Journeys discussion thread

[Willow Oran]

Cool! I like this, it's kind of like the workshop environment in creative writing classes, but with everyone collaborating instead of critiquing.

[Rían]

Originally Posted by Willow Oran

Cool! I like this, it's kind of like the workshop environment in creative writing classes, but with everyone collaborating instead of critiquing.

It's fun working up a post with someone - I always enjoyed it. What I would do is write it, then PM it to the other person with full edit rights, up to and including tossing the whole idea out. But mostly it's usually just some wording changes.

I like when we give encouraging critiques, but not everyone does, so if anyone would rather not hear critiques, let us know. Personally, as long as it's worded constructively, I'm all for hearing comments on my post, both good and bad (sample "bad" would be something like "In the second paragraph, you used a pronoun and it was really unclear if it referred to X or Y" or "I'm not quite getting it - is there some background here that didn't get shared yet?" or things like that). Sample good being like the comments that I've posted about people's posts already. I'd prefer that we keep bad to a minimum, though, since this is NOT a writing class. Whatcha think, ppl?

[Willow Oran]

I like and currently need constructive crit. for my writing. If anything good or bad stands out to you, please do let me know. I'm happy to return the favor if you like, or to keep quiet if you don't.

[Earniel]

I try to re-read as often as I can to prevent mistakes, but clearly, as English is not my mothertongue, I will make them nevertheless. Usually they tend to be literal translations from things that work in Dutch, but not in the same way in English, I call those my 'Dutchisms'. (RÃ*an, the 'when' instead of 'as' is one of those.) So if you spot them, feel free to point those out to me either in PM or here. I don't mind, constructive criticism is good for me.

[Varnafindë]

Originally Posted by RÃ*an

Personally, as long as it's worded constructively, I'm all for hearing comments on my post, both good and bad (sample "bad" would be something like "In the second paragraph, you used a pronoun and it was really unclear if it referred to X or Y" or "I'm not quite getting it - is there some background here that didn't get shared yet?" or things like that). Sample good being like the comments that I've posted about people's posts already. I'd prefer that we keep bad to a minimum, though, since this is NOT a writing class. Whatcha think, ppl?

Detailed constructive criticism like that is good, in my opinion - it teaches the writer something, while a more sweeping generalisation doesn't. Praise is the same, actually - I've really appreciated it when you've given an example of something you liked in my post. It's more helpful than when I tend to just say 'great post!'

(And sometimes awkward wording will be because our native grammar shines through, and you native speakers of English will need to enlighten us.)

I think that if there is need for stronger criticism than this for something, a PM will be better than posting it in the thread. And more likely to come from the threadmaster than from the fellow writers.

[Rían]

Originally Posted by Eärniel

I try to re-read as often as I can to prevent mistakes, but clearly, as English is not my mothertongue, I will make them nevertheless. Usually they tend to be literal translations from things that work in Dutch, but not in the same way in English, I call those my 'Dutchisms'. (RÃ*an, the 'when' instead of 'as' is one of those.)

Yes, I figured it was.

And let me say that I'm really, really impressed with you non-native English speakers!

Originally Posted by Varnafindë

Detailed constructive criticism like that is good, in my opinion - it teaches the writer something, while a more sweeping generalisation doesn't. Praise is the same, actually - I've really appreciated it when you've given an example of something you liked in my post. It's more helpful than when I tend to just say 'great post!'

Yes, it's really helpful when it's specific, isn't it?!

(And sometimes awkward wording will be because our native grammar shines through, and you native speakers of English will need to enlighten us.)

I totally (to use a Californian expression) understand, and as I said before, I think you guys are amazing! We'll let you know, then, but prob. mostly by PM if there's more than one, just because it's more comfy that way, I think.

I think that if there is need for stronger criticism than this for something, a PM will be better than posting it in the thread. And more likely to come from the threadmaster than from the fellow writers.

Sounds fine, but Willow is a native English speaker, too, and a very good writer, so I hope we can all be fine with comments from anyone.

And actually, since Tolkien's fans are so international, maybe you non-native English speakers can help us when we get too English, in a sense - like "you might want to reword that, because a non-native English speaker would have trouble understanding it" or something. Just a thought ...

To repeat once again (I don't think it can be repeated enough) - what I really want here for the main goal is a very enjoyable cooperative writing effort among Tolkien lovers, with a secondary goal of improving our writing skills in a safe and friendly atmosphere. Keep it nice and if a post needs more work than usual, probably just go to PM with the extra stuff. Just put yourself in the other person's shoes.

[Varnafindë]

Originally Posted by RÃ*an

We'll let you know, then, but prob. mostly by PM if there's more than one, just because it's more comfy that way, I think.

Sounds fine, but Willow is a native English speaker, too, and a very good writer, so I hope we can all be fine with comments from anyone.

Oh, for sure! The type of criticism to come from the threadmaster only, would be more of criticizing content, I should think. When there was something really bad that she didn't want in her thread. And I don't think that problem is likely to occur, with the present company

And actually, since Tolkien's fans are so international, maybe you non-native English speakers can help us when we get too English, in a sense - like "you might want to reword that, because a non-native English speaker would have trouble understanding it" or something. Just a thought ...

Hmmm ... possibly ...

what I really want here for the main goal is a very enjoyable cooperative writing effort among Tolkien lovers, with a secondary goal of improving our writing skills in a safe and friendly atmosphere.

Which is a very worthy endeavour. I'm enjoying it already.

[Rían]

Originally Posted by Varnafindë

Oh, for sure! The type of criticism to come from the threadmaster only, would be more of criticizing content, I should think. When there was something really bad that she didn't want in her thread. And I don't think that problem is likely to occur, with the present company

Oh, I see what you mean. Yes, that's a good idea.

Which is a very worthy endeavour. I'm enjoying it already.

Me, too!

[Willow Oran]

Sounds fine, but Willow is a native English speaker, too, and a very good writer, so I hope we can all be fine with comments from anyone.

And actually, since Tolkien's fans are so international, maybe you non-native English speakers can help us when we get too English, in a sense - like "you might want to reword that, because a non-native English speaker would have trouble understanding it" or something. Just a thought ...

To repeat once again (I don't think it can be repeated enough) - what I really want here for the main goal is a very enjoyable cooperative writing effort among Tolkien lovers, with a secondary goal of improving our writing skills in a safe and friendly atmosphere. Keep it nice and if a post needs more work than usual, probably just go to PM with the extra stuff. Just put yourself in the other person's shoes.

Thanks, Rian! Like I said before, I'm happy to offer con. crit. in whatever area you all like. I don't think I'll find much to criticize though. You're all good, canon-conscious writers with years of practice on me.