The Silmarillion films??? - Page 5

Varda · 02-02-2005, 03:09 AM

The Silmarillion contains some very esoteric kinds of history that upon my first impression 'read like the Bible' to put it delicately. Given the splicing and dicing of the basic trilogy and the public's subsequent lack of understanding (and subsequent reluctance to pick up the volumes themselves), is it even worth going through all the trouble to market and make available a book that most people wouldn't have read even if they knew what it was?

Durin1 · 02-02-2005, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Varda

The Silmarillion contains some very esoteric kinds of history that upon my first impression 'read like the Bible' to put it delicately. Given the splicing and dicing of the basic trilogy and the public's subsequent lack of understanding (and subsequent reluctance to pick up the volumes themselves), is it even worth going through all the trouble to market and make available a book that most people wouldn't have read even if they knew what it was?

That's true. The Sil is just too complicated a book to adapt convincingly into movie format, let alone acknowledging the fact that few people have ever read the book and it probably would not interest the general cinema going public..

ItalianLegolas · 02-02-2005, 03:45 PM

it could make a great mini-series though...

**Nurvingiel** · 02-02-2005, 04:03 PM

And by "mini" maybe you mean "super long"?

I actually think, in the hands of the most skilled, artistic and uncolrruptable director ever (does not yet exist) the Sil could be woven into a good mini-series.

brownjenkins · 02-02-2005, 04:20 PM

i think it would take someone like kubrick was to bring it across well... you'd have to take complete artistic license to make it enjoyable in film format... but it's a great genesis for an epic movie... concentrate on the major events in the book, then bring each out as it's own individual story... it could be done tastefully

an epic film like "lawrence of arabia" is a good example... much is left out from the book, but the key moments are included well enough that the right general theme comes off well

the first movie could be the story of fëanor... the second, beren and luthien and the third a juxtaposition of turin and tuor

EarthBound · 02-02-2005, 04:22 PM

Well, it would HAVE to be a mega-series, and yes, I'd see it. Wouldn't miss it. I mean, we've all said and heard that making LOTR was impossible...and some would say PJ has proved them right (couldn't resist). Yet, I've watched them a hundred times because other than the gratuitous 'tear running down the face' shot you see every other scene, it's fun to watch.

I say someone 'could' make the film, and it could be decent. The book 'should' and 'would' be better just like LOTR is.

ItalianLegolas · 02-02-2005, 04:26 PM

someone better make it... we have a small army at our finger-tips!!

Twista · 02-02-2005, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

And by "mini" maybe you mean "super long"?

I actually think, in the hands of the most skilled, artistic and uncolrruptable director ever (does not yet exist) the Sil could be woven into a good mini-series.

Mini series.... as on TV... not in my lifetime... television just makes it somewhat.. tacky? Dont you think?

ItalianLegolas · 02-02-2005, 04:42 PM

I guess, but it doesm't have to be on TV. They made Left Behind a mini-series, and I never saw that on TV.

Twista · 02-02-2005, 05:04 PM

Did you ever see it anywhere?

Did it even make to a distant cable channel? lol. Making projects like this are very risky... it either wins or looses.

Elemmírë · 02-02-2005, 06:27 PM

I think Twista's right... it's highly unlikely that something like the Silmarillion would be well adapted for TV... I can't help but remember how badly butchered LeGuin's Earthsea was...

I can't believe it would get the budget it would need either.

I'm curious to see if it could be done, though, either for TV or the theatres.

ItalianLegolas · 02-02-2005, 06:45 PM

maybe someone could do it in flash... now that I would see.

**Nurvingiel** · 02-02-2005, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twista

Mini series.... as on TV... not in my lifetime... television just makes it somewhat.. tacky? Dont you think?

Not if done right. But no director who could possibly do it justice exists, so it's a bit of a Moot point anyway.

Embladyne · 02-02-2005, 10:23 PM

I still would not like to see some director butcher the Silm, but something about the idea of seeing Tuor on screen....makes me almost want someone to attempt it.
Personally, I think the director would have to be Czech...or someone with experience in surrealist film...just my bias.
The stories are just so impossible to illustrate literally...that's why they are written down.

Willow Oran · 03-05-2005, 08:01 PM

While I agree that the Silmarillion does not and would not adapt easily and probably shouldn't be attempted I think that the prospect of doing so is a challenge that sooner or later someone is going to be unable to resist. I also think that it would be possible, it would take a huge budget, extreme amounts of talent and patience and a ton of artistic liscense but I think it could be done.

First of all, whoever films the Silmarillion would need to use material from the HoME, it is possible to reconcile the different versions into a coherent story and the frame story format from the Books of Lost Tales could work well to pull the main stories in the Silmarillion together.

Secondly, there are more than enough talented writers who are also purists to write a screenplay for a movie of the Silmarillion and while it wouldn't be straight from Tolkien, it would be from people who enjoy honoring his work by elaborating on the information he left us.

And then, it doesn't have to be a film of the Silmarillion. I think a film based on the Silmarillion would be more acceptable to fans in that it wouldn't be claiming to be perfectly accurate but could still do a passable job of spreading the stories to those who can't bring themselve to read the book, and that's really what the purpose of such a film would be.

The music would be a bit tricky though.

The Telcontarion · 06-19-2006, 08:05 PM

I have always thought that if it was going to be made, it would have to be a mini series, either on HBO or ABC, NBC etc.

Only way tomake it accurate and detailed, noskipping things as with LOTR where there was mention of Bombadil etc.

I five year long mini series.

Curubethion · 06-20-2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Telcontarion

I five year long mini series.

That's the one problem with trying to adapt the Sil. It's almost as long as LOTR, but there's not a lot of description and small action. It's only big action. There's at least 10x as many events in the Sil as in LOTR and the Hobbit combined, because Tolkien doesn't go into a lot of detailed description, etc.

The Telcontarion · 06-21-2006, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curubethion

That's the one problem with trying to adapt the Sil. It's almost as long as LOTR, but there's not a lot of description and small action. It's only big action. There's at least 10x as many events in the Sil as in LOTR and the Hobbit combined, because Tolkien doesn't go into a lot of detailed description, etc.

Exactly, though that actually allows for the writers to take alot of liberties without changing the story at all. Thus making new and fresh even to us leave by the word of Tolkien, our lord!!!

hectorberlioz · 09-25-2006, 06:18 PM

I say about two films....remember that a lot of it is narrative

Gwaimir Windgem · 09-25-2006, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

And by "mini" maybe you mean "super long"?

I actually think, in the hands of the most skilled, artistic and uncolrruptable director ever (does not yet exist) the Sil could be woven into a good mini-series.

I know; it's always funny to see a 12-hour miniseries.

Which brings me to my main question: Who here does NOT miss Black Breathalizer? *raises hand* The nerve to suggest such a thing!

02-02-2005, 03:09 AM	#81
Varda Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Carmel Valley, CA Posts: 146	Could the Silmarillion be Appreciated by a Wider Audience? The Silmarillion contains some very esoteric kinds of history that upon my first impression 'read like the Bible' to put it delicately. Given the splicing and dicing of the basic trilogy and the public's subsequent lack of understanding (and subsequent reluctance to pick up the volumes themselves), is it even worth going through all the trouble to market and make available a book that most people wouldn't have read even if they knew what it was? __________________ "Life's a journey, not a destination." --Steven Tyler, Aerosmith, Arwen's daddy MySpace

02-02-2005, 03:45 PM	#83
ItalianLegolas Tolkien-aholic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: somewhere in the solar system... more specifically NJ... Posts: 712	it could make a great mini-series though... __________________ What was lost is now found.

02-02-2005, 04:20 PM	#85
brownjenkins Advocatus Diaboli Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Reality Posts: 3,767	i think it would take someone like kubrick was to bring it across well... you'd have to take complete artistic license to make it enjoyable in film format... but it's a great genesis for an epic movie... concentrate on the major events in the book, then bring each out as it's own individual story... it could be done tastefully an epic film like "lawrence of arabia" is a good example... much is left out from the book, but the key moments are included well enough that the right general theme comes off well the first movie could be the story of fëanor... the second, beren and luthien and the third a juxtaposition of turin and tuor __________________ Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.

02-02-2005, 04:22 PM	#86
EarthBound Lady Tipple & Queen of Blessed Thistle Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: I've been told it's all in my head Posts: 916	Well, it would HAVE to be a mega-series, and yes, I'd see it. Wouldn't miss it. I mean, we've all said and heard that making LOTR was impossible...and some would say PJ has proved them right (couldn't resist). Yet, I've watched them a hundred times because other than the gratuitous 'tear running down the face' shot you see every other scene, it's fun to watch. I say someone 'could' make the film, and it could be decent. The book 'should' and 'would' be better just like LOTR is. __________________ Beer + Pizza = N'uff said Happy to be here The HACBR has been alerted to my postings…..Hobbits Against Constant Beer References Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. --Ben Franklin I want my Mooter T-Shirt!

02-02-2005, 04:26 PM	#87
ItalianLegolas Tolkien-aholic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: somewhere in the solar system... more specifically NJ... Posts: 712	someone better make it... we have a small army at our finger-tips!! __________________ What was lost is now found.

02-02-2005, 04:42 PM	#89
ItalianLegolas Tolkien-aholic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: somewhere in the solar system... more specifically NJ... Posts: 712	I guess, but it doesm't have to be on TV. They made Left Behind a mini-series, and I never saw that on TV. __________________ What was lost is now found.

02-02-2005, 05:04 PM	#90
Twista Orodruin's Flame Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Kananaskis, AB Posts: 1,194	Did you ever see it anywhere? Did it even make to a distant cable channel? lol. Making projects like this are very risky... it either wins or looses. __________________ Council of Entmoot - Foreign Affairs Minister - 2004-05 Visit the Ye Olde Avatar Shop and The New One Dont tell me what I cannot do Two men are on a Island, they both see a "monster", one sees a bright light, and the other sees a dark cloud My name bares no reference to the music artist.

02-02-2005, 06:27 PM	#91
Elemmírë avocatus diaboli Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Himring Posts: 1,582	I think Twista's right... it's highly unlikely that something like the Silmarillion would be well adapted for TV... I can't help but remember how badly butchered LeGuin's Earthsea was... I can't believe it would get the budget it would need either. I'm curious to see if it could be done, though, either for TV or the theatres. __________________ ~ I have heard the languages of apocalypse and now I shall embrace the silence ~ Neil Gaiman

02-02-2005, 06:45 PM	#92
ItalianLegolas Tolkien-aholic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: somewhere in the solar system... more specifically NJ... Posts: 712	maybe someone could do it in flash... now that I would see. __________________ What was lost is now found.

02-02-2005, 10:23 PM	#94
Embladyne Honourary Elitist Inklette Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: between the mountains and the sea Posts: 704	I still would not like to see some director butcher the Silm, but something about the idea of seeing Tuor on screen....makes me almost want someone to attempt it. Personally, I think the director would have to be Czech...or someone with experience in surrealist film...just my bias. The stories are just so impossible to illustrate literally...that's why they are written down. __________________ Even on the pinnacle of a palace a crow does not become an eagle. My DA page

03-05-2005, 08:01 PM	#95
Willow Oran Deus Ex Machina Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,951	While I agree that the Silmarillion does not and would not adapt easily and probably shouldn't be attempted I think that the prospect of doing so is a challenge that sooner or later someone is going to be unable to resist. I also think that it would be possible, it would take a huge budget, extreme amounts of talent and patience and a ton of artistic liscense but I think it could be done. First of all, whoever films the Silmarillion would need to use material from the HoME, it is possible to reconcile the different versions into a coherent story and the frame story format from the Books of Lost Tales could work well to pull the main stories in the Silmarillion together. Secondly, there are more than enough talented writers who are also purists to write a screenplay for a movie of the Silmarillion and while it wouldn't be straight from Tolkien, it would be from people who enjoy honoring his work by elaborating on the information he left us. And then, it doesn't have to be a film of the Silmarillion. I think a film based on the Silmarillion would be more acceptable to fans in that it wouldn't be claiming to be perfectly accurate but could still do a passable job of spreading the stories to those who can't bring themselve to read the book, and that's really what the purpose of such a film would be. The music would be a bit tricky though. __________________ "5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE. -Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi

06-19-2006, 08:05 PM	#96
The Telcontarion The one true King of the human race, direct descendant of Adam and heir to the kings of old. "You owe me your fealty." The Tar Minyaturion Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: By the shores of cuivinien Posts: 694	Definately a mini series!!! I have always thought that if it was going to be made, it would have to be a mini series, either on HBO or ABC, NBC etc. Only way tomake it accurate and detailed, noskipping things as with LOTR where there was mention of Bombadil etc. I five year long mini series. __________________ Proverbs 21:3 To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice. Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5 1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation... ...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity. Romans 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

09-25-2006, 06:18 PM	#99
hectorberlioz Master of Orchestration President Emeritus of Entmoot 2004-2008 Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Lost in the Opera House Posts: 9,328	I say about two films....remember that a lot of it is narrative __________________ ACALEWIA- President of Entmoot hectorberlioz- Vice President of Entmoot Acaly und Hektor fur Presidants fur EntMut fur life! Join the discussion at Entmoot Election 2010. "Stupidissimo!"~Toscanini The Da CINDY Code The Epic Poem Of The Balrog of Entmoot: Here ~NEW! ~ Thinking of summer vacation? AboutNewJersey.com - NJ Travel & Tourism Guide

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