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12-24-2011, 12:51 AM
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#1 |
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Elf Lord
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: sikeston, MO, usa, earth, sol
Posts: 3,114
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Then you must, Must, MUst, MUSt, MUST order the Dorothy L. Sayers translation and read it immediately. You shall never have a better introduction to Dante or high Fantasy! On my oath as an Entmooter! Even the subCreator Tolkien himself went to meetings of the Dante Club (cf. Letters). What higher accolade could there be? (At least on the 'Moot?)
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Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941 |
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12-25-2011, 05:34 AM
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#2 |
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Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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I disagree with the inclusion of Dante/Milton/the Odyssey/Orlando Furioso etc. in lists of this type, not, obviously, on literary grounds, but on the question of genre.
I think "Fantasy" as a genre -not to mention "Science Fiction"- should be restricted to modern (19th-century on) works where both author and reader acknowledge they're entering into imaginary worlds. "Frankenstein" (1818) would be my nominee for the first 'true' SF, George MacDonald's "Phantastes" (1858) for the first work in "Fantasy". As well I would distinguish children's books like Pooh, "The Wind in the Willows" "Alice", and even my own personal favorite Moomintroll, from Fantasy.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill Last edited by GrayMouser : 12-25-2011 at 05:38 AM. |
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12-26-2011, 01:42 AM
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#3 | |
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Cyber Elf Lord
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Left of Rock, Right of Hard Place
Posts: 986
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I think that there are books that fit outside of your boundaries.
Gulliver's Travels could be considered a fantasy book. At the moment, I can not think of another pre-1800 fantasy/sci-fi books.. Why should children stories not be considered as fantasy or sci-fi books? Quote:
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Sincerely, Anthony  'Many are my names in many countries,' he said. 'Mithrandir among the Elves, Tharkûn to the Drarves; Olórin I was in my youth in the West that is forgotten, in the South Incánus, in the North Gandalf; to the East I go not.' Faramir What nobler employment, or more valuable to the state, than that of the man who instructs the rising generation? Cicero (106BC-43BC) |
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01-10-2012, 05:02 AM
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#4 | |
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Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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Quote:
 )Gulliver would be, if anything, an early science fiction- no magical or supernatural elements at all. Science fiction has a natural early limit, which is the emergence of science. Isaac Asimov considers Somnium, by Kepler, to be the first sf, though the transportation to the Moon is by demon. As for fantasy, there's a long history of fantastical tales- probably the most common and most popular form of story in human history (and prehistory). Call it modern fantasy, if you will- a distinct genre that emerged from the Romantic movement in the 19th Century. I think one essential element of (modern) fantasy is the drawing of distinct boundaries between our world and the fantasy one. This holds true whether the other world is self-contained like Middle Earth, or whether characters can travel back and forth, like Narnia. Children's stories, like Pooh or The Wind in he Willows tend to simply ignore the distinction. Again, it's not a hard-and-fast rule, and opinions will differ on where to draw the line.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill Last edited by GrayMouser : 01-10-2012 at 05:03 AM. |
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08-21-2012, 10:11 PM
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#5 |
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Elf Lord
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: St. Louis, Mo. USA
Posts: 561
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you will never be the same...
read the sf short stories of Cordwainer Smith! (one of the old collections was called "you will never be the same")
These are truly remarkable...
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Ringbearer Hide Witch, hide! The Good Folks come to burn thee! Their keen enjoyment hid behind A Gothic mask of duty! |
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08-23-2012, 01:39 AM
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#6 |
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Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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Yeah, one of my favorites of the old-timers. Science-fantasy that truly gives the feeling of otherness.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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01-26-2018, 03:20 PM
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#7 | |
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AngAdan
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 856
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Quote:
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Gaius Mucius Scaevola Older, richer, and wiser than you "Mighty are the Ainur, and mightiest among them is Melkor, but that he may know, and all the Ainur, that I am Iluvatar, those things that ye have sung, I will show them forth, ... And thou, Melkor, shalt see that no theme may be played that hath not its uttermost source in me," |
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