The Animated Movie - Page 4

barrelrider110 · 03-25-2002, 03:57 PM

Well spoken, Laughing woman.

The Hobbit movie first aired in '77 and I was reading the book at the time. I thought it was interesting and entertaining, but I can't say I loved it.

The voices of John Huston as Gandalf and Richard Boone as Smaug were outstanding. I was a folk-music fan from the 60s so I liked the Glen Yarborough songs, but by 1977 the Folk Music genre was old so even then they were dated. The animation of Gollum and the wood-elves were way off. The king of the wood-elves looked like a green pixie, had a kabukie-style head piece and spoke with a thick Austrian accent (the voice of Otto Preminger). One would have thought the animators would have taken a little time to research Tolkien literature first.

Years later, my 8-year old daughter and I watched the Hobbit movie together, and she thought it was cool. So as a children's movie, it served the purpose of telling the story well and introducing kids to Middle Earth. She’s 13 now and read the Hobbit and LoTR twice and she wants to try the Silmarillion. She logs onto the Entmoot as foolofatook11 and I am thankful to the Rankin Bass movie for starting her Tolkien obsession, which is something we share.

As far as the other two animated versions, I thought that Bakshi's version would have been awesome had it been finished. Ralph Bakshi, who made a name for himself by producing a witty, off-beat animated full-length movie called Fritz the Cat, ran out of money and decided to fund the second half of LoTR with profits from the first. One problem--very few people went to see the first half. All the critics panned it. It was a financial disaster and needless to say there were no profits and no second half of LoTR made.

In his version of LoTR, Bakshi tried hard to stay as close to the original story line as possible and his alterations really only were made to save time. The illustrations were better than the Rankin-Bass movie (except that Boromir was pictured as Viking). The ringwraiths were excellent, and Bormir’s death scene was very moving. He used a technique called Rotoscoping that combines live-action footage overlaid with hand-drawn animation. Even though I liked it, more people than not thought it was garbage. I think half of the people in the theatre left well before the movie was finished.

I was unimpressed with the Rankin-Bass treatment of RoTK. That style was much better suited to the children’s story of the Hobbit and the animators continued draw Gollum as a *bleep-bleep* mutant frog.

Laughing Woman · 03-25-2002, 04:35 PM

Thank you barrelrider,

Your analysis was very helpful. Also, I am delighted to here about your 13 year old daughter. It is such a joy to be able to pass along a love for learning i.e. reading to your children. I am grateful for that with my own.(now 22, 26)

Your quote about "luck" has so many theological implications. I was at the Conference on Christianity and literature two weeks ago. There were two papers and a keynote speaker who discussed some of those implications. Tolkein's genius (pointed out by one of the speakers) is that unlike Lewis (another favorite but not in the same way) Tolkein being a cradle to grave Christian realized that God does not come as Aslan in anyone's "real" experience. Instead, God comes in reflecting on our "luck" as the littlest, and weakest of his creatures--and yet chosen to bear his image on our life journey. Thanks again.

Xivigg · 03-26-2002, 04:43 PM

Tolkien write The Hobbit for his children so it's a child stories i think they were around 7-10 at that time (this is soo far in my memories i can be very wrong. The age of Tolkien kids i mean)

Then he start to write The Lord of the Rings for his children when they would be older.

I think it's why they are so good... he write for his children... for the love of them.

My view

Laughing Woman · 03-26-2002, 04:58 PM

Dear Elven Warrior and fellow citizens of the imagination,

I am glad that Tolkein could write intelligent prose for children. It is so rare. Pablum is I am afraid what we are receiving in much of the media today.

I hope that you all will write your own stories some day.

TwirlingString · 04-16-2002, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bmilder
What did you think of it? I thought it had its moments, but overall was a bit disappointing. I think it was the best of all the animated movies set in Tolkien's world, though. The "cuteness" fit in with the themes of the Hobbit, but that weird RotK movie didn't really benefit from it. Also, it was very weird in the RotK movie the way it referred to the Hobbit movie, since it was made by the same company, and not the previous LotR movie...

It was quite possably the most boring and confusing movie on earth. I'd read the book an I still didn't know what was goimg on (or the point) half the time.

Laughing Woman · 04-16-2002, 11:03 PM

Dear Twirling String,

Why are you named that? I really like the names of the Hobbit group. The poem is awesome. Thanks for sharing it. I think it would be neat for the kids in my tutoring group to memorize it.

I am looking forward to more conversations. I'm really not going to show much of the movie. Just enough for the children to get intrigued so that they then can read parts of the book. If they read some of the easier passages to help them to learn to read more efficiently and understand more deeply what they read, then I will have accomplished my purpose.
'Thanks again for replying.

TwirlingString · 04-17-2002, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Laughing Woman
Dear Twirling String,

Why are you named that? I really like the names of the Hobbit group. The poem is awesome. Thanks for sharing it. I think it would be neat for the kids in my tutoring group to memorize it.

I am looking forward to more conversations. I'm really not going to show much of the movie. Just enough for the children to get intrigued so that they then can read parts of the book. If they read some of the easier passages to help them to learn to read more efficiently and understand more deeply what they read, then I will have accomplished my purpose.
'Thanks again for replying.

Happy to obligie. I've got a post up about how I got my name. (I wonder, is it going against ethics to help a teacher give homework?) Why do you start every post with a dear something?

Laughing Woman · 04-17-2002, 03:48 PM

Dear Twirling String,

I don't know why I start every reply with a dear something. I think it is because I was taught to write letters this way. Giving homework is a teacher's job, right? However, to clarify, I am really not giving the children more homework although they might see it that way. I am really helping them learn to read. I assist them with their homework, and I help them by giving them practice in reading, writing, speaking and math.

I hope that helps to explain it.

Thanks for replying

TwirlingString · 04-17-2002, 11:46 PM

Maybe that's why. LOTR may not be the best for introducing people into loving reading.

samwiselvr2008 · 08-01-2002, 03:33 PM

I think that the Hobbit was not that good, but it was okay. the best tolkien animated movie i have seen!

Willow Oran · 08-04-2002, 12:52 AM

I just watched The Hobbit a few days ago at a cast party. The play we had just finished doing was The Hobbit and to tell the truth I think that our version of it was a far better adaption. Our script was much truer to the book and the tunes which we had composed for the songs were far more melodious than the ones in the movie. I also think we did a better portrayal of the elves. As I watched the movie I found myself wondering several things, Why were ther stars orbiting Elrond's head and why did he have a goatee? (I played Elrond in our play and so I'm a bit touchy about bad prtrayals of him now.) But the movie really wasn't all that bad till it got to mirkwood and we discovered that someone had done away with the wood elves and placed a bunch of blue goblinesque, furwearing things in their part. I didn't really like how they did smaug either but thats probably because we had played smaug as female and I was used to hearing female voices (mine included) in that part of the story. Anyway, that's my little spiel on the subject. Bye.

webwizard333 · 08-04-2002, 10:50 AM

I don't think I've ever seen the animated Hobbit, though I did see (and instantly forget) the Bakshi version. It looks like its making a quick comeback with the new FotR movie's popularity, as it was in one of the cashier shelves noirmally reserved for new releases in my local Best Buy. I think I'll make a effort though to rent it from my library.

WiseWizard · 08-04-2002, 02:22 PM

I was also at the cast party for Hobbit with Willow Oran. I also agree completely with everything she said. There were, however, two things she didn't mention which truly disturbed me to the very seat of my soul.
First, Gandalf. Everything about him. I played Gandalf, and it shamed me to watch his portrayal in the movie. What was up with that nose? I mean, really, no one, not even wizards, has that long of a nose. It looked like they had taken a drawing of a stick and attached it to his face!

Though, I did think that it was quite cool that lightning followed him everywhere he went.

Second, where were everyone's pants?!? I felt like I was being violated every time a man sat down and didn't cross his legs.

Must get rid of bad image......thanks again, Willow!

Willow Oran · 08-04-2002, 03:32 PM

Indeed, the missing pants were rather traumatizing. So was the way they had Bill the Pony get eaten by the squid thing in LOTR. And what was up with the battle of the random dots? We also had the animated RotK at the cast party but nobody wanted to watch it after the other two. The anmated movies are really quite painful to watch, especially if you've just finished performing a superior version.

WiseWizard · 08-04-2002, 05:12 PM

NO, Bill is NOT dead! The tentacles were only reaching for him! He could've gotten away! Damn it, he could've gotten away! *begins sobbing*
*takes on Charlton Heston accent* Damn them! Damn them all to hell!

Willow Oran · 08-05-2002, 02:12 PM

The ponies in the Hobbit didn't get away though. They were eaten by those things that were supposedly goblins but looked more like overgrown walruses with fur and legs.

Celandine · 08-06-2002, 02:16 PM

i didn't see all of it but the parts i did were interesting...

Dolenloteiel · 08-08-2002, 02:52 PM

I saw those movies as well. They were very dissapointing, and I nearly fell asleep. My sis kept me awake.

Diaxion · 08-18-2002, 11:42 PM

Well movie was my either second or third intro to Tolkien but of course the book was better.

WiseWizard · 08-19-2002, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dolenloteiel
I saw those movies as well. They were very dissapointing, and I nearly fell asleep. My sis kept me awake.

You were forced to stay awake just to see that movie? I'm extremely sorry. I know it's not my fault, but someone needs to apologize.

03-25-2002, 03:57 PM	#61
barrelrider110 Peer of the realm of Sanguine Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Hill, Marlton, NJ Posts: 798	Well spoken, Laughing woman. The Hobbit movie first aired in '77 and I was reading the book at the time. I thought it was interesting and entertaining, but I can't say I loved it. The voices of John Huston as Gandalf and Richard Boone as Smaug were outstanding. I was a folk-music fan from the 60s so I liked the Glen Yarborough songs, but by 1977 the Folk Music genre was old so even then they were dated. The animation of Gollum and the wood-elves were way off. The king of the wood-elves looked like a green pixie, had a kabukie-style head piece and spoke with a thick Austrian accent (the voice of Otto Preminger). One would have thought the animators would have taken a little time to research Tolkien literature first. Years later, my 8-year old daughter and I watched the Hobbit movie together, and she thought it was cool. So as a children's movie, it served the purpose of telling the story well and introducing kids to Middle Earth. She’s 13 now and read the Hobbit and LoTR twice and she wants to try the Silmarillion. She logs onto the Entmoot as foolofatook11 and I am thankful to the Rankin Bass movie for starting her Tolkien obsession, which is something we share. As far as the other two animated versions, I thought that Bakshi's version would have been awesome had it been finished. Ralph Bakshi, who made a name for himself by producing a witty, off-beat animated full-length movie called Fritz the Cat, ran out of money and decided to fund the second half of LoTR with profits from the first. One problem--very few people went to see the first half. All the critics panned it. It was a financial disaster and needless to say there were no profits and no second half of LoTR made. In his version of LoTR, Bakshi tried hard to stay as close to the original story line as possible and his alterations really only were made to save time. The illustrations were better than the Rankin-Bass movie (except that Boromir was pictured as Viking). The ringwraiths were excellent, and Bormir’s death scene was very moving. He used a technique called Rotoscoping that combines live-action footage overlaid with hand-drawn animation. Even though I liked it, more people than not thought it was garbage. I think half of the people in the theatre left well before the movie was finished. I was unimpressed with the Rankin-Bass treatment of RoTK. That style was much better suited to the children’s story of the Hobbit and the animators continued draw Gollum as a bleep-bleep mutant frog. __________________ “"I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ringwinner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider," Fear Complacency! ___________________ Something under the bed is drooling Last edited by barrelrider110 : 03-25-2002 at 04:22 PM.

03-25-2002, 04:35 PM	#62
Laughing Woman Sapling Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: santa barbara Posts: 11	Thank you barrelrider, Your analysis was very helpful. Also, I am delighted to here about your 13 year old daughter. It is such a joy to be able to pass along a love for learning i.e. reading to your children. I am grateful for that with my own.(now 22, 26) Your quote about "luck" has so many theological implications. I was at the Conference on Christianity and literature two weeks ago. There were two papers and a keynote speaker who discussed some of those implications. Tolkein's genius (pointed out by one of the speakers) is that unlike Lewis (another favorite but not in the same way) Tolkein being a cradle to grave Christian realized that God does not come as Aslan in anyone's "real" experience. Instead, God comes in reflecting on our "luck" as the littlest, and weakest of his creatures--and yet chosen to bear his image on our life journey. Thanks again. __________________ laughing woman

03-26-2002, 04:43 PM	#63
Xivigg Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Earth Posts: 495	Tolkien write The Hobbit for his children so it's a child stories i think they were around 7-10 at that time (this is soo far in my memories i can be very wrong. The age of Tolkien kids i mean) Then he start to write The Lord of the Rings for his children when they would be older. I think it's why they are so good... he write for his children... for the love of them. My view __________________ Thinking before acting is alway's a good idea.

03-26-2002, 04:58 PM	#64
Laughing Woman Sapling Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: santa barbara Posts: 11	Dear Elven Warrior and fellow citizens of the imagination, I am glad that Tolkein could write intelligent prose for children. It is so rare. Pablum is I am afraid what we are receiving in much of the media today. I hope that you all will write your own stories some day. __________________ laughing woman

04-16-2002, 11:03 PM	#66
Laughing Woman Sapling Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: santa barbara Posts: 11	Dear Twirling String, Why are you named that? I really like the names of the Hobbit group. The poem is awesome. Thanks for sharing it. I think it would be neat for the kids in my tutoring group to memorize it. I am looking forward to more conversations. I'm really not going to show much of the movie. Just enough for the children to get intrigued so that they then can read parts of the book. If they read some of the easier passages to help them to learn to read more efficiently and understand more deeply what they read, then I will have accomplished my purpose. 'Thanks again for replying. __________________ laughing woman

04-17-2002, 03:48 PM	#68
Laughing Woman Sapling Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: santa barbara Posts: 11	Dear Twirling String, I don't know why I start every reply with a dear something. I think it is because I was taught to write letters this way. Giving homework is a teacher's job, right? However, to clarify, I am really not giving the children more homework although they might see it that way. I am really helping them learn to read. I assist them with their homework, and I help them by giving them practice in reading, writing, speaking and math. I hope that helps to explain it. Thanks for replying __________________ laughing woman

04-17-2002, 11:46 PM	#69
TwirlingString Elven Warrior Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: My mother would say somewhere between the adult mystery section and the YA sci-fi Posts: 489	Maybe that's why. LOTR may not be the best for introducing people into loving reading. __________________ "The Astels are an emotional people. They cry at the drop of a handkerchief. Their culture is much like that of Pelosia. They're extremely devot and invincibly backward. It's been demonstrated to them over an over that serfdom is an archaic, inefficent institution, but they maintain it anyway--largely at the connivance of the serfs thmselves. Astellian nobles don't exert themselves in any way, so they have no concept of human endurance. The serfs take advantage of that outrageously. Astellian serfs have been known to collapse from sheer exhauston at the very mention of such unpleasant words as 'reaping' or 'digging'." ----------------------------------------------- “They lost him?!” Lupin asked , amazed. “Voldemort has been after Harry for 15 years, and then he misplaces him?!”

08-01-2002, 03:33 PM	#70
samwiselvr2008 Elf Lord Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Hobbiton Posts: 739	I think that the Hobbit was not that good, but it was okay. the best tolkien animated movie i have seen! __________________ Jesus loves you! Movie vewing count from the theater: Return of the King:9 Two Towers: 11 Fellowship: 13 FRODO LIVES!

08-04-2002, 12:52 AM	#71
Willow Oran Deus Ex Machina Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,951	I just watched The Hobbit a few days ago at a cast party. The play we had just finished doing was The Hobbit and to tell the truth I think that our version of it was a far better adaption. Our script was much truer to the book and the tunes which we had composed for the songs were far more melodious than the ones in the movie. I also think we did a better portrayal of the elves. As I watched the movie I found myself wondering several things, Why were ther stars orbiting Elrond's head and why did he have a goatee? (I played Elrond in our play and so I'm a bit touchy about bad prtrayals of him now.) But the movie really wasn't all that bad till it got to mirkwood and we discovered that someone had done away with the wood elves and placed a bunch of blue goblinesque, furwearing things in their part. I didn't really like how they did smaug either but thats probably because we had played smaug as female and I was used to hearing female voices (mine included) in that part of the story. Anyway, that's my little spiel on the subject. Bye. __________________ "5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE. -Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi

08-04-2002, 10:50 AM	#72
webwizard333 Elf Lord Join Date: May 2001 Location: myob Posts: 587	I don't think I've ever seen the animated Hobbit, though I did see (and instantly forget) the Bakshi version. It looks like its making a quick comeback with the new FotR movie's popularity, as it was in one of the cashier shelves noirmally reserved for new releases in my local Best Buy. I think I'll make a effort though to rent it from my library. __________________ Boo!

08-04-2002, 02:22 PM	#73
WiseWizard Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2002 Location: the darkest region of Mirkwood (and trust me, it's really dark) Posts: 331	I was also at the cast party for Hobbit with Willow Oran. I also agree completely with everything she said. There were, however, two things she didn't mention which truly disturbed me to the very seat of my soul. First, Gandalf. Everything about him. I played Gandalf, and it shamed me to watch his portrayal in the movie. What was up with that nose? I mean, really, no one, not even wizards, has that long of a nose. It looked like they had taken a drawing of a stick and attached it to his face! Though, I did think that it was quite cool that lightning followed him everywhere he went. Second, where were everyone's pants?!? I felt like I was being violated every time a man sat down and didn't cross his legs. Must get rid of bad image......thanks again, Willow! __________________ My motto: Heaven doesn't want me and hell's afraid I'll take over. ------------------------------------------------ "Upstage me and I'll crush your kneecaps!" ------------------------------------------------ "It's been a while since I've been 130." -Aaron Reichgott ------------------------------------------------ You know, the world's full of apathy...but I don't care. ------------------------------------------------ "I would've honked, but I might have hit you." -Janaki ------------------------------------------------ "If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have gone to college that year." -Lewis Black ------------------------------------------------ "I have one speed which varies according to my mood." -Kristy Pihl ------------------------------------------------ "When I get a fever, I can hear my mom's voice in my head. But she's alive, not dead, so it's not as exciting." -Anna Crandall ------------------------------------------------ "It doesn't matter what your body type is, as long as you're bloodthirsty." -Rachel Carlson ------------------------------------------------- "My mind is a whirling miasma." -Jeff E. ------------------------------------------------- "I think earth is the Alabama of the universe and we don't even know it." ------------------------------------------------- "You can't just apologize the laziness of my bunnies away." -Taylor S.B. ------------------------------------------------- I'm a sadistic massochist. I'm always happy.

08-04-2002, 03:32 PM	#74
Willow Oran Deus Ex Machina Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,951	Indeed, the missing pants were rather traumatizing. So was the way they had Bill the Pony get eaten by the squid thing in LOTR. And what was up with the battle of the random dots? We also had the animated RotK at the cast party but nobody wanted to watch it after the other two. The anmated movies are really quite painful to watch, especially if you've just finished performing a superior version. __________________ "5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE. -Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi

08-04-2002, 05:12 PM	#75
WiseWizard Elven Warrior Join Date: May 2002 Location: the darkest region of Mirkwood (and trust me, it's really dark) Posts: 331	NO, Bill is NOT dead! The tentacles were only reaching for him! He could've gotten away! Damn it, he could've gotten away! begins sobbing takes on Charlton Heston accent Damn them! Damn them all to hell! __________________ My motto: Heaven doesn't want me and hell's afraid I'll take over. ------------------------------------------------ "Upstage me and I'll crush your kneecaps!" ------------------------------------------------ "It's been a while since I've been 130." -Aaron Reichgott ------------------------------------------------ You know, the world's full of apathy...but I don't care. ------------------------------------------------ "I would've honked, but I might have hit you." -Janaki ------------------------------------------------ "If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have gone to college that year." -Lewis Black ------------------------------------------------ "I have one speed which varies according to my mood." -Kristy Pihl ------------------------------------------------ "When I get a fever, I can hear my mom's voice in my head. But she's alive, not dead, so it's not as exciting." -Anna Crandall ------------------------------------------------ "It doesn't matter what your body type is, as long as you're bloodthirsty." -Rachel Carlson ------------------------------------------------- "My mind is a whirling miasma." -Jeff E. ------------------------------------------------- "I think earth is the Alabama of the universe and we don't even know it." ------------------------------------------------- "You can't just apologize the laziness of my bunnies away." -Taylor S.B. ------------------------------------------------- I'm a sadistic massochist. I'm always happy.

08-05-2002, 02:12 PM	#76
Willow Oran Deus Ex Machina Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,951	The ponies in the Hobbit didn't get away though. They were eaten by those things that were supposedly goblins but looked more like overgrown walruses with fur and legs. __________________ "5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE. -Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi

08-06-2002, 02:16 PM	#77
Celandine Elven Warrior Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 168	i didn't see all of it but the parts i did were interesting...

08-08-2002, 02:52 PM	#78
Dolenloteiel I elenfea Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Somewhere in the chaos between the first and second ages! (Actually, CO) Posts: 556	I saw those movies as well. They were very dissapointing, and I nearly fell asleep. My sis kept me awake. __________________ "Middle Earth is a real place. And it is New Zealand." Sir Ian McKellan **************************** QUESTION AUTHORITY Ask me anything ************************** "I have not failed, I've only found 10,000 ways that won't work." -Thomas Edison ************************** Visit Tolkien RP Site! Need members, RP all three Ages! (UNDER CONSTRUCTION) http://elvellon.suddenlaunch2.com **************************** "Yay, I can hear the voices in my head again!

08-18-2002, 11:42 PM	#79
Diaxion Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 112	Well movie was my either second or third intro to Tolkien but of course the book was better. __________________ good day

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