Arkenstone

Nerdanel · 07-13-2004, 07:16 PM

Well. I finished reading the Hobbit today. I liked it very much, and I've read through some of the threads in this forum, but I have found very little about the Arkenstone. That wonderful, strange diamond was one thing that got stuck in my head while reading the book.

Where does it come from? Is there some information about it in other Tolkien-books? What were it's powers?

The thing that came across my mind was that it'd be a silmaril.. Because of the shine it had and the powers. But I understand that that is a impossible and rather stupid thought, since one silmaril found it's place in the heart of the earth. I don't believe the dwarves digged that deep..

Count Comfect · 07-14-2004, 02:58 AM

Well, my (somewhat limited) understanding was that it was literally the heart of the mountain - they delved until (and past) the point where they were at the base of the mountain, and found the Arkenstone. And it is just the sort of solid embodiment of the glory of Erebor.

Haradrim · 08-18-2004, 09:33 AM

Well its not a silmaril. I always thought it was just a really cool insanely big gem that was found in the center of the lonely mountain and symbolized the hardwork of the dwarves.

***Earniel*** · 08-19-2004, 05:34 AM

Tolkien may have modelled the Arkenstone after the Silmarils, conciously or unconsiously. After all -at the time of publishing 'the Hobbit' - the Hobbitstory was still unattached to the tales of the 'Silmarillion'. Tolkien may have liked the theme of a powerful, shiny jewel that most people want to have very badly so that he used it in 'the Hobbit' too, without realising the stories would once be connected.

Haradrim · 08-19-2004, 10:49 PM

I may be incorrect but I thought the Arkenstone didnt have anything special about it except the fact that its a huge gem and that it can from the center of the mountain. If there was something magical about it but I dont think there was. But if I am wrong someone please correct me.

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-22-2004, 08:17 AM

No I don't think there was anything magical about it, it was just found at the heart of the mountain.

Haradrim · 08-22-2004, 08:24 AM

Thanks again for backing me up T.D.

can I call you T.D?

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-22-2004, 08:26 AM

Yeah sure.

Haradrim · 08-22-2004, 08:28 AM

cool and congradulation on 100!

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-22-2004, 08:29 AM

Thanks. Didn't realise.

Haradrim · 08-22-2004, 08:32 AM

no problem. Its these keen Haradrim eyes Ive got. I can spot it from a mile away. Someone had to say something about my number of posts before I even realized there was a counter.

elixir · 08-22-2004, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haradrim

I always thought it was just a really cool insanely big gem that was found in the center of the lonely mountain and symbolized the hardwork of the dwarves.

I agree. It was said somewhere that the dwarves used all their skills and knowledge to make the Arkenstone so beautiful. And so it could also kind of represent the dwarves of Erebor. I mean, they probably judged each other by their work (to some extent, at least). And the Arkenstone was a true sign of the glory of Erebor.

Haradrim · 08-23-2004, 07:43 PM

After reading through Appendix A (after the constant references to it) I found something that makes it seem like the Arkenstone was like a big good luck charm. It symbolized the height of THroins family and so it was a deep insult when Throin found otu Bilbo had given it to the men and elves.

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-28-2004, 02:33 PM

I always thought of the hieght of Thorins ancestors was the mithril and weapons but I can imagine the arkenstone being it.

Haradrim · 08-29-2004, 06:07 PM

Well that would have been the height of Moria which was true for Thorins family. I meant to say like their return to glory. THe Arkenstone symbolized Thorins families return to greatness.

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-30-2004, 03:09 AM

Alright I get what you mean now but Gloin said in LotR that they would never make armour and weapons like their forefathers and I thought that referred to Thror.

Haradrim · 08-30-2004, 03:12 AM

He did. He was referring to before him though. Erebor could never make Mithril rmor becasue they didnt have mithril. The Arkenstone was their greatest acheievment.

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-30-2004, 03:59 AM

Yes but I would still say that mithril showed the highest high that Thorins family had ever reached.

Haradrim · 08-30-2004, 04:15 AM

I know I am saying Arkenstrone was height of Erebor Mithril height of all time. See

Telcontar_Dunedain · 08-31-2004, 06:15 AM

I get what you mean now.

07-13-2004, 07:16 PM	#1
Nerdanel Spammer of the Happy Thread Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 3,512	Arkenstone Well. I finished reading the Hobbit today. I liked it very much, and I've read through some of the threads in this forum, but I have found very little about the Arkenstone. That wonderful, strange diamond was one thing that got stuck in my head while reading the book. Where does it come from? Is there some information about it in other Tolkien-books? What were it's powers? The thing that came across my mind was that it'd be a silmaril.. Because of the shine it had and the powers. But I understand that that is a impossible and rather stupid thought, since one silmaril found it's place in the heart of the earth. I don't believe the dwarves digged that deep.. __________________ "Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known. " - C. Sagan My (photography) website My Flickr page

07-14-2004, 02:58 AM	#2
Count Comfect Word Santa Claus Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 2,922	Well, my (somewhat limited) understanding was that it was literally the heart of the mountain - they delved until (and past) the point where they were at the base of the mountain, and found the Arkenstone. And it is just the sort of solid embodiment of the glory of Erebor. __________________ Sufficient to have stood, yet free to fall.

08-19-2004, 05:34 AM	#4
*Earniel* The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium) Posts: 14,363	Tolkien may have modelled the Arkenstone after the Silmarils, conciously or unconsiously. After all -at the time of publishing 'the Hobbit' - the Hobbitstory was still unattached to the tales of the 'Silmarillion'. Tolkien may have liked the theme of a powerful, shiny jewel that most people want to have very badly so that he used it in 'the Hobbit' too, without realising the stories would once be connected. __________________ We are not things.

08-19-2004, 10:49 PM	#5
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	I may be incorrect but I thought the Arkenstone didnt have anything special about it except the fact that its a huge gem and that it can from the center of the mountain. If there was something magical about it but I dont think there was. But if I am wrong someone please correct me. __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-22-2004, 08:17 AM	#6
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	No I don't think there was anything magical about it, it was just found at the heart of the mountain. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-18-2004, 09:33 AM	#3
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	Well its not a silmaril. I always thought it was just a really cool insanely big gem that was found in the center of the lonely mountain and symbolized the hardwork of the dwarves.

08-22-2004, 08:24 AM	#7
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	Thanks again for backing me up T.D. can I call you T.D? __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-22-2004, 08:26 AM	#8
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	Yeah sure. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-22-2004, 08:28 AM	#9
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	cool and congradulation on 100! __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-22-2004, 08:29 AM	#10
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	Thanks. Didn't realise. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-22-2004, 08:32 AM	#11
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	no problem. Its these keen Haradrim eyes Ive got. I can spot it from a mile away. Someone had to say something about my number of posts before I even realized there was a counter. __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-23-2004, 07:43 PM	#13
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	After reading through Appendix A (after the constant references to it) I found something that makes it seem like the Arkenstone was like a big good luck charm. It symbolized the height of THroins family and so it was a deep insult when Throin found otu Bilbo had given it to the men and elves. __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-28-2004, 02:33 PM	#14
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	I always thought of the hieght of Thorins ancestors was the mithril and weapons but I can imagine the arkenstone being it. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-29-2004, 06:07 PM	#15
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	Well that would have been the height of Moria which was true for Thorins family. I meant to say like their return to glory. THe Arkenstone symbolized Thorins families return to greatness. __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-30-2004, 03:09 AM	#16
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	Alright I get what you mean now but Gloin said in LotR that they would never make armour and weapons like their forefathers and I thought that referred to Thror. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-30-2004, 03:12 AM	#17
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	He did. He was referring to before him though. Erebor could never make Mithril rmor becasue they didnt have mithril. The Arkenstone was their greatest acheievment. __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-30-2004, 03:59 AM	#18
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	Yes but I would still say that mithril showed the highest high that Thorins family had ever reached. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

08-30-2004, 04:15 AM	#19
Haradrim The Official Court Jester of the Entmoot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Far Harad Posts: 1,006	I know I am saying Arkenstrone was height of Erebor Mithril height of all time. See __________________ A Bit More Grown Up This Time...

08-31-2004, 06:15 AM	#20
Telcontar_Dunedain Warrior of the House of Hador Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,651	I get what you mean now. __________________ Then Huor spoke and said: "Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and me a new star shall arise. Farewell!" The Silmarillion, Nirnaeth Arnoediad, Page 230

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