02-07-2002, 03:07 AM | #21 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: California
Posts: 60,865
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Saruman most certainly did not start any snow-storm in the book. That's just the movie. The starter of the blizzard was a spirit, a mysterious spirit long known to the Dwarves who Aragorn supposes may have been in the world longer than Sauron. If you haven't read the books in a while, I'd take the movie with a grain of salt as far as accordance with the book goes. Many people now think that the Uruk-hai were the Half-orcs, for example.
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Falmon -- Dylan |
02-07-2002, 09:51 AM | #22 | |||
Peer of the realm of Sanguine
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Hill, Marlton, NJ
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Ahem, begging your pardon Mr. Ñólendil,
I have reread the chapter. Very recently. Pardon me for getting off the thread but there is no definitive reason given behind the snowstorm in LOTR. Below are quotes from all references to the suspected origin of the storm in LOTR Book II Chap. 3 "The Ring Goes South" Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Boromir thinks it's Sauron, Aragorn is non-committal, Gandalf agrees somwhat with Boromir:"His arm has grown long." In addition, consider the following quote from Gandalf prior to the Fellowship ascending the pass: “From signs that we have seen lately,' said Gandalf, 'I fear that the Redhorn Gate may be watched; and also I have doubts of the weather that is coming up behind. Snow may come. We must go with all the speed that we can.” So Gandalf knows what's coming. He also may have an idea as to who started it, but he's not saying. That leaves the origin of the snowstorm up to interpretation, unless you can point to some other reference of which I am not aware. (I did say afterall it was an unoriginal crackpot theory). I do agree with you that it is unwise to confuse the movie with the book. PJ took a bit too much license, but in this case he stayed within the gray area. RE The Balrog's allegiance with Sauron: I agree with bropous.
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“"I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ringwinner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider," Fear Complacency! ___________________ Something under the bed is drooling |
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02-07-2002, 05:57 PM | #23 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: California
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I don't agree that Aragorn was 'non-committal'. It seems plain to me that Aragorn supposed the spirit was a spirit who had been in the world longer than Sauron and was not in league with him. Gimli's people have known of the spirit of Caradhras for some while. I don't see how it could possibly be Sauron. "A mysterious spirit long known to the Dwarves who Aragorn supposes may have been in the world longer than Sauron" is not really a definitive reason in my eyes, in that the spirit is mysterious and we have no idea what it really is. It is a spirit and it's obviously mysterious, and Aragorn does suppose it may have been in the world longer than Sauron. So I stand by my post.
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Falmon -- Dylan |
02-07-2002, 09:05 PM | #24 |
Peer of the realm of Sanguine
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Location: The Hill, Marlton, NJ
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I still don't see a definitive answer, no matter how many times I read the text, and I will not discuss it further as I started off on a tangent anyway. We will agree to disagree. This might be a good topic for a new thread, eh?
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“"I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ringwinner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider," Fear Complacency! ___________________ Something under the bed is drooling Last edited by barrelrider110 : 02-07-2002 at 09:07 PM. |
02-26-2009, 06:00 AM | #25 |
Hobbit
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Nashua, New Hampshire
Posts: 48
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Seeing as I am a balrog I am trying to go around clearing up myths about us. Here is a perfect opportunity. Need I explain that in the Silmarillion there is no reference to a balrog being under the command of Sauron? Sauron and Gothmog are equally important, just in different aspects. Sauron was in charge of the werewolves and the torture and fear aspect. To my knowledge he never leads an army while Morgoth is around. Gothmog does all that until he's killed. After which I can't remember any references to balrogs except their flight from the Valar's wrath when Morgoth is chained for the second time. We don't need some candy offering sweet tooth Sauron who goes off covorting with elves and men to help us maim kill and destroy. We're rather skilled at that. And if given the chance, I'm sure my daddy in charge of Moria would have built up an army and told off Sauron, making him serve. I would find a balrog a lot scarier than Sauron to be honest. What if the balrog had gotten the ring? So yes, I think Sauron knew all about daddy balrog in Moria. That's part of why he was so desperate to get the ring. Daddy balrog was building his army in Moria, having taken over management of the orcs and trolls Sauron sent.
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02-26-2009, 08:12 PM | #26 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: New York State
Posts: 309
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re: "Seeing as I am a balrog..."
I hope that you and Daddy Balrog aren't offended, but please don't expect too many of us to show up at any of your family reunions, birthday parties, or New Years Eve or Superbowl get-togethers, etc.
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FRODO LIVES!! (sung to the tune of "My Boyfriend's Back") Now, Gandalf's back, and you're gonna be in trouble (Hey-la, hey-la---Now, Gandalf's back) Soon, Barad-dur is gonna be a pile of rubble (Hey-la, hey-la---Now, Gandalf's back) |
02-27-2009, 05:52 AM | #27 |
Hobbit
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Nashua, New Hampshire
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No worries. Ever since stupid old Gandalf decided to smash him to pieces I haven't been very social.
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