Tolkien in the Classroom

(A brief theory on why Tolkien is rarely taught in School)

I wrote a dissertation on Tolkien`s work when I was in my final year at High School. It was called something like "Possessiveness and the Nature of Evil in Tolkien`s Middle-Earth". I still have a copy in a box somewhere in my attic. Looking back almost 15 years later it was a piece of trite, poorly reasoned nonsense, but it got me an A for my CSYS (a Scottish qualification equivalent to the English `A` Level).

The reason I mention this is that my English Lit. teacher was dead against me choosing this as a topic and did all he could to persuade me to change to Shakespeare or Dickens. His objection was not that JRR`s books lacked literary merit, but that the invigilator marking my dissertation would view them as frivolous and mark my work accordingly.

I found the same attitude when I started an Eng. Lit. degree at Glasgow University. The staff there derided Tolkien (and fantasy in general) as being insignificant and unimportant. After my first year I was bored to death with Shakespeare and various turgid Victorian novelists who apparently represented the pinnacle of the English literary tradition. I switched to Medieval History and never regretted it.

There must be a reason for this attitude among so-called literary cognoscenti, since I find it difficult to comprehend how any intelligent person could fail to enjoy Tolkien's work, LOTR in particular. Though after my experiences of English teachers, both at school and at university, I think that perhaps intelligence is something that most of them have only a passing familiarity with.

LOTR is not a book which lends itself to the kind of mind-numbing analysis that `proper literature` is often subjected to. I think this is why so many critics have a low opinion of the book. With very few exceptions, critics lack the talent to write well themselves and therefore rely on their painstaking analysis of literary masterpieces to earn a crust. As JRR pointed out many times, LOTR is not an allegory in any way, shape or form. There is no deep, hidden meaning within those 1000+ pages. The sheer scope of the book and the power of his language are what makes it a great work. Tolkien`s intention was to capture and hold the reader`s imagination from start to finish, which he did magnificently.

I think that educators are generally of the opinion that if a book is not `clever`, or if it has little or no allegorical significance for the intended audience then it is unimportant. I think that is why LOTR does not appear on many school curricula.

(BTW, this is my first post to this forum. Sorry if I bored anyone.)

I despise literary study curricula in general. From fourth grade to ninth grade I was unrestricted by it, and it was blissful.

You see, what we had to do was read literature we wanted and write a certain biweekly quota of "responses" - that's right. Responses, not reports. Basically, we take the literature we study and formulate our own interpretation and analysis, not influenced in any way by the "right way to think about it" as is the case with a lot of English teachers and Shakespeare, where you get the Big Brother thought-control paradigm that there's only one way to interpret it. It's also a far more mature way of approaching literature than summarizing the plot to show comprehension and slapping an opinion on it.

I was always the top student in the field of literary responses... straight A+'s... I did six separate responses on LOTR the first time I read it, one for each book. I covered all sorts of themes - everything from the obvious ( Star Wars comparisons) to the broad (influences on modern society) to the nitty-gritty (well, there's lots of those).

Of course, that was nothing compared to the legendary moment when I took Mamie's dialogue in Gone With The Wind, which was full of onomatopeia based on negro dialect in the Old South, and ran it through a spellchecker... but enough about that.

WElcome Taimar.
Though Tolkien himself said there was no allegory in LOTR parts of his society and way of life inveriably slipped in. I believe the reason his books are not studied the way they should be in school is that they are Fantasy, which for a long time has been labled as an unimportant and rediculous genre. It is now making a comeback, but Tolkien's books are often viewed as old and out of date. If only the idiots would realize almost all fantasy is based on his brilliant works!!!

Actually... our entire modern perception of the fantasy genre has its roots in Tolkien's works... thanks to how they spread even further through everything from other literature to Dungeons & Dragons to computer games to about anything else you can think of.

agreed

Just wanted to say that the way you have studied books, IP, sounds like a great way. My biggest problem with literature in school is that it tends to take away the excitement of reading. Instead students get too focused on grades. So in an ironic way I´m glad Tolkien was never taught, he probably would have become boring ( and my literature teacher in grade school was really good at making reading boring ).

More on topic, I just remembered that fantasy is taught in the literature classes they offer at the university I go to. But since I won´t take any of those classes I don´t know how they teach it.

I encountered Hobbit while taking a children's literature class in the 60's. It was popular at that time to teach it in 7th and 8th grade. Haven't seen it in school curriculums for years.

side note: SUCCESS! i now have FOUR of my no-longer-uninitiated friends reading LotR!

i think LotR is ignored by the majority of teachers/curricula because some people just can't handle it - instead of churning out set answers from a textbook, readers have to actually READ & come to their own understanding of the book. Many times in english class, we'd be discussing the book or poem at hand & our teacher would say, "so what do you think about this?" and every time, someone in the class would ask back, "what's the right answer? what DOES it mean?" All through this year we were studying romantic poetry, all of which had the "set" answer but also had a lot of room for other answers. i was lucky - i had wonderful teachers all through high school who listened to the students & "their own answers" but also questioned our answers enough so that if we were wrong, we'd notice it for ourselves & not need to be told. (that is, for those of us with the courage/integrity to tell a teacher when we felt differently than the textbook). LotR is one of those works that has no planned purpose other than entertainment, but along the way makes so many wonderful points & observations that it's impossible NOT to see a point. not The Point, but a point. And at least among the students i've met, a book without one specific Point is too dangerous for the weak to speak up about.

this was very quiclky written, i hope it makes sense.

aryne *

Hi Everyone,

Sorry I am a little late with replies.


Arynetrek I also think people might miss the deep meaning/message of things like SW, LOTR by not being able to see past the special effects, fighting scenes, etc. Now of course special effects are great (I know I love them ) but they should only be second to the story. Thanks for your thoughts.


Andustar Many people won't pick up a book because they know that they will dislike it, without ever reading it. Oh well what can you do.


Taimar Welcome to the forum and you didn't bore me at all, I found your post very interesting. . I don't know why fantasy isn't taught, maybe it is thought to be silly? But LOTR is anything but silly and though it might not have much allegorical signifigance (though I think I see some), I think the fact that in it Tolkien creates a whole different time, languages, time-lines, races, etc is far beyond most books in signifigance.


Bilbo B That is sad. I will try to expose my little brother. I want him to be aware of the classics, such as the works by Tolkien.


Iron Parrot That is definetly an interesting way to be taught literature. Much better than the common book report or the essays on a given topic. I believe the best way to learn and appreciate literature is for the reader to analyse the book without being told what he should find. I hope one day I will have the chance to do it. mnaybe in college. There is more freedom there.

BTW I love GWTW




Darth Tater I agree with you about fantasy and about the symbolism in LOTR, maybe it wasn't meant to be there but I did see things in the books that reminded me of things in this lifetime. Tolkien's work is anything but simple thats for sure.


Luv Always,
Gat

"Tolkein calls man a "sub-creator", taking in the world before him and, in the image of his maker, is likewise creative; Only, his own unique rendition of creation is a reflection of all the many things from the "soup" of his own experience."

- The Tolkein Reader, as quoted from a
webpage that i can't remember

reading this, it just seems right that so many people see so many things in LotR when it wasn't written with any allegory or blatant symbolism.

and, someone else has been misspelling Tolkien's name in the same way i have - i noticed today that i've misspelled it for at least a year. and no one told me!

BTW, thanks gatito!

aryne *

I took a SCI-FI class in high-school (back in the 70's). The course was focused on three different books.

Dune, the Foundation trilogy, and Lord of the Rings. I had already read all of these books (LOTR more than 5 times already by then). The class was great.

Just because the books are "old", doesn't make them any less of a teaching tool. I wish more students were exposed to these types of books as youngsters. I read the Hobbit (and a bunch of other great books) aloud to my kids (the oldest was 10, youngest 4). We read a chapter every day and stopped for some great discussions along the way. Since then two of them have read LOTR. All of my kids (4) are voracious readers now and at least part of that is because they were shown that reading (and storytelling) can be fun and enlightening.

Don't complain about NOT having the classes available...
Consider making your home into an informal classroom (you don't have to tell the kids what you're doing).

Great story PTimmins, welcome to the board!

love the icons, BTW! Who did these?

if i ever have kids, they will definitely read (or be read) sci-fi & fantasy.

aryne *

Ave gatito!
Julianus hic(here).
What a GREAT place to find you. K'haylan, may the Eldar bless her, gave me the addy for this board. I can't remember how many times I've read The Hobbit and LOTR's in the past 30years.*lol* There isn't another story that makes me feel so good, even with the sadness in it.
Pax tecum,
(Peace be with you)
Julianus

I think that The Hobbit was read in 10th grade when I was in high school but I don't remember for sure because my class didn't read it(read heart of darkness instead--ho hum). But shoot! Folks jest don' thank us Southerners got good brains nohow! Iffen ye caint shoot it or drank beer whilst ye watch it, we got no use for it, doncha know?
Seriously, I do think that the reading level of many people, not just kids, is really sad. Especially in the US. No wonder folks say we are so stupid and backwards in that way.

Welcome Julianus to Entmoot. I hope you enjoy your stay.

Etherealunicorn....That sounded like my neighbors. *shudders*

Gratias tibi ago(Thank you), anduin,
I really don't know all that much Latin, but I like to play around with it on message boards.
You are classified as an Entwife. An interesting choice IMHO, and a hopeful one, if it means that the Ents and Entwives finally found each other.
Pax tecum,
(Peace be with you)
Julianus

By the way, it is off-subject now, but I love the graphic, Andustar. Very sharp!
Sorry, Anduin, it is kind of scary, isn't it :lol:

Opps...I misspelled your name in the welcome announcement, Julianus...sorry about that, I'll fix it. Anyhoo, Ben gave me that title, and the first time I saw it, I thought, "wow, an entwife was found." I couldn't have thought of a better title myself, being that I just got married about three weeks ago.

wow, a Latin speaker with us...

faciamus fumum, Julianus? :smokin:

vis tecum (MTFBWY)