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11-11-2002, 09:28 AM | #1 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: charlotte, n.c.
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With the demise of the North Kingdom the road became more or less forsaken, used mainly by dwarves traveling to their mines in the Blue Mts. As the road became forsaken, the businesses along it also became forsaken....Ask any proprietor; the three secrets of success are location, location, location.
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11-13-2002, 10:55 PM | #2 | |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Right here in between yesterday and tomorrow.
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So maybe there was enough traffic on the Road from the Breelanders to support an inn. (People from the Shire once rode out to Bree for a change of pace, why not people from Bree going out into the wild lands a safe distance for the same reason?) Too, such a location was good in terms of the westbound traffic on the road -- people would be getting short of everything, and longing for a taste of civilization, and yet not be able to get to Bree for one more night yet. Think of the prices the innkeeper could charge, way out there with no competition, the things they could sell, etc. There might not be as many people coming in as there would be in or closer to Bree, but what customers they got would be hungry, thirsty, and footsore, longing for some creature comforts and not in a mood to haggle. Maybe "Forsaken Inn" was just what the Butterburs of Bree called it, not liking the dent it caused in their own business. The owner might have called it something much more pleasant or personable; heck, maybe they just hung out a sign: "Clean restrooms" or even "restrooms." |
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11-17-2002, 11:25 PM | #3 |
Dúnedain Ranger of the North
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: The Ruins of Arnor
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Yes Keith K, like the forsaken stretches of Route 66 after the freeways were built.
I still have a vision of the place as one that seen better days.
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"I am an outlaw, I was born an outlaw's son. The highway is my legacy, on the highway I will run." |
11-18-2002, 12:32 AM | #4 | ||
Co-President of Entmoot
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All very interesting
Where is the Forsaken Inn in Tolkein's books? It sounds very interesting, I think I'd like to go have a pint there.
Snowdog, I'm very interested in your signature. Who said, "I was so much older then, I'm much younger than that now." ?
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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11-18-2002, 12:34 AM | #5 | |||
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Sorry to double post...
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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11-18-2002, 12:58 AM | #6 | |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
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11-18-2002, 01:20 AM | #7 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Nov 2002
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11-18-2002, 01:48 PM | #8 | ||
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Tolkein also develops the history of Middle-earth and of each character very extensively, which also subtly advances the plot.
Places like the Forsaken Inn (where ever it's mentioned) succeed in doing this. I think everything in a book advances the plot in some way, it just depends if it sends the plot in some pointless direction, or brings it closer to an interesting climax. Tolkein is never pointless and extremely subtle.
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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11-19-2002, 04:14 PM | #9 |
Long lost mooter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Florida
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It also helps to make ME a "larger" place than what the one episode encompasses. There are other people, elves, hobbits, dwarves, doing other things.
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11-28-2002, 02:22 AM | #10 | |
Dúnedain Ranger of the North
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: The Ruins of Arnor
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More like Eru-Forsaken Inn???
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"I am an outlaw, I was born an outlaw's son. The highway is my legacy, on the highway I will run." Last edited by Snowdog : 11-28-2002 at 02:24 AM. |
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08-15-2004, 12:43 PM | #11 | |||||
Sapling
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 10
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It may be that the Forsaken Inn was called 'forsaken' because noone (except perhaps the Rangers) went there, like Deadmen's Dike (former Fornost). But Dwarves used the East-West road a lot; they would naturally want shelter for the night. Thorin's company passed through a country with 'an inn or two' in Eriador during the Quest of Erebor in 2941; perhaps one of them was the Forsaken Inn. After all, in 1966 Tolkien was "greatly concerned to harmonise Bilbo's journey with the geography of The Lord of the Rings". It does not explicitly say that they visited it though, but it would perhaps be a natural place of rest for them (in Appendix A Thorin stayed at Bree for the night, presumably at an inn, maybe The Prancing Pony where the meeting with Gandalf took place, which led up to the Quest of Erebor; though this was later changed to take place at the road near Bree (see 'The Quest of Erebor')).
TH, 'Roast Mutton': Quote:
LR, 'A Knife in the Dark': Quote:
But since Aragorn says Quote:
The Sindar called themselves Eglath, the Forsaken People. Could it be that the Forsaken Inn was controlled by Sindar who were among those Sindar who went East from Lindon in the beginning of the Second Age? On another Tolkien board Michael Martinez also speculated that it was controlled by Avari, from the etymology of the word forsaken. It is sort of curious that Aragorn says Quote:
'The Disaster of the Gladden Fields', note 6 (Author's note): Quote:
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08-15-2004, 04:34 PM | #12 |
Swan-Knight of Dol Amroth
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: On the Bay of Belfalas
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I would suppose that Aragorn was unaware of that measurement, since it was so many years since the Gladden Fields, and much lore had been lost.
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"What song the Sirens sang, or what name Achilles assumed when he hid himself among women, though puzzling questions are not beyond conjecture." - Sir Thomas Browne, Urn Burial. |
04-21-2005, 04:47 PM | #13 |
Dúnedain Ranger of the North
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: The Ruins of Arnor
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Forsaken Inn
Good disertation Aphanuzîr. An old, ghosttownish image of the Inn I always had, little used but still viable. its heyday was most likely in the grander days of Arnor, which is speculation on my part.
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"I am an outlaw, I was born an outlaw's son. The highway is my legacy, on the highway I will run." |
04-21-2005, 08:54 PM | #14 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 455
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Everyone so far seems to have interpreted "Forsaken" as an adjective modifying "Inn." But what if it's a noun? That would make it essentially "The Inn for the Forsaken" AKA "The Forsaken Inn."
Not a bad name, really, to entice weary travelers in a deserted portion of Middle Earth who, by then, undoubtedly felt forsaken. |
04-22-2005, 01:55 AM | #15 | |||
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I was wondering about the name too Jon S. I like your idea. If the inn did date back to the good old days, before Fornost was called Deadman's Dike, I imagine the inn would have had a more cheerful name. Travellers wouldn't have been forsaken then, and neither would the inn.
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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