Dear Moot- and other advice - Page 2

sisterandcousinandaunt · 01-17-2008, 06:57 PM

Well, one of the problems with 'open relationships" is that people aren't necessarily great at keeping their feelings and their intimate behavior separate. It's pretty easy to whisper endearments when everyone's sweaty.

But, a good general rule for interpersonal relationships is... if you know what you're feeling, you should share that. Because you can't build intimacy unless people are willing to be genuine with each other. So, if you know how you're feeling about this, he's kind of entitled, imo, to know about it.

I can't promise you you'll get a great reaction, I suspect he'll be defensive. Really, you're probably not treating anyone here with great fairness. Being "Second string", or "One of a set" or "part-time" is a rough place to be in, for anyone who actually wants a relationship.

BeardofPants · 01-17-2008, 11:48 PM

Hahahaha...

brownjenkins · 01-18-2008, 12:05 PM

I'd avoid steady dating period at that age. Play the field and have fun. That way, when you are ready to settle down later in life, you'll have all of that desire to experiment with others out of your system, as will your chosen mate, whoever that might be.

Not to say that longterm relationships that start young can't last, but I'd say the odds are very much against it.

**Mari** · 01-18-2008, 12:13 PM

You are in favor of playing around? I don't think I could do that. Not that I want that.

brownjenkins · 01-18-2008, 12:47 PM

I think it's a good idea to play around when you are young, if you have the desire to do so, but I respect those who don't agree with my opinion on it too. Experience is the best teacher.

From 15-25, hormones and emotions are all over the map, and I don't think that anyone can realistically make longterm commitments at that point in their life. You can get lucky and end up with a partner you will stay with, but not until later in your twenties, will you be able to actually bring some experience and judgement to the table that will make your choices easier and better.

When we are young, we are very selfish, and I mean this not as an insult, but as a statement of where ones mind is at. We are learning about ourselves and the world around us and our personal concerns often consume us so much that the idea of really considering someone else's is very difficult, if not impossible.

Once we learn to live with ourselves, which can take a good 25 years or so, we're in a much better position to make commitments to other people.

**Mari** · 01-18-2008, 01:04 PM

Hmm, not sure if I agree with you, but seen as that I'm still only 21 I guess I have no way of knowing. I'll get back to you on it in a few years.

sisterandcousinandaunt · 01-18-2008, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mari

Hmm, not sure if I agree with you, but seen as that I'm still only 21 I guess I have no way of knowing. I'll get back to you on it in a few years.

*whispers*Someone who says your emotions and hormones are all over the map between 15&25 just isn't talking to people in other age groups enough.

Emotions and hormones aren't a 10 year event.

brownjenkins · 01-18-2008, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mari

Hmm, not sure if I agree with you, but seen as that I'm still only 21 I guess I have no way of knowing. I'll get back to you on it in a few years.

I wouldn't have agreed with myself when I was 21 either.

brownjenkins · 01-18-2008, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sisterandcousinandaunt

Emotions and hormones aren't a 10 year event.

More like 70 or 80 years!

***Rían*** · 01-19-2008, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sisterandcousinandaunt

Okay. What do you think of a situation where one person is interested in committment, and the other is in more of a *ahem, pauses to consider the age of posters* "friends with benefits" stage.

LOL!

IMO, those types of benefits are very precious, and should only be given to those who are willing to make a life-long commitment

katya · 01-19-2008, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abby Normal

So, I'm an adult female who's boyfriend is away at college. We've been having *ahem* "relations" with other people to not be lonely, but we plan to stop once we can move in together.
This girl that my boyfriend has been seeing is nice (I've met her once) but my boyfriend has been telling her "I love you" and other such endearments. He tells me that I'll always come first, but he still does love her. They are like best friends.

Should I tell him that this is making me upset?

Haha I didn't realize this second page existed. Anyway, I would tell him. If you're both alright with the "relations" that's one thing but if it's making you upset that's different. I would be upset in that situation too.

I'm a little bit of an Abby Normal fan by the way.

**Mari** · 04-14-2008, 01:59 PM

Two questions:
1) I have been placed in the middle of a war by two people I sort of know. I didn't even know them all that well until they decided to break up and they dragged me into their nastiness. In fact, I don't even understand how I got dragged in in the first place!
Anyway, he was wrong in the past, she is wrong now, but though I try to make them understand that they need to grow up and either talk to eachother about it or ignore eachother, they won't knock it off. It almost seems as though they are enjoying it. And I'm still in the middle of it, getting hateful emails or IM's from one about the other or them telling me personal things about their relationship etc. that I really really don't want to hear. They don't seem to understand that it's something between the two of them and not my business. Ignoring them doesn't really work. When I got back yesterday, the woman immediately started again, hardly even asking how Turkey was. I blocked her now, but I still see her in classes. And him.
How can I tell them to act their age and leave me out of it in a clear but not too offensive manner? I still have to do projects with them, so it would be very awkward if we all started to hate each other...
The thing I might dislike most about this whole situation, is that they are both 28, have experience with working and "living in the real world" and are thus supposed to be more sensible and understanding then I am, but are acting like 16 year olds. (no offense to those who are either 28 or 16

)

Question 2) If an action is right, but the motivation isn't (ethically speaking) should one refrain from the action, or do it anyway because the result is good? Does this make a person bad?
And who is better, a person with the right motivation, but the wrong result, or a person with the wrong motivation, but the right result?
This in an interpersonal setting.

Life and people are confusing @_@

sisterandcousinandaunt · 04-14-2008, 03:13 PM

I'm all about behavior, myself. People may feed the hungry to for press, or community service credit, or whatever, still gets them fed. And I believe the experience of doing right action increases the amount of good in the world, which will (eventually) help people chose right action for right reasons, kwim?

As to the messy break-up...ugh.

Just keep repeating that you can't talk about it.

katya · 04-14-2008, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mari

Two questions:
1) ... It almost seems as though they are enjoying it....

True, most likely. *sigh* What Auntie said, and let them figure ^that out on their own.

Quote:

Question 2) If an action is right, but the motivation isn't (ethically speaking) should one refrain from the action, or do it anyway because the result is good? Does this make a person bad?
And who is better, a person with the right motivation, but the wrong result, or a person with the wrong motivation, but the right result?
This in an interpersonal setting.

Life and people are confusing @_@

In other words, does the end justify the means? (or the opposite of that, I guess) Well, I tend to like the person with the right motivation (namely, one who acts out of love) and a bad result than a person with the wrong motivation. If the right motivation person got a bad result, it was probably just bad luck and they didn't do anything wrong. They were probably trying to do good just as much as the wrong motivation person was and has just as good a chance of success. The wrong motivation person, on the other hand, gets good results, but I don't think that's any reason to applaud them personally, just the action itself. Either way, no matter why, I'm all for people doing things that help others and society (and themselves), but I'm going to like the person who does it out of love better than the other.

Nautipus · 04-14-2008, 03:25 PM

I'll have to agree with Sis on her point, Mari.

But about that whole situation: I was involved in something like that last year. I was very quick to give my opinion, which was: "LEAVE ME OUT OF THIS. I want no part of your drama and if either of you try to drag me back into this it'll earn you a swift kick to the teeth."

***Earniel*** · 04-14-2008, 03:33 PM

In the first situation, I think you should consider to try and make them see that you do not want to be involved. I once was in a similar situation and get rather fed up with it as well. Finally, each time one brought up the subject to me, I'd put my hands up and say "whoa now, that's not my business. I'd like to stay out of it, thank you very much." in a joking manner. And then I obviously changed the subject.

**Mari** · 04-14-2008, 03:34 PM

Hmm, thanks for the replies guys.
The second question is just something that I've been asking myself for a while now, but the first... ARGH!
I wish I had stopped it earlier, but I thought they could both use a little help in seeing why they ever liked each other. There is no way IMO that you can go from loving each other to the extent that you are living together to absolutely hating each other. That would be denying the feelings you once had and thus denying who you once were. *sigh* Oh well, I got myself into this mess, I'll have to get myself out of it now too. >_<
Thanks again!

EDIT: Hmm, I might be able to pull that one off Eärniel. Though I'd love to one day be able to tell people I'll kick their teeth out if they don't stop fighting, like Nautipus

Perhaps if they get me angry enough...

katya · 04-14-2008, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mari

There is no way IMO that you can go from loving each other to the extent that you are living together to absolutely hating each other. That would be denying the feelings you once had and thus denying who you once were.

Maybe you can go from loving the idea of the other person, or who you thought they were, to the extent that you are living together or whatever to hatred. Or at least indifference. At least, for my sake I hope that's true. (I'm the new gf that came after all that...) I have to admit though, you're probably right somewhat. I think a lot of the hate is probably just hurt. Someone can't hurt you enough to make you hate them unless you cared about them a lot in the first place.

***Earniel*** · 04-14-2008, 03:39 PM

Well, Nautipus' solution might work quicker though I can't garantuee you'll be having any teeth left afterwards.

**Mari** · 04-14-2008, 03:41 PM

I don't think it'll leave me with very good grades for our group projects either

01-17-2008, 06:57 PM	#21
sisterandcousinandaunt Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 4,535	Well, one of the problems with 'open relationships" is that people aren't necessarily great at keeping their feelings and their intimate behavior separate. It's pretty easy to whisper endearments when everyone's sweaty. But, a good general rule for interpersonal relationships is... if you know what you're feeling, you should share that. Because you can't build intimacy unless people are willing to be genuine with each other. So, if you know how you're feeling about this, he's kind of entitled, imo, to know about it. I can't promise you you'll get a great reaction, I suspect he'll be defensive. Really, you're probably not treating anyone here with great fairness. Being "Second string", or "One of a set" or "part-time" is a rough place to be in, for anyone who actually wants a relationship. __________________ That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May

01-17-2008, 11:48 PM	#22
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Hahahaha... __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

01-18-2008, 12:05 PM	#23
brownjenkins Advocatus Diaboli Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Reality Posts: 3,767	I'd avoid steady dating period at that age. Play the field and have fun. That way, when you are ready to settle down later in life, you'll have all of that desire to experiment with others out of your system, as will your chosen mate, whoever that might be. Not to say that longterm relationships that start young can't last, but I'd say the odds are very much against it. __________________ Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.

01-18-2008, 12:13 PM	#24
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	You are in favor of playing around? I don't think I could do that. Not that I want that. __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"...

01-18-2008, 12:47 PM	#25
brownjenkins Advocatus Diaboli Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Reality Posts: 3,767	I think it's a good idea to play around when you are young, if you have the desire to do so, but I respect those who don't agree with my opinion on it too. Experience is the best teacher. From 15-25, hormones and emotions are all over the map, and I don't think that anyone can realistically make longterm commitments at that point in their life. You can get lucky and end up with a partner you will stay with, but not until later in your twenties, will you be able to actually bring some experience and judgement to the table that will make your choices easier and better. When we are young, we are very selfish, and I mean this not as an insult, but as a statement of where ones mind is at. We are learning about ourselves and the world around us and our personal concerns often consume us so much that the idea of really considering someone else's is very difficult, if not impossible. Once we learn to live with ourselves, which can take a good 25 years or so, we're in a much better position to make commitments to other people. __________________ Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.

01-18-2008, 01:04 PM	#26
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	Hmm, not sure if I agree with you, but seen as that I'm still only 21 I guess I have no way of knowing. I'll get back to you on it in a few years. __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"...

04-14-2008, 01:59 PM	#32
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	Two questions: 1) I have been placed in the middle of a war by two people I sort of know. I didn't even know them all that well until they decided to break up and they dragged me into their nastiness. In fact, I don't even understand how I got dragged in in the first place! Anyway, he was wrong in the past, she is wrong now, but though I try to make them understand that they need to grow up and either talk to eachother about it or ignore eachother, they won't knock it off. It almost seems as though they are enjoying it. And I'm still in the middle of it, getting hateful emails or IM's from one about the other or them telling me personal things about their relationship etc. that I really really don't want to hear. They don't seem to understand that it's something between the two of them and not my business. Ignoring them doesn't really work. When I got back yesterday, the woman immediately started again, hardly even asking how Turkey was. I blocked her now, but I still see her in classes. And him. How can I tell them to act their age and leave me out of it in a clear but not too offensive manner? I still have to do projects with them, so it would be very awkward if we all started to hate each other... The thing I might dislike most about this whole situation, is that they are both 28, have experience with working and "living in the real world" and are thus supposed to be more sensible and understanding then I am, but are acting like 16 year olds. (no offense to those who are either 28 or 16 ) Question 2) If an action is right, but the motivation isn't (ethically speaking) should one refrain from the action, or do it anyway because the result is good? Does this make a person bad? And who is better, a person with the right motivation, but the wrong result, or a person with the wrong motivation, but the right result? This in an interpersonal setting. Life and people are confusing @_@ __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"...

04-14-2008, 03:13 PM	#33
sisterandcousinandaunt Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 4,535	I'm all about behavior, myself. People may feed the hungry to for press, or community service credit, or whatever, still gets them fed. And I believe the experience of doing right action increases the amount of good in the world, which will (eventually) help people chose right action for right reasons, kwim? As to the messy break-up...ugh. Just keep repeating that you can't talk about it. __________________ That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May

04-14-2008, 03:25 PM	#35
Nautipus Kraken King Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Under the sea Posts: 2,714	I'll have to agree with Sis on her point, Mari. But about that whole situation: I was involved in something like that last year. I was very quick to give my opinion, which was: "LEAVE ME OUT OF THIS. I want no part of your drama and if either of you try to drag me back into this it'll earn you a swift kick to the teeth." __________________ Being the King of these Beings, This is my Child One of my top ten favorite movies. "You ever try to flick a fly? "No." "It's a waste of time." "Can you see it?" "No." "It's right there!" "Where? "There!" "What is it?" "A crab." "A crab? I dont see any crab." "How?! It's right there!!" "Where?" "There!!!!" "Oh." -Excerpts from A Tale of Two Morons One of the best Global Warming Messages out there

04-14-2008, 03:33 PM	#36
*Earniel* The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium) Posts: 14,363	In the first situation, I think you should consider to try and make them see that you do not want to be involved. I once was in a similar situation and get rather fed up with it as well. Finally, each time one brought up the subject to me, I'd put my hands up and say "whoa now, that's not my business. I'd like to stay out of it, thank you very much." in a joking manner. And then I obviously changed the subject. __________________ We are not things.

04-14-2008, 03:34 PM	#37
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	Hmm, thanks for the replies guys. The second question is just something that I've been asking myself for a while now, but the first... ARGH! I wish I had stopped it earlier, but I thought they could both use a little help in seeing why they ever liked each other. There is no way IMO that you can go from loving each other to the extent that you are living together to absolutely hating each other. That would be denying the feelings you once had and thus denying who you once were. sigh Oh well, I got myself into this mess, I'll have to get myself out of it now too. >_< Thanks again! EDIT: Hmm, I might be able to pull that one off Eärniel. Though I'd love to one day be able to tell people I'll kick their teeth out if they don't stop fighting, like Nautipus Perhaps if they get me angry enough... __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"... Last edited by Mari : 04-14-2008 at 03:36 PM.

04-14-2008, 03:39 PM	#39
*Earniel* The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium) Posts: 14,363	Well, Nautipus' solution might work quicker though I can't garantuee you'll be having any teeth left afterwards. __________________ We are not things.

04-14-2008, 03:41 PM	#40
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	I don't think it'll leave me with very good grades for our group projects either __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"...