feanor a villian - Page 10

Ñólendil · 08-17-2002, 03:34 AM

I think so. Definitely wicked. Selfish, prideful, bitter, malicious, fell, fey and corrupt.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-17-2002, 03:46 AM

I wouldn't agree to evil and corrupt. But I should look up the definitions of the words. To me evil would imply having motives besides being far too prideful, selfish and bitter. And he did have good cause for his bitterness. And pride...I mean, he did make the Silmarils, after all...

afro-elf · 08-17-2002, 03:59 AM

Think if he had done his deeds to you. How would you feel?

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 04:03 AM

Were his actions of an evil nature? Undoubtedly. Look up the definition in the dictionary, and tell me you can't apply it to him. Remember the kinslaying, and the oath that he bound his children to. However, I don't think that he is a villain. Not in the true sense of the word. Now Morgoth was a villain. Saruman was a villain. Sauron was a villain. What did they have in common? Domination, and subjucation. Was this Feanors ambition? Not as far as I can see.

Blackheart · 08-17-2002, 04:09 AM

Err- yes. Feanor definatly had an urge to dominate. Remember the urge for power, and the desire for realms in middle earth?

It's a likely factor in the burning of the ships.

Villain. Evil.

Bang the gavel.

afro-elf · 08-17-2002, 04:11 AM

Are those the only criteria for a villian?

vil·lain Pronunciation Key (vln)
n.
A wicked or evil person; a scoundrel.
A dramatic or fictional character who is typically at odds with the hero.
(also vln, v-ln) Variant of villein.
Something said to be the cause of particular trouble or an evil: poverty, the villain in the increase of crime.
Obsolete. A peasant regarded as vile and brutish.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-17-2002, 04:13 AM

Okay...first definition, perhaps. Second? Definitely not.

afro-elf · 08-17-2002, 04:18 AM

BoP

Nice to see you fired up again.

Blackheart · 08-17-2002, 04:19 AM

Hey- isn't Melkor the hero?

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 04:23 AM

Right so it's settled then. Feanor. Evil. Eol. Misguided.

Eruviel Greenleaf · 08-17-2002, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeardofPants
Right so it's settled then. Feanor. Evil. Eol. Misguided.

I don't think it's settled...

Feanor. Evil. (fine, I agree. Maybe that's why I liked him...(see sig.

)) Eol. Evil.

afro-elf · 08-17-2002, 04:26 AM

They both would have serverd jail time.

Well, maybe not. If they were famous they probably would have gotten off.

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 04:58 AM

Well, it's not that simple.

Feanor is guilty of an evil action or two -- I don't necessarily think that this makes him an evil person.

And as far as I am concerned, comparing Feanor to Eol is like comparing apples and oranges.

Artanis · 08-17-2002, 02:11 PM

I think Feanor and Eol both became possessed. Feanor with his love for the Silmarils, Eol with his hate against the Noldor. Neither of them were in origin wicked.

Quote:

And as far as I am concerned, comparing Feanor to Eol is like comparing apples and oranges.

Why? They were both Elves. They both had their freedom to choose between good and evil actions.

***Sister Golden Hair*** · 08-17-2002, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeardofPants
Well, it's not that simple.

Feanor is guilty of an evil action or two -- I don't necessarily think that this makes him an evil person.

And as far as I am concerned, comparing Feanor to Eol is like comparing apples and oranges.

I have to agree with this. You know, neither one of these guys was Morgoth. Now that is evil.

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Artanis
Why? They were both Elves. They both had their freedom to choose between good and evil actions.

Lets see. How many people did Eol kill? And how many did Feanor kill? .... Oath? Kinslaying?

Artanis · 08-17-2002, 04:07 PM

Oh I see. I misunderstood.

I was thinking of logical comparativeness, you were thinking of the gravity of their evil actions.

But I agree with you and SGH. Feanor was responsible for evil deeds, but ne wasn't an evil person.

afro-elf · 08-17-2002, 04:11 PM

ARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BeardofPants · 08-17-2002, 04:13 PM

Yep, they're all coming over to the dark side, A-E.

Artanis · 08-17-2002, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf
ARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh, I love you when you're angry, A-E! Very cute!

08-17-2002, 03:34 AM	#181
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	I think so. Definitely wicked. Selfish, prideful, bitter, malicious, fell, fey and corrupt. __________________ Falmon -- Dylan

08-17-2002, 03:46 AM	#182
Eruviel Greenleaf Alcoholic Villain-Fancying Elf Pirate Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lyonesse Posts: 4,547	I wouldn't agree to evil and corrupt. But I should look up the definitions of the words. To me evil would imply having motives besides being far too prideful, selfish and bitter. And he did have good cause for his bitterness. And pride...I mean, he did make the Silmarils, after all... __________________ Eruviel Greenleaf in a past life. "Whoever has come to understand the world has found only a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." -The Gospel of Thomas SQUAWK!

08-17-2002, 03:59 AM	#183
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	Think if he had done his deeds to you. How would you feel? __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

08-17-2002, 04:03 AM	#184
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Were his actions of an evil nature? Undoubtedly. Look up the definition in the dictionary, and tell me you can't apply it to him. Remember the kinslaying, and the oath that he bound his children to. However, I don't think that he is a villain. Not in the true sense of the word. Now Morgoth was a villain. Saruman was a villain. Sauron was a villain. What did they have in common? Domination, and subjucation. Was this Feanors ambition? Not as far as I can see. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-17-2002, 04:09 AM	#185
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	Err- yes. Feanor definatly had an urge to dominate. Remember the urge for power, and the desire for realms in middle earth? It's a likely factor in the burning of the ships. Villain. Evil. Bang the gavel. __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

08-17-2002, 04:11 AM	#186
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	Are those the only criteria for a villian? vil·lain Pronunciation Key (vln) n. A wicked or evil person; a scoundrel. A dramatic or fictional character who is typically at odds with the hero. (also vln, v-ln) Variant of villein. Something said to be the cause of particular trouble or an evil: poverty, the villain in the increase of crime. Obsolete. A peasant regarded as vile and brutish. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

08-17-2002, 04:13 AM	#187
Eruviel Greenleaf Alcoholic Villain-Fancying Elf Pirate Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lyonesse Posts: 4,547	Okay...first definition, perhaps. Second? Definitely not. __________________ Eruviel Greenleaf in a past life. "Whoever has come to understand the world has found only a corpse, and whoever has found a corpse is superior to the world." -The Gospel of Thomas SQUAWK!

08-17-2002, 04:18 AM	#188
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	BoP Nice to see you fired up again. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

08-17-2002, 04:19 AM	#189
Blackheart Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Darkness Posts: 1,211	Hey- isn't Melkor the hero? __________________ I have harnessed the shadows that stride from world to world to sow death and madness... Queer haow a cravin' gits a holt on ye -- As ye love the Almighty, young man, don't tell nobody, but I swar ter Gawd thet picter begun ta make me hungry fer victuals I couldn't raise nor buy -- here, set still, what's ailin' ye? ...

08-17-2002, 04:23 AM	#190
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Right so it's settled then. Feanor. Evil. Eol. Misguided. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-17-2002, 04:26 AM	#192
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	They both would have serverd jail time. Well, maybe not. If they were famous they probably would have gotten off. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

08-17-2002, 04:58 AM	#193
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Well, it's not that simple. Feanor is guilty of an evil action or two -- I don't necessarily think that this makes him an evil person. And as far as I am concerned, comparing Feanor to Eol is like comparing apples and oranges. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

08-17-2002, 04:07 PM	#197
Artanis Greatest Elven woman of Aman Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7 Posts: 4,285	Oh I see. I misunderstood. I was thinking of logical comparativeness, you were thinking of the gravity of their evil actions. But I agree with you and SGH. Feanor was responsible for evil deeds, but ne wasn't an evil person. __________________ --Life is hard, and then we die.

08-17-2002, 04:11 PM	#198
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	ARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

08-17-2002, 04:13 PM	#199
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Yep, they're all coming over to the dark side, A-E. __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords Last edited by BeardofPants : 08-17-2002 at 04:14 PM.

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