Silmarillion Re-Read

[Galin]

To be clear, some (at least seem to) argue that Tolkien abandoned statements like the following.

'It is now clear to me that in any case the Mythology must actually be a 'Mannish' affair. (Men are really only interested in Men and in Men's ideas and visions.) The High Eldar living and being tutored by the demiurgic beings must have known, or at least their writers and loremasters must have known, the 'truth' (according to their measure of understanding). What we have in the Silmarillion etc. are traditions (especially personalized, and centered upon actors, such as Fëanor) handed on by Men in Númenor and later in Middle-earth (Arnor and Gondor); but already far back - from the first association of Dúnedain and Elf-friends with the Eldar in Beleriand - blended and confused with their own Mannish myths and cosmic ideas.'

Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed

I think (my theory) is that he only abandoned (in a sense) the new texts that resulted from such thinking, meaning, I think he realized he didn't need to write a new Quenta Silmarillion that reflected the specific story ideas also found in Myths Transformed.


There are other late characterizations of the Silmarillion being largely Mannish in perspective (see below the line of sleep if interested), and for me it begs the question why do this, if not, at least in part, to speak to concerns that had cropped up before (Tolkien was thinking about Round Word Mythology before The Lord of the Rings was published).

Some also argue that this doesn't fit with the Bilbo tradition, as there were living Elves in Imladris to "correct" any somewhat garbled mannish accounts. I argue that that would be like someone given the task of faithfully translating some very old work of art in the Primary World, and "correcting it". Not the translator's job. Or it need not be so.

Anyway I don't want to derail this thread (ahem, more than I have and am right now) with my theories, but it cheers me to read your commentary about "facts" and myth. While Tolkien was concerned about some big issues here (Sun and Moon, Shape of Earth, for examples) he did not want to tinker away at everything with science or facts.

The "star imagines" of the Dome of Varda, for example, were, in my opinion, a beautiful addition to the more Elvish account of the early world, even if such a text (a completed, more Elvish Silmarillion) would never really be needed as part of a multi-perspective legendarium.

In my opinion!

Beware "the line of sleep" below. You have been warned

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Although in any larger discussion of transmission the mariner Elfwine would hardly be left out, here the focus is more on the role of Numenor and JRRT's statements concerning The Silmarillion.

For instance, here's a hint of a Numenorean transmission dating from the early 1950s, in the preamble to a version of Annals of Aman (for a theoried date, see Myths Transformed Text I, note 3, Morgoth's Ring):

'Here begin the 'Annals of Aman'. Rumil made them in the Elder Days, and they were held in memory by the Exiles. Those parts which we learned and remembered were thus set down in Numenor before the Shadow fell upon it.'

Note 2, Author's notes on the Commentary, Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth (Morgoth's Ring):

'Physically Arda was what we should call the Solar System. Presumably the Eldar could have had as much and as accurate information concerning this, its structure, origin, and its relation to the rest of Ea as they could comprehend. Probably those who were interested did acquire this knowledge. Not all the Eldar were interested in everything; most of them concentrated their attention on (or as they said 'were in love with') the Earth.'

'The traditions here referred to have come down from the Eldar of the First Age, through Elves who never were directly acquainted with the Valar, and through Men who received 'lore' from the Elves, but who had myths and cosmogonic legends, and astronomical guess of their own. There is however, nothing in them that seriously conflicts with present human notions of the Solar System, and its size and position relative to the Universe. It must be remembered, however, that it does not necessarily follow that 'True Information' concerning Arda (such as the ancient Eldar might have received from the Valar) must agree with Men's present theories.'

Or note 7 -- in part concerning the Prophecy of Mandos (the conclusion of Quenta Silmarillion from The Lost Road And Other Writings):

'The myth that appears at the end of the Silmarillion is of Numenorean origin; it is clearly made by Men, though men acquainted with Elvish tradition. All Elvish traditions are presented as 'histories', or as accounts of what once was.'

On a slip Tolkien wrote:

'The cosmogonic myths are Numenorean, blending Elven-lore with human myth and imagination. A note should say that the Wise of Numenor recorded that the making of stars was not so, nor of Sun and Moon. For Sun and stars were all older than Arda. But the placing of Arda amidst stars and under the [?guard] of the Sun was due to Manwe and Varda before the assault of Melkor.'

Also, an interesting change as well, to Quenta Silmarillion (the LQ2 text):

'Of their lives was made the Lay of Leithian, Release from Bondage, which is the longest save one of the songs of [the Noldor >] Númenor concerning the world of old;...'

For the revised edition of The Lord of the Rings, Tolkien noted (Prologue) that Bilbo had used sources at Rivendell, living and written, to produce his 'Translations from the Elvish', being 'almost entirely concerned with the Elder Days.' And JRRT had published, concerning a poem:

'No. 14 also depends on the lore of Rivendell, Elvish and Numenorean, concerning the Heroic days at the end of the First Age; it seems to contain echoes of the Numenorean tale of Turin and Mim the Dwarf. '

1962, The Adventures of Tom Bombadil, Preface

1968 (Shibboleth of Feanor) Note 17:

'As is seen in the Silmarillion. This is not an Eldarin title or work. It is a compilation, pobably made in Numenor, which includes (in prose) the four great tales or lays of the heores of the Atani, of which 'The Children of Hurin' was probably composed already in Beleriand in the First Age, but necessarily is preceded by an account of Feanor and his making of the Silmarils. All however are 'Mannish' works.'

In a letter Tolkien explained (after mentioning certain mortals who were allowed to sail to Eressea, and the notion of the Straight Road):

'This general idea lies behind the events of The Lord of the Rings and the Silmarillion, but it is not put forward as geologically or astronomically 'true'; except that some special physical catastrophe is supposed to lie behind the legends and marked the first stage in the succession of Men to domnion of the world. But the legends are mainly of 'Mannish' origin blended with those of the Sindar (Grey-elves) and others who had not left Middle-earth.'

JRRT, 1971 letter to Roger Green

This is interesting, since we have legends from Elves 'who had not left Middle-earth'. Although we must consider Galadriel, for example.

Possibly as late as 1972, Last Writings Note 17:

'Here he wrote that the idea [the idea being that Elvish reincarnation might be achieved by rebirth as a child] '... must be abandoned, or at least noted as a false notion, e.g. probably of Mannish origin, since nearly all the matter of The Silmarillion is contained in myths and legends that have passed through Men's hands and minds, and are (in many points) plainly influenced by contact and confusion with the myths, theories, and legends of Men.'

And Tolkien made the following revision to The Hobbit regarding the issue of the Sun And Moon, for example...

"... before they came back into the Wide World. In the Wide World the Wood-elves lingered in the twilight before the raising of the Sun and Moon; and afterwards they wandered in the great forests that grew beneath the sunrise. They loved best the edges of the woods."

From 'Flies and Spiders', The Hobbit 1937, revised to...

'... before some came back into the Wide World. In the Wide World the Wood-elves lingered in the twilight of our Sun and Moon but loved best the stars; and they wandered in the great forests that grew tall in lands that are now lost. They dwelt most often by the edges of the wood.'

That one's really interesting I think, especially considering that it was published by JRRT.