Nazgul horses

Nilore · 10-26-2002, 02:34 PM

I'm puzzled about the "horses" that the ringwraiths ride on. In the film they seem to have teeth and i've never heard a horse make noises like there's!
Also, what are the winged Nazgul, I don't understand that properly either!

Please don't say I'm dumb because I don't know these things!!!
Afterall i'm asking for help!

Nilore

Fred Baggins · 10-26-2002, 02:40 PM

Tolkin never gave a very descriptive description of the Winged creatures the Nazgul ride when there horses are destroyed, that I know of anyway. They just rode dark winged creatures.

I don't understand your question about the horses though.

***Khamûl*** · 10-26-2002, 02:45 PM

Even though you mentioned the movie, I'm going to move this to the books forum since you are curious about the winged Nazgûl.

Urksnik the Sleek · 10-26-2002, 04:27 PM

As I understand it, the horses were just normal horses, bred in Mordor by the servants of Sauron, this is why they were able to be destroyed by the flood Elrond loosed at the ford of Rivendell.
As to the winged steed, there is a brief descriptive passage in RoTK which makes them seem almost prehistoric in appearance, sort of a cross between a dragon, a bird and a dinosaur, but even then, Tolkien states that nobody knew exactly what they were or where they came from.
Apart from Sauron himself presumably.

webwizard333 · 10-26-2002, 04:55 PM

Quote:

I'm puzzled about the "horses" that the ringwraiths ride on. In the film they seem to have teeth and i've never heard a horse make noises like there's! Also, what are the winged Nazgul, I don't understand that properly either!

The average horse does have teeth, and in the book the horses are normal except for being specially trained so that the Nazgul could ride them, as normal, untrained animals would run away in fear. I'm unable to explain sounds horses make. The winged Nazgul is just the name given to the Nazgul when they rode their flying steeds, which I visualize as pterdactyl-like. It's my personal theory that Tolkien meant they were wyvern.

bropous · 10-27-2002, 11:09 AM

The horses the Nazgul rode were stolen from the Rohirrim by Orc raiding-parties. They sought especially for the all-black horses, and of course the Rohirrim steeds were descended from a very old line of horses indeed.

As for the "winged steeds", just visualize a long-necked pteranodon or pterodactyl. Tolkien seems to intimate an almost prehistoric origin.

***Rían*** · 10-29-2002, 09:06 PM

Hi Nilore! I'm a "horse-person", and I can tell you that horses do indeed have teeth - in fact, I've been bitten by one!

Also, horses can make some strange sounds - all of the horse sounds on the movie I have heard from real horses, especially stallions (they make that 'screaming' noise). However, I think you're also thinking of the screaming-type noise that I would say the Ringwraiths are making - the sound that's a little more bird-like. That isn't a horse noise. Does anyone remember where the reference is in the book about how the wraiths sound? It's some bird-like screaming, I think, but I can't find the reference right now.

Claenoic · 11-01-2002, 06:43 PM

I believe it was somewhere between Buckland and Hobbiton, when Frodo, Sam, and Pippin were resting. They heard a long, high pitched scream, mixed with what seemed like words. It was a way for the Nazgul to communicate.

***Rían*** · 11-01-2002, 08:17 PM

Thanks, Claenoic, that helped narrow it down - and here it is:

Quote:

Ho! Ho! Ho! they began again louder. They stopped short suddenly. Frodo sprang to his feet. A long-drawn wail came down the wind, like the cry of some evil and lonely creature. It rose and fell, and ended on a high piercing note. Even as they sat and stood, as if suddenly frozen, it was answered by another cry, fainter and further off, but no less chilling to the blood.

Erawyn · 11-02-2002, 01:04 PM

Oh thats one of my favourite parts of the book! So creepy!
Anywho, i agree, i think most of the horse noises in the movie sounded pretty real.

***Rían*** · 11-02-2002, 05:20 PM

Stallions can make some really wild noises, can't they, Erawyn! (so temperamental!

)

Yes, that's a really creepy part - they're singing along, then that creepy wail .... *hides under covers*

Firekitten2006 · 11-02-2002, 05:35 PM

I'm into horses too and every sound the horses made in the movie were real sounds horses made. And yeah they do have teeth.

lol I know what youre talking about in the movie. That scene when frodo jumps onto the ferry after merry and pippen had just joined them, the horse and naz gul both start making sounds. I had to watch that part a couple of times because it does seem like its the horse making all of those sounds at once!

Agburanar · 11-04-2002, 11:31 AM

I was annoyed to see in the film that if you look closely the horses are actually brown and have cuts all over them for some reason. Peter Jackson really has to move on from unconvincing zombies sometime.

Having said this, John Howe who did the design for the film does draw some really good flying steeds. I hope they'll get featured as they are in the paintings. (He does, however, do quite a few drawings without including details mentioned in the book...)

Firekitten2006 · 11-04-2002, 08:25 PM

Yeah, i noticed too that when they do a close up on the hooves or the face the horses are brown. I think the cuts were probably makeup for effect tho. Like the red eyes

Agburanar · 11-05-2002, 05:14 AM

I like the horses having little versions of the eye of Sauron. Don't like the cuts though.

entss89 · 11-05-2002, 11:13 AM

to answer one of your ? of the winged nazgul, well lets just take a normal black rider and give it wings, thats pretty much how i see a winged nazgul. and also i believe they are much stronger then the normal ones.

bropous · 11-05-2002, 11:43 AM

QUOTE: "to answer one of your ? of the winged nazgul, well lets just take a normal black rider and give it wings, thats pretty much how i see a winged nazgul. and also i believe they are much stronger then the normal ones."

D'huh??

"normal ones"? "Black rider and give it wings"? The winged Nazgul are somehow pegasi spray-painted black?

I must be misreading this.

The MOUNTS which the Nine Nazgul used which "converted them into winged nazgul" were reptilian long-necked dinosaur looking things. The Nazgul RODE these creatures, they did not spout balrog wings and fly off. As for their strength as compared to the "normal ones", since they were BOTH the same thing, non-sequitur.

Maybe we need a new thread: "Do Nazgul gots wings?"

10-26-2002, 02:34 PM	#1
Nilore Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: I am every where and I am no where, I am everyone and I am no-one! HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Posts: 319	Nazgul horses I'm puzzled about the "horses" that the ringwraiths ride on. In the film they seem to have teeth and i've never heard a horse make noises like there's! Also, what are the winged Nazgul, I don't understand that properly either! Please don't say I'm dumb because I don't know these things!!! Afterall i'm asking for help! Nilore

10-26-2002, 02:40 PM	#2
Fred Baggins Belladona Gamgee of the night sky Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: second star to the right and straight on till morning. Posts: 1,783	Tolkin never gave a very descriptive description of the Winged creatures the Nazgul ride when there horses are destroyed, that I know of anyway. They just rode dark winged creatures. I don't understand your question about the horses though. __________________ Emperor Cusco: Lemme guess. We're about to go down a huge water-fall. Pacha:Yep. Cusco: Sharp rocks at the bottum? Pacha:Most likely. Cusco:Bring it on. ~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~` Yes, I'm female. Fred Baggins is my NICKNAME! ~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~` "The reason of the unreasonable treatment of my reason so enfeebles my reason, that with reason I complain of your beauty."~Don Quixote ~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~` "Once upon a time there was a magical land where it never rained. The End."~from the movie 'Holes' ~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~` ()_))_Crayola_))_>

10-26-2002, 02:45 PM	#3
*Khamûl* Slacker Warrior Admin Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,759	Even though you mentioned the movie, I'm going to move this to the books forum since you are curious about the winged Nazgûl. __________________ "If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you." Gandalf to Pippin Psalm 107:31

10-26-2002, 04:27 PM	#4
Urksnik the Sleek Hobbit Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: under the misty mountains Posts: 33	As I understand it, the horses were just normal horses, bred in Mordor by the servants of Sauron, this is why they were able to be destroyed by the flood Elrond loosed at the ford of Rivendell. As to the winged steed, there is a brief descriptive passage in RoTK which makes them seem almost prehistoric in appearance, sort of a cross between a dragon, a bird and a dinosaur, but even then, Tolkien states that nobody knew exactly what they were or where they came from. Apart from Sauron himself presumably. __________________ The world was fair, the mountains tall In Elder Days before the fall Of mighty kings in Nargothrond And Gondolin, who now beyond The Western Seas have passed away The world was fair in Durin's Day.

10-27-2002, 11:09 AM	#6
bropous EIDRIORCQWSDAKLMED DCWWTIWOATTOPWFIO Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Littleton, CO Posts: 1,176	The horses the Nazgul rode were stolen from the Rohirrim by Orc raiding-parties. They sought especially for the all-black horses, and of course the Rohirrim steeds were descended from a very old line of horses indeed. As for the "winged steeds", just visualize a long-necked pteranodon or pterodactyl. Tolkien seems to intimate an almost prehistoric origin. __________________ "...[The Lord of the Rings] is to exemplify most clearly a recurrent theme: the place in 'world politics' of the unforeseen and unforeseeable acts of will, and deeds of virtue of the apparently small, ungreat, fogotten in the places of the Wise and Great (good as well as evil). A moral of the whole (after the primary symbolism of the Ring, as the will to mere power, seeking to make itself objective by physical force and mechanism, and so also inevitably by lies) is the obvious one that without the high and noble the simple and vulgar is utterly mean; and without the simple and ordinary the noble and heroic is meaningless." Letters of JRR Tolkien, page 160.

10-29-2002, 09:06 PM	#7
*Rían* Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Not where I want to be ... Posts: 15,254	Hi Nilore! I'm a "horse-person", and I can tell you that horses do indeed have teeth - in fact, I've been bitten by one! Also, horses can make some strange sounds - all of the horse sounds on the movie I have heard from real horses, especially stallions (they make that 'screaming' noise). However, I think you're also thinking of the screaming-type noise that I would say the Ringwraiths are making - the sound that's a little more bird-like. That isn't a horse noise. Does anyone remember where the reference is in the book about how the wraiths sound? It's some bird-like screaming, I think, but I can't find the reference right now. __________________ . I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva!

11-01-2002, 06:43 PM	#8
Claenoic Queen of Prolonged, Unexplained Absences Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Texas. 'Nuff said. Posts: 556	I believe it was somewhere between Buckland and Hobbiton, when Frodo, Sam, and Pippin were resting. They heard a long, high pitched scream, mixed with what seemed like words. It was a way for the Nazgul to communicate. __________________ Very Biased Alternate Script (but it's funny!):Click here! FREAK RAIN!!!!!!!! O.o Queen of prolonged unexplained absences and long, loooong car rides. Well, hullo everyone. As you can see, I don't hang out here muchly anymore. There's a good reason for this. Y'see, I've been hanging out at a different chatboard called Cardboardia. So far, I've been havin' a blast. Not that I don't love the TLA, but the magic of Entmoot is lost on me. So, as soon as TLA ends, so will my existance here, probably. Who knows though? I might stay. Highly unlikely however. This is a good bye in advance, then. Unless you want to join me and my group of friends at Cardboardia. Cheers!

11-02-2002, 01:04 PM	#10
Erawyn Elven Warrior Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: america junior Posts: 320	Oh thats one of my favourite parts of the book! So creepy! Anywho, i agree, i think most of the horse noises in the movie sounded pretty real. __________________ peace never hurt anyone "Be not so bigoted to any custom as to worship it at the expense of Truth." Johann Georg von Zimmermann

11-02-2002, 05:20 PM	#11
*Rían* Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Not where I want to be ... Posts: 15,254	Stallions can make some really wild noises, can't they, Erawyn! (so temperamental! ) Yes, that's a really creepy part - they're singing along, then that creepy wail .... hides under covers __________________ . I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva!

11-02-2002, 05:35 PM	#12
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	horsey person too! lol I'm into horses too and every sound the horses made in the movie were real sounds horses made. And yeah they do have teeth. lol I know what youre talking about in the movie. That scene when frodo jumps onto the ferry after merry and pippen had just joined them, the horse and naz gul both start making sounds. I had to watch that part a couple of times because it does seem like its the horse making all of those sounds at once! __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

11-04-2002, 11:31 AM	#13
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	I was annoyed to see in the film that if you look closely the horses are actually brown and have cuts all over them for some reason. Peter Jackson really has to move on from unconvincing zombies sometime. Having said this, John Howe who did the design for the film does draw some really good flying steeds. I hope they'll get featured as they are in the paintings. (He does, however, do quite a few drawings without including details mentioned in the book...) __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

11-04-2002, 08:25 PM	#14
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	yuppers Yeah, i noticed too that when they do a close up on the hooves or the face the horses are brown. I think the cuts were probably makeup for effect tho. Like the red eyes __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

11-05-2002, 05:14 AM	#15
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	I like the horses having little versions of the eye of Sauron. Don't like the cuts though. __________________ I would wish, were it to any avail, that the LORD OF THE RINGS FILMS had never been wrought. ROLLING STOCK, WE'RE ROLLING STOCK!!

11-05-2002, 11:13 AM	#16
entss89 lord of the ents Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: nc Posts: 539	to answer one of your ? of the winged nazgul, well lets just take a normal black rider and give it wings, thats pretty much how i see a winged nazgul. and also i believe they are much stronger then the normal ones.

11-05-2002, 11:43 AM	#17
bropous EIDRIORCQWSDAKLMED DCWWTIWOATTOPWFIO Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Littleton, CO Posts: 1,176	QUOTE: "to answer one of your ? of the winged nazgul, well lets just take a normal black rider and give it wings, thats pretty much how i see a winged nazgul. and also i believe they are much stronger then the normal ones." D'huh?? "normal ones"? "Black rider and give it wings"? The winged Nazgul are somehow pegasi spray-painted black? I must be misreading this. The MOUNTS which the Nine Nazgul used which "converted them into winged nazgul" were reptilian long-necked dinosaur looking things. The Nazgul RODE these creatures, they did not spout balrog wings and fly off. As for their strength as compared to the "normal ones", since they were BOTH the same thing, non-sequitur. Maybe we need a new thread: "Do Nazgul gots wings?" __________________ "...[The Lord of the Rings] is to exemplify most clearly a recurrent theme: the place in 'world politics' of the unforeseen and unforeseeable acts of will, and deeds of virtue of the apparently small, ungreat, fogotten in the places of the Wise and Great (good as well as evil). A moral of the whole (after the primary symbolism of the Ring, as the will to mere power, seeking to make itself objective by physical force and mechanism, and so also inevitably by lies) is the obvious one that without the high and noble the simple and vulgar is utterly mean; and without the simple and ordinary the noble and heroic is meaningless." Letters of JRR Tolkien, page 160.

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