and died that Turgon decided to have him killed.

08-19-2002, 01:35 PM	#20
Eruviel Greenleaf Alcoholic Villain-Fancying Elf Pirate Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lyonesse Posts: 4,547	Right...I guess Aredhel did love him, or at least care about him. A little. I personally don't see why, but oh well that's not me...er...Anyway. Point being, Aredhel cared about Eol to some extent, but still Eol didn't seem to love Aredhel and merely wanted her. I don't have the book with me now, but as I recall he didn't seem to be all that remorseful when she was hit by the javelin. Of course, please tell me if I'm wrong! __________________ Eruviel Greenleaf in a past life. "Whoever has come to understand the world has found only a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." -The Gospel of Thomas SQUAWK!