Tolkien in the Classroom

i agree with what has been said about reading level and its importance for the development of intelligence and critic analysis.

And, since this thread is becoming a Dickens thread , i´ll say that i like the only books of him i´ve read Great Expectations and Oliver Twist. The stories aren´t perhaps that good, but i enjoyed a lot his depict of the characters, especially secondary characters. Very funny and original.

I´m not a fan of Dickens. I had to read David Copperfield for school during my last year in high school and I have to say I disliked it. Oliwer Twist is better as a story. I tend to like stories that are more like adventures so that is probably why I did not enjoy David Copperfield.

Gatito;

It seems that the education system has
this knack of dumbing down the curriculum,
especially at the primary levels, to appeal
to the lowest common denominator.

The resources of many schools are spent in
the struggle to teach ESL children, and it
seems those who are gifted are often left
to their own resources.

You are right, the movie will motivate a whole
new generation of fans for Tolkien. But I wonder
if it will also spawn (shudder) those abridged
'children's version' summary books.

K'haylan

From the IronParrot's English Dictionary, Third Edition:

junior novelization n. 1) a) a blatant butchery of a work of literature or other fictional material of any medium; an authorized horse-turd of an abridgement. b) see blasphemy.

Fat Middle I agree with you about Dickens Characters, very descriptive and important to the plot of the story. I also think Tolkien's characters are extremely well written.


K'haylan Thanks for the reply . Sadly I do think as soon as the movie comes out we will see those ten page picture books (along with other LOTR merchandise, they already have action figures) hopefully the parents will encourage their kids to read the real and complete version.


Iron Parrot LoL yep I agree, if by any chance the books are too hard for the kids they should wait until they are able to read the real version. I would be afraid that as soon as they would read an abridged work they wouldn't even try the real thing. They certainly would miss out on a lot.


Luv Always,
Gatito

Gatito;

I wonder what the copyright laws are on
the Coles Notesy books. Or whether this
falls under the broad spectrum of
'merchandising' when the rights were
negotiated to the movie?

But hey, the little action figures sound
good. I'll set them up with Han, Yoda,
Chewie, and Boba Fett, lol!!

K'haylan

IronParrot;

Cool dictionary!

But yup...sounds just like what we will
see in bookstores everywhere!

K'haylan

K'haylan I think that as long as the "shortened" books are based on the motion picture and not the book itself the publisher will have full copyright privilege. I just hope whoever decides to pick up the fake version will have the chance to read the real thing as well. Or who knows maybe the producers of the movie will feel there is no need to make a shortened book based on the movie, though I won't hold my breath when there is money involved.
As for the action figures I don't really collect them but I might just have to get a Gandalf one (I like wizards. ) I wonder if we will see LOTR happy meals <g>


Luv Always,
gatito

There was abridged from-the-film novelization for the film Gone With The Wind.
Or Doctor Zhivago.
Or The Godfather.
Or The Bridge on the River Kwai.
Or L.A. Confidential.

What do those films-from-novels all have in common? They weren't targeted at the youth market. So if those marketing guys manage to get their act together properly, there will be no novelization.

Of course, what we could do is start a petition right here, right now, campaigning for NO abridgment of the novel based on the film's liberties.

Gatito;

...."LoTR Happy Meals"...

Lol!!!! :lol:

Oh yes, I can smell 'marketing' all
over this one. You just have to take
one look at the Harry Potter juggernault
to see what is going to happen!

K'haylan

IronParrot;

Petition? Sign me up!!

Definately NO abridgement of the
original novel. I get shudders even
thinking of the dumbed-down version.

K'haylan

If anyone here can put together a petition Entmoot will stand behind it all the way, even advertise it in the announcements.

A petition sounds good to me. How bout a "Save Literature campaign" No messing with the classics!!!!!!!!!!!


Luv Always,
Gat

if there's a petition going around to keep LotR "pure" & keep awa all abridgiation (is that a word?) i will gladly sign it.

and the thought of LotR happy meals is just repulsive to me - kids badgering their parents in the food lines, "mommy! mommy! they have the aragorn doll this week! i want one, mommy!" & then playign with the LotR toys (i'm sorry, "Action Figures) in that violent way that most little kids play - banging them against a hard surface until either the toy gets taken away, the doll's head & arms fall off from abuse, or the kid accidentally throws it out a car window or something. happy meals are aimed at little kids who more than likely would only see the spectacle, & not the deeper meanings behind teh book/movie - the same way star wars sometimes gets written off. i meet people who love star wars, because of the flashy lights & death stars & lightsaber duels; & don't seem to realize there's more to the movies than that (my personal opinion: star wars is george lucas' attempt at mixing an old "hero & honor" epic & a cautionary tale. luke learns to become powerful, wise, etc.; but power & wisdom aren't immunity from evil. luke has to save his father by following in his footsteps up to the point where his father betrayed teh jedi, but luke cannot afford to fail.) spectacle has its place, esp. in a movie like star wars or what LotR will probably be adapted into, but it's not all there is, & a lot of times people miss that.

which may have something to do with the main thread here (see? i did have a point.) - people aren't being taught to love literature. i just graduated from a rich-little-bitch-girls' catholic highschool, & people there JUST DON'T READ. i honestly don't knwo whether they were never taught to love reading, whether they just weren't exposed to the right books, or what, but a lot of people JUST DON'T READ. in my sophomore year honors english class, we read beowulf (much to the dismay of most of the class - but i loved it) & at one point i compared beowulf to LotR. the reaction from the classmates:
- "you read all of lord of the rings? that book is so long!"
- "how long did it take you to read all that?"
the teacher, who must have been really bored that day because he actually kept talkign about this comparison, asked if anyone else in teh class had read LotR & for opinions on it vs. beowulf. out of 20 girls, 2 of us had read it. and this was an honors class in the second best school in dallas - these girls were all 15, 16, & 17. 2 years later, in senior year english (british lit), i asked my teacher if we would get around to the 20th century & LotR. he said no, because it would take too long & most people in the class wouldn't get into it. i don't really blame him for not introducing it, because that class (this was regulars, btw) just didn't get even the main, obvious ideas in easy-to-follow books. really, how hard is it to understand wuthering heights? or animal farm? (not that i'm knocking those books - i really liked them both). i ended up doing a research paper on LotR just to get my tolkien fix, but doing a half-assed job because it was at the same time i was doign college applications.

i know stuff like this doesn't happen only in my isolated corner of the scholastic world - people aren't reading anymore, & personally i think they're missign out on a lot. i guess i was lucky, i learned to read before i was in preschool, but with all the visuals & spectacle out there people aren't paying attention to what's underneath it all. i don't think it's that people aren't capable of it or of understanding it, i think they don't want to put forth teh effort. also, there's a trend among younger girls (at least in dallas) to "dumb down" to be more socially acceptable that's probably responsible for most of my classmates not reading good books.

personally i think tolkien's books, & all good sci/fi/fantasy, are very truthful & very applicable - you just have to see past the weird names & alien races to see that truth, & that's not even hard. anyone who's read & enjoyed ender's game will especially see this truth & applicability. the excuse that "fantasy is pure escapism, therefore it doesn't matter" is in my opinion just that: an excuse. besides, how much can we learn from studying our dreams? (hopes as well as the REM-sleep kind) but that brings up another string of commentary: people are ignoring the need for play, & hope, & stories, & the occasional escapism.

in 4 years of high school, i heard Tolkein's name mentioned once by a teacher who i hadn't provoked, & that was in a theology class in connection to CS Lewis.

(it's now 3:50 AM dallas time - writing this post alone has kept me awake for another half-hour!)

aryne *

PS - i heard the other day that there's been a book version of the movie what dreams may come that came out about 2 years ago, starred robin williams, & then disappeared quickly. that's one of my favorite movies - has anyone else seen it or heard about this book? email arynetrek@yahoo.com if you don't want to continue this in this thread.

Wow, quite a post!!! Quite frankly I think the human race, especially Americans, is stoopid. That may sound extreme, but think about it. Sports (though I have nothing against them) are held on a higher pedestal than art and literature. Why? Cause people don't care, or think they're not supposed to. In my opinion this is stoopidity.

Agreed Tater, but perhaps in general you ought to spend more time in spelling class (hehehe )

People really need to read a lot more, but I guess the only good thing is that we'll get into better colleges than them

Btw, arynetrek, this ezboard doesn't support HTML so you'll have to use ezcodes.

not all americans are stupid (stoopid?) - about 99.99999999999999999999999999999999% of us are, though.

i just don't see the point in this sports obsession - they're fun to play (anarchy soccer!) but i dont' see how someone can spend hours on end watching someone else play a game (or several games).

btw - darth tater, where are you from?

and thanks bmilder for the code info!

He's from Camelot.

:lol:
Boston, where stoopidity (the spelling is inspired by SWMCMMJ. Good for you if you don't know what that means.) is a given.

out of the 31 ppl in my class, 3 have read lotr, most have never heard of Tolkien

nearly all hate reading. to quote, 'how can you just sit there with a book like that??? its so BOORING!' 'i tried the Hobbit once, but i couldn't get into it, it was so pointless' and all that sort of stuff...

quite a few like horror stories, which i think are even more pointless than they thought the Hobbit was

and don't start thinking that this is typical for an English school. this is much much better than most. i come from a very selective school (almost anyone who lives in London has heard of Henrietta Barnett, it is the school that last year was called the most difficult state school to get into) and one of the exams is, of course, English. everyone in my class is intelligent and all that, but...
not many readers

i think its horrible myself. but if they find enjoyment in other things and don't want to try my way, let them! they don't know what theyre missing